Kibler colonial

[IanH]

I would need an X-ray.

My recommendation for a single rod in the wrist is it is a lot harder to screw up than drilling multiple smaller holes that deep and at an awkward angle, plus it is all that is necessary there. The photo of the duffel cut repair above shows an excellent application for multiple rods.

Nobody's said it but please dowel the toe also, best way to do that is hide it under the toe plate. You can drill a deep, 1/8" hole straight up the middle of the butt to make a vent for the epoxy and hide it with the butt plate.

 

[¡Señor.Casualidad!]

I've bought enough of those B-grade kits to know or at least have some faith that if they thought it was structurally unsound, they wouldn't have sold it. Any faults and sometimes repairs with the wood in those discounted kits are listed and usually shown in the pic when listed.

That was my thought. Here is a screenshot from the listing. Has the regular "we're cleaning out the shop" speel with the words "walnut stock with less than ideal grain flow" I've sent them an email to ask his advice, but I'm getting that darn gun regardless of what anyone says! I love that dark mineral kind of contrast that walnut stock has!

 

[Indy Durtdigger]

That was my thought. Here is a screenshot from the listing. Has the regular "we're cleaning out the shop" speel with the words "walnut stock with less than ideal grain flow" I've sent them an email to ask his advice, but I'm getting that darn gun regardless of what anyone says! I love that dark mineral kind of contrast that walnut stock has!

He's active on the forum and may respond if he sees this, emailing them was a good call and you may actually call if they don't respond to an email soon enough. That is a nice-looking stock, and it wouldn't be hard to put a single rod in the wrist for some insurance. You may have that kit by the coming weekend if you're lucky, they usually ship in a few days if you got to pick caliber, next day if it's already boxed.

 

[¡Señor.Casualidad!]

He's active on the forum and may respond if he sees this, emailing them was a good call and you may actually call if they don't respond to an email soon enough. That is a nice-looking stock, and it wouldn't be hard to put a single rod in the wrist for some insurance. You may have that kit by the coming weekend if you're lucky, they usually ship in a few days if you got to pick caliber, next day if it's already box

He's active on the forum and may respond if he sees this, emailing them was a good call and you may actually call if they don't respond to an email soon enough. That is a nice-looking stock, and it wouldn't be hard to put a single rod in the wrist for some insurance. You may have that kit by the coming weekend if you're lucky, they usually ship in a few days if you got to pick caliber, next day if it's already boxed.

This weekend you say?

 

[¡Señor.Casualidad!]

I would need an X-ray.

My recommendation for a single rod in the wrist is it is a lot harder to screw up than drilling multiple smaller holes that deep and at an awkward angle, plus it is all that is necessary there. The photo of the duffel cut repair above shows an excellent application for multiple rods.

Nobody's said it but please dowel the toe also, best way to do that is hide it under the toe plate. You can drill a deep, 1/8" hole straight up the middle of the butt to make a vent for the epoxy and hide it with the butt plate.

Red, blue, or black for the dowel or somewhere else?

 

[Indy Durtdigger]

Maybe. The last 2 of those I ordered in the last few months I had by weeks end.

To answer your question, I've been using Minwax Antique Oil Finish on my last few kits. It's a BLO product and easy to use. First coat is heavy to soak in for 10 min or so then wipe off. Subsequent coats are light hand rubbed every 24 hours until desired sheen is achieved. Currently finishing up an SMR with water staining so probably going to use WATCO dark walnut Danish oil on it.

 

[Indy Durtdigger]

IanH knows what he's talking about and when he offers up advice it's solid. Just sayin.

 

[IanH]

Red, blue, or black for the dowel or somewhere else?

Blue if you don't make a toe plate. If you do make a toe plate, move it slightly forward so you drill the hole in front of the butt plate and cover it with the toe plate. I would use a 3/8" birch dowel sanded down for a fall-back-out fit and Titebond II wood glue (blue bottle) there, and cross-drill a small hole (red line but higher) as a vent so you get all the air out and glue all the way to the bottom of the hole with no dry spots or air pockets around the dowel. Wood for the toe reinforcement because you will be putting screws into that area and it will be plenty strong to reinforce the area without extra weight or fuss. The wrist needs stiff steel to prevent the flex during ramming balls, recoil, and accidental drops from starting cracks from opening up in the upper wrist behind the tang area which eventually grow and allow a sudden total failure.

 

[deerstalkert]

I strengthened the wrist on an unmentionable magnum stock once by drilling a 1/4 inch channel from the rear of the action inlet down to just behind the pistol grip. being i needed that rifle for a once in a life time hunt and didn't have a steel rod handy I heated the epoxy to a watery consistency, poured the drill channel full. worked good. years later i broke the stock in a horse wreak. i sectioned the area i epoxied and the hot epoxy had migrated fairly deep into the wood surrounding the hole i had drilled.
that stock was mesquite and was so pretty i made hand gun grips out of the thing.

 

[IanH]

I've bought enough of those B-grade kits to know or at least have some faith that if they thought it was structurally unsound, they wouldn't have sold it. Any faults and sometimes repairs with the wood in those discounted kits are listed and usually shown in the pic when listed.

I would certainly agree Jim won't sell trash and under normal use that stock should last forever just as it is....but. We've all set one down harder on the heel than we intended a time or two, and this one probably won't shrug that off like one with better grain direction. It's cheap insurance to reinforce it before that happens on a hunt or when ramming that last shot down a dirty barrel in a hurry on a woodswalk.

 

[IanH]

Maybe. The last 2 of those I ordered in the last few months I had by weeks end.

To answer your question, I've been using Minwax Antique Oil Finish on my last few kits. It's a BLO product and easy to use. First coat is heavy to soak in for 10 min or so then wipe off. Subsequent coats are light hand rubbed every 24 hours until desired sheen is achieved. Currently finishing up an SMR with water staining so probably going to use WATCO dark walnut Danish oil on it.

I did my cherry woodsrunner with Minwax. The deciding factor for me was letting a quarter-sized puddle dry on a piece of glass. It actually dried in a few days as thick as it was, and more importantly wrinkled up showing proper expansion as a result of actual polymerization even though the oil is thinned with solvents, and it was quite tough and hard so has a good resin content. It doesn't build fast which is great for hand-rubbing, the stock drinks up that first coat really well, and it can be very lightly sanded after a couple of days if there are any rough spots. In a way it acts like sanding sealer.

Normally I use a home-made boiled linseed oil varnish using a quality linseed base and processing it with heat and lime, adding natural driers and resins if I want shiny, no resins if I want an oil finish. With my WR I was in a hurry and that Minwax stuff did the trick quite nicely. I suspect it would be great for sealing and rigidizing detailed carving work because it really penetrates the wood surface and gets nice and hard without shrinking like polyurethanes do.

 

[DCAN]

That was my thought. Here is a screenshot from the listing. Has the regular "we're cleaning out the shop" speel with the words "walnut stock with less than ideal grain flow" I've sent them an email to ask his advice, but I'm getting that darn gun regardless of what anyone says! I love that dark mineral kind of contrast that walnut stock has!

I was one day away from getting this one but ya beat me to it. I wouldn't be worrying too much. My vote is for the repair "IanH" suggests. Kibler's customer service is second to none. If there is a problem, I have no doubt they will take care of you.

 

[Dale Lilly]

very nice looking piece of wood.
first thing i would do is drill from the breach down through the wrist and epoxy a steel rod in place.
that grain just screams "broken wrist". action now will save you grief later.
just my 2 cents

I agree with Deerstalker. Preventive action. Edit: Oh! I happen to love that 'less than desirable' walnut stock. Dale

 

[¡Señor.Casualidad!]

I was one day away from getting this one but ya beat me to it. I wouldn't be worrying too much. My vote is for the repair "IanH" suggests. Kibler's customer service is second to none. If there is a problem, I have no doubt they will take care of you.

Sorry not sorry DCAN
In all seriousness I hope you get yours soon!

 

[¡Señor.Casualidad!]

I did my cherry woodsrunner with Minwax. The deciding factor for me was letting a quarter-sized puddle dry on a piece of glass. It actually dried in a few days as thick as it was, and more importantly wrinkled up showing proper expansion as a result of actual polymerization even though the oil is thinned with solvents, and it was quite tough and hard so has a good resin content. It doesn't build fast which is great for hand-rubbing, the stock drinks up that first coat really well, and it can be very lightly sanded after a couple of days if there are any rough spots. In a way it acts like sanding sealer.

Normally I use a home-made boiled linseed oil varnish using a quality linseed base and processing it with heat and lime, adding natural driers and resins if I want shiny, no resins if I want an oil finish. With my WR I was in a hurry and that Minwax stuff did the trick quite nicely. I suspect it would be great for sealing and rigidizing detailed carving work because it really penetrates the wood surface and gets nice and hard without shrinking like polyurethanes do.

How do you or do you even bother filling the grain? From the pics of my stock I can see the porous nature of the wood. If for example you were going to finish with minwax how would you go about filling the grain?

 

[Clark Badgett]

How do you or do you even bother filling the grain? From the pics of my stock I can see the porous nature of the wood. If for example you were going to finish with minwax how would you go about filling the grain?

I have never bothered. I just slather on 100% pure tung oil, let it stand a few hours and then rubbed all the excess off. A day or two later I hand rub a second coat (repeat this as often as you like). I don’t get too finicky about finishes, they all mellow with time and usage.

 

[IanH]

How do you or do you even bother filling the grain? From the pics of my stock I can see the porous nature of the wood. If for example you were going to finish with minwax how would you go about filling the grain?

That's easy on walnut. Work in small sections, put finish on and lightly work it in wet-or-dry paper of about 320 grit, always sanding with the grain. The sanding dust and finish will make a slurry which you rub into the wood hard with your bare hands (thumbs, fingertips, palms) until it's almost dry. Move to another section and repeat. Rubbing fhe slurry across the grain helps pack it into the lengthwise pores. The sanding dust will fill the grain nicely and after the first coat is dry just hand-rub additional coats until the sheen is how you like it. If it didn't fill all the grain areas to your liking after the first slurry sand, repeat it very lightly.

People say don't use emery paper because it leaves black grit...but this is walnut, not a blonde-finished sugar maple. Most aluminum oxide or garnet paper adhesive lets go when soaked in solvents.

 

[LongWalker]

Last spring, when the wrist on my Colonial cracked for the third time (before it was even finished), I went ahead and slotted the wrist from the underside (from about the nose of the stock to almost the front end of the lock). I glued a piece of straight-grained hard maple in the stock, then re-inlet everything, re-drilled the ramrod hole, and finished the rifle. After somewhere north of 2,500 shots there have been no further problems.

I thought about "rodding the stock" (the procedure to reinforce the wrist that has been discussed here) but was more comfortable with the wood splint. I've usually had better luck reinforcing repairs with wood than with metal.

 

[FlinterNick]

Well I couldn't help it! Just ordered my first kibler!!! jim had a clearance .58 cal rifled colonial kit in walnut with "less than ideal grain flow" for $245 less than the regular walnut price, even with the thick wrist on the colonial I am slightly concerned about the strength. Now if yall would chime in with any and all opinions/advice/pictures for finishing one of his kits that would be appreciated!

Personally i woudlnt do anything to the wrist unless the opportunity calls or requires you to.

There are many things you can do, cutting the wrist and inserting drill rods i woudln’t do.

You can chisel or mill out the trigger guard inlet 7 to 10 times its regular depth (almost hollowed out) and deep epoxy with metal filled epoxy (smoothon has a nice formula) it, I’ve done this on guns with broken wrists, it conceals the damage while reinforcing the wrist.

But I’ve never done it as a preventative measure, only if there is a break and the customer wishes to not have a visible repair.

i would finish the rifle with a heavy duty varnish that penetrates deep into the wood, you could even rub in a very thin super glue, pen makers practice this as finishing method. You’d have to get a good amount of the glue into the stock, once its dry, work t back with 180 -220 paper and water as a lubrcant, the finish will appear white, then rub smal drops of linseed oil for the look of an oil finish the you now have a durable almost case hardened like wood finish.

 

[FlinterNick]

I’m more than a little surprised that Kibler would sell a kit with a stock everyone seems to think is almost guaranteed to break, even at a discount. Being an absolute rookie at finishing these kits I would be irate if I bought that and the stock did break.

I woudln't’ say it’s guaranteed to break. There are plenty of original guns its poor grain runout that never have never been broken.

The final finishing has much to do with the durability of the stock.