In search of...

[Wayne/Al]

Well folks, went out today and shot the cylinder bore side of my SXS using the skychief method . Seems to be a little better. The load I used was: 75 gn 2f, 1 card wad ,1 lubed felt wad, 1felt wad, 1 1/8 oz #7 1/2 shot followed by a card wad and a 1/2 inch fiber wad soaked in olive oil . I’m going to post pictures (not very good but the best I could do) The first four pictures are skychief method and the last one is from the chocked barrel just for kicks,card wads only. Was shooting from 25 yds.
Feel free to comment. I have a thick skin.....ha

 

[Skychief]

Thanks Wayne for the report. You mentioned your thick skin...

You might try losing the felt wads under your shot charge.

Good luck, Skychief.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Go up in shot size for the thick skin!

A wee bit more wadding than necessary but heck it's your gun.

 

[3Setters]

Those look like awfully tight patterns to me. If you center an animal at 25 yards you'll be picking out a lot of pellets. Like Brit, I'd either use a larger shot size, a smaller payload, or both.

 

[GREENSWLDE]

If you have to use felt always put a 1/16th card either side of it.Save the powder burning its bottom and shot getting lost in the top.. OLD DOG.

 

[Historian]

If you shoot at a pattern board you will find out that the old “square load” has hole in it at just 20 yards. Hole big enough to fit a dove in or even at times big enough for a pheasant or a quail. I emulate Mike Bellevue on the way I pattern my 20 gauge Fowler. Less powder but more shot. With 80 grains of FFg and 1 3/4 oz shot it will put about 70x80% of the shot in a 30 inch circle with no holes in the pattern at 35 yards. I don’t pattern to see if I hit high or low,,but rather to se how much shot is going where I want and if I have hole in my pattern. Just my 2 cents

Question sir. Do you hunt flying game birds with that heavy load in your 20 ga Fowler? That sounds like a nice turkey load and was curious if you do well with that load on flying targets?

 

[Wayne/Al]

Go up in shot size for the thick skin!

A wee bit more wadding than necessary but heck it's your gun.

I use the 7 1/2 shot when shooting clays. We don’t have many game birds in this part of my state unless you go for Pen raised birds and I don’t care for that. When squirrel hunting I use #5 shot and that is my main hunting interest . Since I’m trying new methods I think I’ll give the finer powder a go and experiment with that as Brit has mentioned.
Thanks to everyone that committed on this matter. I need to come to a conclusion soon. This pattern work ect.can eat up a lot of powder and shot.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I use the 7 1/2 shot when shooting clays. We don’t have many game birds in this part of my state unless you go for Pen raised birds and I don’t care for that. When squirrel hunting I use #5 shot and that is my main hunting interest . Since I’m trying new methods I think I’ll give the finer powder a go and experiment with that as Brit has mentioned.
Thanks to everyone that committed on this matter. I need to come to a conclusion soon. This pattern work ect.can eat up a lot of powder and shot.

I'm a little embarrassed now. I was being cheeky when mentioning thick skin. I was referring to your comment; "Feel free to comment. I have a thick skin.....ha".
I was joking but as normal my joking flopped. My wife often shakes her head at my failed joke attempts .

 

[Robby]

Yeah, I get a lot of that too, here and at home.
Robby

 

[Woody Morgan]

I'm a little embarrassed now. I was being cheeky when mentioning thick skin. I was referring to your comment; "Feel free to comment. I have a thick skin.....ha".
I was joking but as normal my joking flopped. My wife often shakes her head at my failed joke attempts .

I got it.

wm

 

[megasupermagnum]

Maybe it is only the angle of the camera, but it appears both your barrels shoot 6" low. Not the end of the world. I looked back, but can't see what you are hunting for. That choked barrel looks ok for turkey at 25 yards tops. Your cylinder bore patterns are quite good considering that, although they are too sparse what I would ever try on a turkey. On the other hand, they look perfect for small game like rabbits and squirrel. Larger flying birds like quail or pheasant you would be ok. Smaller birds like dove, you would be missing half or more of your shots.

So what are you trying to accomplish? Turkey, I would reserve the right barrel for if they are inside of 15 yards. I would then focus on the left barrel as a turkey barrel. Get a heavier load in there, like 1 1/2 ounce or more, and you can stretch it out to 30 if not 35 yards.

For larger birds, I personally feel #7.5 is too small, but I'm no expert on upland hunting. To be clear, you have not tried the most modern Skycheif load as written, although I'm not sure it will make a huge difference. The Skycheif load is as follows. powder- one 1/8" nitro card - shot- one thin overshot card - one oil soaked 1/2" fiber wad

My favorite way is the V.M. Starr method. 1Fg powder - two 3/32" card wads (I use four .050" cards) - shot - one 3/32" card (I use one .050" card)

I would definitely try 1Fg powder, I always see tighter patterns with it.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I get good patterns from mine using a paper shot cartridge made by rolling three thickness of newspaper around a 5/8 dowel rod, tying one end with kite string, filling with 1&1/4 ounce shot, twist and fold over, tie shut. Load folded end out, I use 75 grain FF,leather wad, then shot cartridge. I find that more than three thickness of newspaper will cause the shot to "clump" and not open up, less than three will rip open before loading.

 

[Snydly]

Question sir. Do you hunt flying game birds with that heavy load in your 20 ga Fowler? That sounds like a nice turkey load and was curious if you do well with that load on flying targets?

Yes I do. For pheasants! Sage chickens, blue and ruffed grouse. No ground slewsing.

 

[Historian]

With 1Fg the velocity will drop rapidly. For squirrels that may not hurt anything or it could cause cripples as one poster mentioned.

 

[megasupermagnum]

With 1Fg the velocity will drop rapidly. For squirrels that may not hurt anything or it could cause cripples as one poster mentioned.

No it wont. Give me a few weeks, and I will prove it with the chronograph. Just moved into my new house yesterday. I really doubt I'm going to see more than 50 fps difference between 1Fg and 2Fg, equal volume.

 

[Historian]

Yes you will. Volume wise if all else stays the same and there are no other load column substitutions you will notice a marked decrease in MV. If all else is the same 75 grains of 2Fg will out perform 1Fg, and 3Fg will out perform both as for as MZ is concerned. I also own a chronograph. Pedersoli barrels were 30 and 28 inches respectfully. Like I said 1Fg is great for shooting heavy loads like turkey loads and in long barrels. Shorter barrels equal incomplete powder burn and heavy fouling residue. Post your results with your individual shot strings and the load column ingredients and the powder types. I used Olde Eynsford and Swiss for my testing in my smooth bores. I have not done any testing with rifles and 1Fg. Best of luck to you. I will dig out my note books and we can compare results. Good shooting.

 

[smo]

Just how fast does a load of shot need too be traveling too kill a Turkey, quail, pheasant or rabbit at 30 yards?
How fast does a round ball need too be traveling too kill a deer in most eastern US hunting situations....? 50 yards or less..

I don’t think anyone here would want too stand in front of a load of 7 1/2’s , 6’s or a round ball from any caliber gun using 50 or more grns of fg, ffg or fffg black powder.

I’m more concerned with pattern density and knowing my gun shoots where I’m aiming...

 

[megasupermagnum]

I know for sure a 900 fps MV of #6 lead will kill turkey at that distance. I know for sure a .735" round ball with a 1000 fps MV will kill whitetail in a dramatic fashion. I think the tin can "test" is a poor one. a 400-500 fps BB gun can penetrate those.

I don't know what the minimum is, but it doesn't take much for turkey. For Pheasant, I couldn't really guess. Using the KYP shotshell ballistics software, if we assume a #5 lead with a MV of 1250 fps is lethal to at least 50 yards, to get the same performance from a #5 lead at 30 yards only requires a 850 fps MV. Most loads in a muzzleloader are going to be faster than that.

 

[Wayne/Al]

I'm a little embarrassed now. I was being cheeky when mentioning thick skin. I was referring to your comment; "Feel free to comment. I have a thick skin.....ha".
I was joking but as normal my joking flopped. My wife often shakes her head at my failed joke attempts .

Ha....Understand,we have something in common. I’ve often heard the comment “ Stale” after telling a really good joke in my opinion...ha

 

[smo]

My point exactly....

Still I would think even a chepo metal can would be harder too penetrate than a turkeys face /neck/ head..

At a Longer distance, larger shot is better for penetration..