Informationeeded

[raymondc]

Hi everybody, I'm a new member here and I was wondering if any of you have any information about this rifle that I've had for 30+ years (origin, value, etc.).

Attached are some photos, and thanks in advance for your help!

Ray

Image - http://share.shutterfly.com/action/welcome?sid=1QZtXDhmxauKg

 

[okawbow]

Belgium musket? Made in the 1950's?

 

[bpd303]

Any proof marks on the barrel? What caliber & rifled or smoothbore?
Stoeger arms possibly.

 

[54ball]

Belgium musket? Made in the 1950's?

It may be a little older, not by much though.
It looks like somebody d-milled it by burning a hole in the breech and wedging the barrel. That's a shame, it might have made a good shooter.

Could this be a G.I. souvenir?

Unless you can prove this is a WWII souvenir with paper work, in d-milled condition, value is very low.

 

[raymondc]

I took a measurement (in cm.), and it converted to .68 or .69 caliber, and the barrel is rifled. There is a proof mark on the buttstock (as pictured in photo #7) which looks like a bell enclosed in a circle, with a 2/3rds dotted circle around it.

Photo #2 shows 2 other markings on the hammer assembly... 849 in front, and another behind, which at first glance looks like a 4 leaf clover, but is probably an "X" through a triangle, and a small tophat on top.

On the octagon part of the barrel it is stamped R. 39. C. 23

On the top of the buttstock there is also some stampings:
R.5
9.C
23

Hopefully that helps, and I'll be happy to take some more photos if you need.

Thanks again for your time, and have a great day : )

Ray

 

[drwatson1873]

The rifle looks more military than civilian. The spring-retained upper band is slightly flared for easing the ramrod return; the triggerguard and buttplate are robust enough for service. The lock is equally robust with a replaceable brass pan. I can't make out the markings on the lockplate clearly but there appears to be a small crest of some sort at the tail. The stamped markings (R9 etc.) suggest inventory/issue marks similar to the old German Imperial system denoting Regiment, Company and Weapon number. Perhaps this is Austrian based on the faint crest at the lock tail and the marking on the upper barrel flat. Just my two cents (pfennigs) worth; who's going to come up with the right answer :idunno: ?

 

[drwatson1873]

As a belated afterthought, may I suggest moving this post to the "Firearms Identification" forum...perhaps it would come to the attention of a few more knowledgeable parties.

 

[Alden]

Looks like an 1849 Lorenz musket or so that was converted to flintlock (which was done)?

 

[drwatson1873]

Good call...here's a link to one on Joe Salter's website:
http://www.milpas.cc/rifles/ZFiles...n l849 Jaeger_files/Austrian 1849 Jaeger.html

I didn't know about the retroconversion to flint for these...one learns something new every day (unless it's a really poor day...).

 

[KABAR2]

This is a prime example of shade tree gunsmithing/"Restoration" at it's worst....
A nice historical gun was butchured to make it into something it wasn't.... at the time it was done it probably was looked at as a cheap wall hanger and someone wanted a flint lock to put over the fire place.....

The lock: the Austrians never used a brass pan set up like this, these are more M1816 stlye parts.... if you look at the frizzen spring it is a repro and does not look as if it is putting tension on the frizzen, the frizzen screw does not come through the front pan supporting arm... it must come from the back side of the lock plate OR the frizzen is just sitting there for looks... the cock screw holding it to the plate looks like a trapdoor hammer screw... most of these parts were available from Dixi Gun works back in the day....

And now the worst of the damage... who ever butchered this ground the bolster off the barrel BUT didn't bother to fill in the remains of the threaded nipple hole (see arrow)

Original percussion hammers are out there for these.... someone who wanted to spend the time and effort building a new bolster could set things right.....