Is investing in a chronograph a good idea?

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I have an Oehler 35P chronograph and have owned it for about 15 years. If velocity is important in you load data then it's a worthwhile purchase.
I have run BP through it, but not with a muzzleloader. My Oehler is accurate enough for both arrows and pellet guns.
These days chromo's have advanced, when I see the newer Magnetspeed and Labradar I get jealous it takes them 5 minutes to set up, it takes me about 20.
 
In my humble opinion, not necessary and even pointless for a BP muzzleloader. Doesn't help you work up your most accurate load and once you've achieved that, you zero for the range you want and find point of impact at different ranges by shooting.

Not like we worry about Ballistic Coefficients, Muzzle Velocity, environmental data and favorite lottery numbers and run all our data through a program to find a theoretical for shooting WAAAY out there before we pull the trigger.
 
Actually, wanting to know the velocity of the projectile you are firing, to enhance shooting performance is nothing new and goes back to the days when the flintlock reigned, long before "modern" guns. Let us not forget that long range shooting in nothing new either and shooting matches in excess of 1000 yards have been going on since well back in the day of muzzleloaders.

The ballistic pendulum was invented in 1742 by a mathematician (who used his militia rifle in the first demonstrations) for measuring the velocity of projectiles to enable more accurate shooting.. It stood supreme in the industry and for shooters for over 200 years, until supplanted by the electronic ballistic chronograph in the 1950s

http://www.bbc.co.uk/ahistoryoftheworld/objects/PN5qFXsKTNWB3Ia_Idfmgg
You can actually build your own, with simple materials, and with some fairly basic mathematical calculations, determine the speed and energy of your projectiles, much the same as with a chronograph and in an HC and PC manner.

 
Mathematics and I just never got along well. That's why I had the jobs I had and why I only wasted two years on college. Math and college went together and I didn't, and don't like either.
 
Actually, wanting to know the velocity of the projectile you are firing, to enhance shooting performance is nothing new and goes back to the days when the flintlock reigned, long before "modern" guns. Let us not forget that long range shooting in nothing new either and shooting matches in excess of 1000 yards have been going on since well back in the day of muzzleloaders.

The ballistic pendulum was invented in 1742 by a mathematician (who used his militia rifle in the first demonstrations) for measuring the velocity of projectiles to enable more accurate shooting.. It stood supreme in the industry and for shooters for over 200 years, until supplanted by the electronic ballistic chronograph in the 1950s

http://www.bbc.co.uk/ahistoryoftheworld/objects/PN5qFXsKTNWB3Ia_Idfmgg
You can actually build your own, with simple materials, and with some fairly basic mathematical calculations, determine the speed and energy of your projectiles, much the same as with a chronograph and in an HC and PC manner.


Yeah, it's all that, BUT - my Chrony folds up into a tiny box that fits behind the seat of my truck.
 
Yeah, it's all that, BUT - my Chrony folds up into a tiny box that fits behind the seat of my truck.

Yep, had my Chrony longer than I can remember. It is always in my range box. Still working, always reliable, and very simple to operate, but for those who shun newfangled devices and ideas, a ballistic pendulum would be historically and period correct for flintlocks to caplocks.
 
While I use a chronograph extensively for precision load development with my unmentionables, I don’t find them necessary to achieve the precision requirements given my distances and applications of use.
 
Might have been fun ta see how the rifles of Boone, Lewis , Davis , Wetsel ,etc, were , compared to todays m/l rifles.
I’ve not read about sporting/civilian guns, but past test with military arms shooting ballistic pendulums or penatration test show the same ball park figures we get today.
 
I have used one for years and find it invaluable. Shot it through several times till I made a deflector plate. Well duh wads and patches will break them. Figure it how not to.

Now use a Radar unit that is not in the way, Much funnier not paying to fix broken stuff but this is a newer method. It is Not PC/HC at all. :ghostly:
 
I also can't call a chronograph a necessary thing and agree with many comments. But I like this thing.
 
It's a tool. I wouldn't mind having one but I would probably use it a few times and then it would sit collecting dust. A bench shooter or someone doing real serious load development would could really use it.
 
I bought an Oehler some 25 years ago or a little more. I've chronographed all manner of rifles and handguns including quite a few muzzleloaders. I do have 4 flintlocks and 1 percussion that I've chronographed a few times. Velocity was not really a concern but uniformity was and is. I will usually, but not always, chronograph the best load for a rifle just to see what the ballistics look like. Right now I can't tell someone what the velocity is of a favorite load except with maybe three rifles. I don't keep detailed records of any session, just a few notes on what the results show.
 
I use a labradar for other guns and tried it when working up a load for a new rifle as I tried different patch styles and thicknesses as well as powder charges. Found great chart of ballistic coefficients for round balls.
Ball SizeBall Weight/GrainsBC - assumes > 1,300 FPS
0.31​
45​
0.0440
0.315​
47​
0.0445
0.321​
50​
0.0456
0.35​
65​
0.0499
0.36​
71​
0.0515
0.375​
80​
0.0535
0.395​
92​
0.0554
0.4​
96​
0.0564
0.433​
122​
0.0612
0.437​
127​
0.0625
0.44​
128​
0.0621
0.443​
131​
0.0627
0.445​
133​
0.0631
0.451​
138​
0.0638
0.454​
141​
0.0643
0.457​
144​
0.0648
0.49​
177​
0.0693
0.498​
180​
0.0682
0.52​
212​
0.0737
0.53​
224​
0.0749
0.535​
231​
0.0759
0.543​
241​
0.0768
0.55​
251​
0.0780
0.56​
260​
0.0779
0.562​
276​
0.0821
0.57​
279​
0.0807
0.575​
286​
0.0813
0.595​
317​
0.0842
0.6​
325​
0.0848
0.61​
342​
0.0864
0.648​
410​
0.0918
0.662​
437​
0.0937
0.678​
496​
0.1014
0.68​
473​
0.0961
0.69​
495​
0.0977
0.715​
550​
0.1011
0.73​
586​
0.1033
0.735​
598​
0.1040
0.76​
661​
0.1076
0.775​
700​
0.1095
0.835​
875​
0.1179
0.919​
1167​
0.1299
1.052​
1750​
0.1486
 
YES! A chronograph is a very valuable tool. It can help accuracy in the sense that it can tell you how uniform the ballistics are. Most loads shoot better with a low ES and SD. Only way to find this out is to shoot the loads over a chronograph.

Well it depends on what you want to do.... ☺

I have a chronograph, and I use it all of the time with my son..., when we are working on modern ammunition intended for shooting at 1000 yards. They are a MUST for that type of shooting. In fact we are going out Columbus Day to do some of that, but that's a discussion for another forum....

As for the muzzleloader, it can answer some questions, but do you "need" to know or are you just curious?

I write that because I harvested many deer before I got curious and tried out my loads with my Chrony. The groups were very good out to 100 yards (I'm normally about half that distance when I harvest a deer), I had learned how to ensure a good, consistent load with my measure, and my patched round ball was firm when loading. No worries.

So..., It might be good to satisfy my curiosity. It would be good to test a batch of powder IF I ordered in bulk, and wanted to double check that everything was consistent.

So in the end if you get a 50 yard grouping like this, just about a 1" group, this is very good for hunting ...,

SIGHT IN TARGET Great.jpg


This will also work at 50 yards, being about a 3" group...,

SIGHT IN TARGET 3 inch group.jpg


THIS is....not really good, needing improvement, in my book ...,

SIGHT IN TARGET 5 inch group.jpg


Now between the first and second targets above, if the first target's load gave you 1100 fps at 50 yards, and the second target gave you 900 fps at 50 yards, the deer would not know the difference. ;) Would increasing the velocity get you from the 2nd target to a target like the first? It might, but you could find out by simply increasing the powder in 10 grain increments and look for positive change, and never use a chronometer.

IF you had either of the first two targets at 50 yards, and then got the third example above when you moved to 100 yards..., you might have a velocity problem, but you also may have other problems. When I've seen folks with accuracy and grouping problems at 100 yards, and it was cured by upping the powder charge (so increasing the muzzle velocity), the bad target looked something like this ...,

SIGHT IN TARGET Velocity .jpg


Note how the left to right spread is only about 1.5 inches, BUT the vertical spread shows a drop of more than 4" compared to the center of the group on the first target. This probably means a velocity situation, while the third target above may be a velocity problem but also likely other problems too. I was able to correct myself when I got a target like the fourth one, by not only increasing the load about 10 grains, but also gently tapping the side of the powder measure to settle the charge, and then topping it off. I increased the charge AND learned how to pour a more consistent charge. Again no chronograph needed.

So unless you're dedicated to some long range shooting, or need it for a different shooting discipline, I'd find somebody who will allow you to chronograph your loads with his machine. I'd save my money and use it on powder and lead and practice.

LD
 
I find a chronograph very helpful when working up loads for my unmentionables. When an increase in powder charge shows very little or no increase in velocity it tells me I am near or at max charge for that load regardless what the reloading "data" says. I also notice that the loads with the lowest extreme spread usually shoot the smallest groups. So it's more than just knowing the velocity. However, I don't find that this translates to BP muzzleloaders all that much. My guess is that is because there are more chances for inconsistencies in the loading process & components. The ranges which BP ML's are shot kinda negates the need to know your exact velocity, as well. Just my two cents!
 
I have a chronograph, and I use it all of the time with my son..., when we are working on modern ammunition intended for shooting at 1000 yards. They are a MUST for that type of shooting. In fact we are going out Columbus Day to do some of that, but that's a discussion for another forum....
I find a chronograph very helpful when working up loads for my unmentionables.
 

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