Incredible fouling accumulation

[coloradoclyde]

They make cartridge guns for people who don't like to swab..... :haha:

Oh, foolish child. I have a couple of those cartridge Trapdoor thingies - gotta swab them during time at the range, too :rotf:

'Hoist by my own petard'....... :rotf:
:thumbsup:

 

[Hans74]

If you really want to use something to moisten the mouth just grind up a couple green persimmons and swish the juice in your mouth to moisten the patches that will keep your saliva flowing to get the patches damp that will pucker up the groups too.

 

[Dphar]

Its probably powder related. 50 grains is not enough to get accuracy from any 54 I ever owned.

I also use FFF.
Also try a different patch lube.
Some patch lubes will require wiping. If the ball goes down hard accuracy will suffer. Well refined beef tallow makes a good patch lube and loads easy but some barrels don't like a lube this slick. Water based lubes are OK for shooting but not for any activity where the rifle is left loaded for more than a minute or two. I also blow down the barrel between shots. But some people/organizations find this objectionable...

Dan

 

[Dphar]

If a loose fitting jag is used and a large patch it will run over the fouling going down and then bunch up and pull it out on the up stroke.
AS a friend of mine said "you don't have to wipe between shots, but you have to wipe between shots to WIN". Speaking of 60 yard matches using a plank rest.
I like this in 50-54 cals with a large patch. Damp (not dripping) patch both sides, dry patch both sides then load.
Dan https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/121/1/WORM-1817-08-M

 

[Dphar]

Have been out three times now with new-to-me 54 cal flinter. Rifle was built circa 1981. After a few shots with 50 grains 2f Goex the fouling builds up to a degree that it becomes hard to impossible to seat the patched ball against the charge. Rifle groups well for first few shots, then all over- and off- the paper at 100 yards. A damp patch brings up a lot of "sludge", including a good bit of unburnt powder. Actually, it takes three damp patches to get enough gunk out to get the patch down to the breech plug. When cleaning at home it takes several hot water and dish soap soakings and scrubbings to get to a point where the patch comes out sorta clean.

Any thoughts on what could be causing this phenomenon? One thing I have noticed is that the vent looks quite large. Could an oversize vent contribute to poor combustion of the charge?

Any suggested cures or procedures?

Is the bore PITTED? Has it been used with pyrodex. Are you shooting with a patch lube with ANY petroleum in it?
If its pitted or even frosted looking it will foul and be hard to clean. If its EVER been used with pyrodex with a BP "booster" then its surely pitted.
Unburned powder means the bore is FAR too wet. Its just not possible for the powder not to burn unless it has some "issues".

Dan

 

[StewartLeach]

Time to report results! My original problem was a rapid buildup of sludge and unburned powder in a used rifle I bought. 54 caliber, flint, FFg, .530 ball with various thicknesses of patching.

A combination of things now has the rifle shooting very nicely, thank you. The switch to FFFg helped a good bit. Upping the charge to 65 grains and more also helped a bit. Tried lubes from spit to actual factual bear grease, a couple seem better for range shooting than the Moose Milk that has served me well in many rifles from 40 to 58 caliber.

Gave the bore a really good scrubbing with JB compound, then dropped one of those little bore lights inside. Saw no evidence of pitting.

I kept looking at that vent, which was a modified Allen screw. Finally took the rifle to a machinist friend with a full set of number gauge drills. The hole would pass a #48 drill- .076 diameter! Bought a replacement vent from Track, and opened it up to #55 (.052), then #54 (.055).

Now have reliable ignition, very little fouling, and very good accuracy, particularly with the Lehigh Valley lubricant.

Many thanks to those who helped with this project.

 

[SgtErv]

Awesome. Thanks for reporting back. It's always good for building knowledge to be able to see the results

:thumbsup:

 

[BrownBear]

Reaffirms to me that fouling problems are usually the result of multiple factors, and no single adjustment is likely to be a "magic bullet" for fixing it.

Good job on sticking it out and finding the right combo for a fix. :hatsoff:

 

[hanshi]

Agree. There are certainly no magic bullets; except for the one that lands in the "X". :2

 

[Heelerau]

I would reckon 90 grains of fog, and spit patch. When the barrel is cleaned does a tight cleaning patch go in and out smoothly? Just in case there is a little rust in the bore. Ball and patch must be tight to get proper combustion. I should have read your latest post. Sounds like an excellent result good on you , make plenty smoke !!

 

[chawbeef]

You have good spit... :grin:

:haha: :haha: :haha:

 

[vulture]

The only time I have ever used any lube other than spit was back in the day when I used to participate in the muzzle loading dear season here in Utah. When I'm shooting for fun, and back when I competed with our local club I simply stuck a dry patch in my mouth and soaked it up good and then loaded with it, just about every one in that organization did the same, in fact it's where I learned to do so. I could shoot all day and loading difficulty never increased after the first shot, never cleaned our rifles until we got home, in fact cleaning between shots was not allowed in the club. Just my two cents worth.

 

[Billnpatti]

I have just lightly read over the multiplicity of answers to your question. I am sure that my suggestions will, for the most part, just be a rehash of other's answers . First, change to 3f powder and reduce your charge by about 10% to start. 3f is a cleaner burning powder than 2f. Next, if I might borrow from another author "To swab or not to swab. Aye, that is the question. whether 'tis nobler in the minds of men to forgo the swab and use a mallet to seat thy ball on the charge or to take up a swab between shots to keep thy bore relatively clean and consistent from shot to shot and thus endeth the problem."

To borrow further from that same author "Is this a range rod which I see before me, the handle toward my hand? Come, let me clutch thee. I have thee not, and yet I see thee still. Art thou not, fatal vision, sensible to feeling as to sight? or art thou but a range rod of the mind, a false creation, proceeding from the heat-oppressed brain?"

Don't let that range rod be just a vision. Take hold of it and use it between shots to keep the crud from building up in your bore. As you have seen, this crud has a notable effect on your accuracy. Swab it out and be done with it.