Kibler Brown Bess?

[sussexmuzllodr]

splitting hairs ....again....

 

[FlinterNick]

For crying out loud that's not what I said or meant.


Nope, wait. After a whole 2 seconds of irrational thought. The only right answer is my answer anything else is wrong. That is a joke btw.

It’s difficult to understand what exactly you’re attempting to state, respectfully.

If it’s that there are rude people on this forum, that’s not a surprise. Best to be as concise as possible on here.

 

[Leatherbark]

For health and vitality, a real man will carry a Bess or Charleville in the woods instead of a slim fowler. I carry and shoot a Pedersoli 1777 Revolutionnaire and my arms are starting to look like in between Popeye's or some kind of an Austrian bodybuilder.

Bob

 

[Indy Durtdigger]

It’s difficult to understand what exactly you’re attempting to state, respectfully.

If it’s that there are rude people on this forum, that’s not a surprise. Best to be as concise as possible on here.

I honestly thought I did in the second short paragraph. Nothing wrong with saying no. Only intent was pointing out that I expected there to be some who would for the sole reason it's a kibler and no other.
I don't understand why he gets the tude from guys on this one so much let alone why he keeps coming back for more.

 

[springfield art]

It says on his profile that he’s 49 but it’s hard to believe. He looks maybe 40 at the very oldest!

If you live in the past, time moves slower!

 

[ronaldrothb49]

This pole was a direct response to Kibler asking that same question in another thread. The open-ended pole that didn't specify that left it open to folks that wouldn't be buying a Bess to begin with and I don't think that was the intent. However, narrowing the pole too much would skew it the other way.

It would appear Mr. Kibler is trying to do some market research to find out if it is worth his time and money to offer this product. When he purchases expensive machines I'm sure he wants them running near capacity otherwise he isn't going to be in business for long.
In my other hobby over the past year I have gotten several questionnaire about would I consider purchasing a certain product in the future. When I answer NO I get the response that I don't qualify for their survey. Why bother to ask for your potential customers opinions if all you want to hear is yes.

 

[springfield art]

For health and vitality, a real man will carry a Bess or Charleville in the woods instead of a slim fowler. I carry and shoot a Pedersoli 1777 Revolutionnaire and my arms are starting to look like in between Popeye's or some kind of an Austrian bodybuilder.

Bob

I dunno. Back in the day, guys carried hunting arms and did OK. The military arms were pretty much limited to the military. Although I do respect your experience! I love Besses and Charlevilles, too!

 

[springfield art]

It would appear Mr. Kibler is trying to do some market research to find out if it is worth his time and money to offer this product. When he purchases expensive machines I'm sure he wants them running near capacity otherwise he isn't going to be in business for long.
In my other hobby over the past year I have gotten several questionnaire about would I consider purchasing a certain product in the future. When I answer NO I get the response that I don't qualify for their survey. Why bother to ask for your potential customers opinions if all you want to hear is yes.

I do believe the potential customer base amongst us muzzle-loaders is much different that the usual mass marketing population consuming laundry soap! He's a genius in that he's using cutting-edge tech CNC/computers to make a 18th C. product.

 

[Clark Badgett]

I dunno. Back in the day, guys carried hunting arms and did OK. The military arms were pretty much limited to the military. Although I do respect your experience! I love Besses and Charlevilles, too!

Oh contraire. Every surplus musket put to the market sold. Even well into the cartridge era. They were very affordable guns to those of lesser means.

 

[longcruise]

They were very affordable guns to those of lesser means.

Or even those who had only occasional, or even less, need for a firearm. Why waste money on something that you might want or need but that is relatively unimportant in the big picture.

 

[springfield art]

Many of them were cut down for easier handling.

 

[BEP]

Although I admire Jim's current offerings I really don't have a hankering to own one. But if he offered a Bess - anything but a 3rd model - I'd be on board. For sure.

 

[oreclan]

That question as to which Model to offer would be a contentious point; re-enactors doing various periods would want their favorite Model!! Maybe choosing a variant that covers the most "mileage" would have to suffice.

The long land pattern would cover the 1750s through the end of the century.

 

[Clark Badgett]

The long land pattern would cover the 1750s through the end of the century.

Which long land? There were 4 versions and 1 transition.

 

[Coinneach]

Because guns are fun? More guns are more fun.

My Grandad told me "Jesus loves Flintlock ML collectors", and I believed him.

 

[Coinneach]

I'll put a vote in for the British Officer's Fusil with a bayonet and a matching pistol.

Of course an actual purchase would be way down the list after the yet to be acquired Fowler.

Although I already have one from North Star years ago, I have to agree that a Kibler produced one would have to be a very desirable item.
IMO a Bess produced by Kibler may have a limited patronage what with all the Indian made ones available at more affordable prices; thats not meant to be a slight against the top quality ML's Jim K produces.

 

[Coinneach]

For health and vitality, a real man will carry a Bess or Charleville in the woods instead of a slim fowler. I carry and shoot a Pedersoli 1777 Revolutionnaire and my arms are starting to look like in between Popeye's or some kind of an Austrian bodybuilder.

Bob

Who needs a Gym ?

 

[Bucolic Buffalo]

I voted no. I admit I really do not know a lot about the Brown Bess. I know there were a number of variants. I know they were in use by the British for over a century. They look heavy. I do not see a gracefulness in their design. Clunky is as good a word as any. I'd rather build more of what Jim is already offering.

 

[FlinterNick]

I voted no. I admit I really do not know a lot about the Brown Bess. I know there were a number of variants. I know they were in use by the British for over a century. They look heavy. I do not see a gracefulness in their design. Clunky is as good a word as any. I'd rather build more of what Jim is already offering.

They way i understood @Jim Kibler the query he made about the brown Bess would be promotional for the 250th, i could be wrong.

But yes, generally a brown Bess clunky and is not a wise choice for hunting or much other than reenactment. The third model is by far the best choice for game.

 

[Cubreac]

From an eye witness:
"William Lloyd, a New Jersey militiaman, recounted the aftermath of a skirmish near Freehold in 1778:'The enemy then retreating precipitately, throwing away many of their guns. I was, I believe, the foremost in the following, got as many of their guns as I could conveniently manage on my horse, with their bayonets fixed upon them. Gave them to the soldiers as they stood in rank. They threw away their French pieces, preferring the British."
p. 14, Continental Versus Redcoat, David Bonk, Osprey, 2014, ISBN 9781472806482

Considering the market for a quality Brown Bess here and in Canada, the excellence of Kibler's products, and the lack of excellence in their competition, it's seems a good business move to bring out a Brown Bess kit. Demand for a Bess might even surpass demand for a Hawken kit. A historical Brown Bess might not be as pretty, but the demand is probably greater.