Late English Ordnance Pattern matchlock

[Flintandsmoke]

Would a matchlock like this have even seen use in the colonies?

 

[TobJohn]

Never say never, but towards the later part of the 17th century, both Virginia and Plymouth/New England heavily encouraged the use of fire locks over matchlocks, with Plymouth even banning matchlocks in their militia.

 

[Flintandsmoke]

Never say never, but towards the later part of the 17th century, both Virginia and Plymouth/New England heavily encouraged the use of fire locks over matchlocks, with Plymouth even banning matchlocks in their militia.

That’s what im wondering, im up in New England, so im questioning if any surplus ones MIGHT have made their way over or if the call
Of the day would have been the newer English locks

 

[Sam squanch]

If they came over the water, I’m sure they were converted to a flintlock.

 

[Flintandsmoke]

If they came over the water, I’m sure they were converted to a flintlock.

I actually was considering having one converted, but was told it would be cost prohibitive

 

[TobJohn]

Outside of the previously shared information, this is a bit after my area of knowledge, but I wonder if any proper English military units served in North America, pre 1700? My understanding of the conflicts against the French and the natives were that they were fought by the colonies, but if English military units served, that could be a good place to look. The nine years war would be the closest I can think of, but that would probably be after the English dropped the matchlock.

 

[BillinOregon]

Is this the one we are discussing?
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/matchlocks/(571).htm
This one looks quite handy, if earlier.

 

[TobJohn]

I was assuming this type:

https://royalarmouries.org/collection/object/object-28795
They match this TRS Kit:
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/matchlocks/(571).htm

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

I was assuming this type:
View attachment 353972https://royalarmouries.org/collection/object/object-28795
They match this TRS Kit:
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/matchlocks/(571).htm

Yes, this is the one being discussed.

 

[rich pierce]

I don’t have the knowledge to weigh in on the subject of match lock use in militias, but in Grinslade’s book on flintlock fowlers he states that several of the earliest fowlers highlighted there used old barrels originally from match locks. This indicates that matchlocks were in use by somebody.

 

[TobJohn]

I don’t have the knowledge to weigh in on the subject of match lock use in militias, but in Grinslade’s book on flintlock fowlers he states that several of the earliest fowlers highlighted there used old barrels originally from match locks. This indicates that matchlocks were in use by somebody.

The earlier style (like Bill posted) were certainly used during the earlier part of colonization, so some were probably refurbished. I also assume guns from the home country were refurbished and sold to the colonies with new fire locks.

The Plymouth museum even claims an unusual Italian matchlock musket in their collection is from the first colonists.

 

[Flintandsmoke]

Yes, this is the one being discussed.

62smoothie is correct

 

[Sam squanch]

Olsen Johnson is right about 62 Smoothie being right!

 

[Canute Rex]

As far as I know there were some matchlocks being used in the first third of the 1600s in the colonies, but as stated by others, these were found to be inadequate. I have seen a photo of a matchlock, much in the same style as the one TobJohn showed, from a Canadian museum. Apparently it was issued to garrison troops as late as 1660. I guess if you were at the end of the French supply chain and marching around the battlements you got whatever was left over.

 

[Artificer]

Would a matchlock like this have even seen use in the colonies?

I have some info on this:

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...rplus-in-the-18th-century.159037/post-2273203

and this I copied from part of an earlier post of mine:

• Gun building in Williamsburg, VA began with John Brush who arrived from London in 1717. He was a master in the Gun Makers’ Guild in England, before he was induced to come over and become the Master Armorer at the then pretty new Magazine (built in 1715) to store all the arms Virginia had recently acquired. (I have often wondered what the heck they offered a Master Gunsmith from London to give up a lucrative trade in "Civilized London" and come to Virginia? Grin.)
  
  John was a no doubt an accomplished gunsmith as there is a flintlock screw barrel pistol he built here, that is the only arm still extant attributable to him. We know he made fowlers here as well, but no rifles in case some are wondering. John did not live long here, though, as he passed in 1726.
  
  Two computers ago, I had the text from one of his advertisements where he offered (and I'm paraphrasing) to convert matchlocks, dog locks and other arms to the latest fashion - meaning a true flintlock. He would not have advertised the services for guns with locks that were no longer in use or at least people still had them.
• 
  
• Gus

 

[Artificer]

Would a matchlock like this have even seen use in the colonies?

Sorry, I meant to add this new text in my reply above, but hit the post reply too early.

Since I posted those posts years ago, a little more info has become available.

The arms sent from the Tower to Virginia in the 1690's were almost certainly mostly, if not all military match lock arms, though no pattern types have yet come to light. This because the Tower only dealt in military arms and always issued the oldest muskets they had first and yes, even to the Regular British Infantry. Since the colonies had no where near the priority of Regular British Army Regiments, we can be almost positive the arms they sent (and the civilians here in VA did not want to buy) were older pattern, match lock Infantry Muskets.

Gus

 

[Flintandsmoke]

Sorry, I meant to add this new text in my reply above, but hit the post reply too early.

Since I posted those posts years ago, a little more info has become available.

The arms sent from the Tower to Virginia in the 1690's were almost certainly mostly, if not all military match lock arms, though no pattern types have yet come to light. This because the Tower only dealt in military arms and always issued the oldest muskets they had first and yes, even to the Regular British Infantry. Since the colonies had no where near the priority of Regular British Army Regiments, we can be almost positive the arms they sent (and the civilians here in VA did not want to buy) were older pattern, match lock Infantry Muskets.

Gus

Thank you Gus, i knew the English sent over old arms i just didnt know which

 

[Artificer]

Thank you Gus, i knew the English sent over old arms i just didnt know which

You are most welcome.

Gus

 

[Flintandsmoke]

You are most welcome.

Gus

I always have an appreciation for the older firearms.

 

[Colonial Boy]

I’d believe that obsolete barrels and other bits were also shipped to the colonies or imported by gunmakers.
I know that door locks from the Georgian era were imported into NSW during the reign of Queen Victoria.
I once owned a building that was built in 1872 and all the doors [6] were fitted with George IV era locks