loadin brown bess

[dweeble]

Been shootin my Brown Bess alot. And when we load paper cartidges with a .175 ball. We have to swab the bore and lube it about every two shots or the loads wont go down. I know it is fowlin, but thats only a couple of shots, what a pain. Any advice? When we load it like ashotgun we dont have any problems. But those lead balls with that paper get stuck.

Thanks for any advice
dweeble

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

Been shootin my Brown Bess alot. And when we load paper cartidges with a .175 ball. We have to swab the bore and lube it about every two shots or the loads wont go down. I know it is fowlin, but thats only a couple of shots, what a pain. Any advice? When we load it like ashotgun we dont have any problems. But those lead balls with that paper get stuck.

Thanks for any advice
dweeble

By .175 ball I assume that you mean .715? If so, that would be your problem, the ball is too large to use with cartridge paper wrapped around it. Keep in mind that British cartridges were loaded with .68 balls, allowing more windage so paper could be left around the ball to speed up the loading process. Once the ball became tight, the ball could be removed from the paper and and the paper pushed in after the ball was in the bore. With the oversize ball you are using, the later would be your best bet for dealing with fouling build up.

 

[dweeble]

yes .715 is what i meant. eyes playin tricks on me lol

 

[mike alexandre]

Are you putting any lube on the paper.

 

[Swampman]

Why are you using paper cartidges? You'll never get good accuracy with them. A snugly patched round ball lubed with olive oil, will shoot like a rifle.

 

[TN.Frank]

Why are you using paper cartidges? You'll never get good accuracy with them. A snugly patched round ball lubed with olive oil, will shoot like a rifle.

I agree, paper ctgs. with an undersize ball are fine if you're in a war but for huntin' and plinkin' a patched round ball will shoot much better. That's what I'll use when I get my smoothie since I plan on hunting with it.

 

[riarcher]

http://ccv.northwestcompany.com/bsa.htm

I'm making them like the above tied version with some changes.
For paper I'm using the brown paper towels that come on a roll with the bumps on them like you'd find in a public rest room.
For my .715 ball in the .751 bore I'll cut the towel into 4 7/8" lengths. Fold over 2" on a short side. set the ball on a 3/4 dowel 5/8-3/4" in from folded edge to end of ball. Roll and tie as per above.
This will give about 1/2" of toweling over the ball. Flatten down against ball loosly and fold in towards the center the part that sticks past the ball dia.
Melt your 2 pts OL to 1 pt BW mix and dip only to where the ball / stick joint is just above the ball. Finger form towel end for neatness(?). When cool quickly redip to build up more lube without melting previous layer (chilling in refer helps).
I use unraveled Jute string for tying.
Before build up of lube my carts are around .740 diameter. After lubing, .78/.81.
When loading you'll shave or swedge some lubing and if you pull the load you'll see the paper is making fair contact w/ bore (Think the lube is swelling up the towel).
All that extra paper you added overtop the ball is acting (sorta) like a wad when seated and seems to be helping to seal around the ball as whitnessed by the plugs found on the ground after firing.
I've fired a 20 round string without having trouble loading. The generouse lube is keeping the fouling soft and maybe contributing to sealing when the new load is driven home.

Admittedly, this is still in the development stages. I've not gotten to the point of a "good powder load" at this point. Going one step at a time, first something that loaded, then something that held up to 120 gr. 2Fg.
The Jute is like a good bore scrubber ahead of the ball, but, it maybe deleted behind the ball for something that'll fall apart more easily (cotton thread?).
Besides the powder charge, I'm not set on if and how much towel I may leave over the ball when loading yet either.
Well, that's where I'm at on the subject.
Hope something in here gives you some ideas to combat your fouling. :hatsoff:

 

[dweeble]

I will show husband what you all have to say. It is his gun. I am the one that knows how work the computer. lol Dont get me wrong I like to shoot the Bess all so. Even if the dang thing is bigger than me. lol So thank you for all the help.

dweeble :hatsoff:

 

[marmot]

The paper used can make a big difference in both loading and accuracy - my brother and I both use newsprint to roll tubes that are almost a snug fit in the bore ( with .68 balls), then dip the front (ball) half of the cartridge in beeswax, coating it fairly heavily. Between the beeswax and compressability of the newsprint we can fire 10-15 rds (sometimes more, depending on the weather) before fouling becomes an issue, and hold groups equivalent to patched RBs out to 50 yards. (In competition the patched RBs might show a slight edge in scoring, but we really haven't found enough difference to do away with the paper cartridges; others' results are probably different.) Part of the trick is pouring the powder down, then tearing the cartridge again, right at the ball, and loading the closed end of the paper down, forming a sort of cup for the ball - creating a paper-patched bullet.

Sure, making up cartridges like this probably takes longer overall than patching at the muzzle, but I can roll them at home at night, and have plenty to go shoot on the next outing. Besides, patched roundballs and loose powder don't ever seem to work just right in the cartidge box! :grin:

M

 

[steve stanley]

Personal thing here....If you want it to shoot like a rifle......get a rifle!..I got a Bess because that's what I wanted to shoot..including the little Darling's faults..It's a military weapon designed for speed/ease of use..not Accuracy....just my opinion.
Steve

 

[riarcher]

Personal thing here....If you want it to shoot like a rifle......get a rifle!..Steve

Steve,
Don't think any of us are trying to make it shoot like a rifle.
Making a military type cart. for speed AND some degree of accuacy isn't unheard of. U.S. military has been at it a couple of years now,,,, and somehow I doubt it's being a novel idea.
Making your load at home in comfort,,, why not try and tweek a bit more cloverleaf from her at 200 yds.? :shocked2:
Everyone finds their "fun" from a different game. :winking:

 

[steve stanley]

Ok...could have phrased it better..I meant the Bess (like other military smoothbores) was mainly used with cartridges as they are the best option for military volley[url] fire...within[/url] that ,any improvement in accuracy is great...but when you talk about alternative loads/loading purely to improve accuracy you're using it for something it wasn't designed for...if our laws changed so I could get a period rifle(dream on..) I'd take great pleasure in "tweaking" for accuracy...horses for courses & no disparagement intended.
Steve

 

[riarcher]

None taken. No problem. :grin:
Basicly though, it's a tube made to fire a projectile. Bess was for volley you're right. However, many tubes were designed to hit something with a greater degree of accuacy than the military used the Bess for (before rifling).
One could argue that the Longbow was designed for volly originally,,, but many found additional accuacy by tweeking their arrows, form, etc. for instance Howard Hill and others could/can shoot aspirins out of the air with that great volleying piece. So whats wrong with trying to shoot a ten ring group at 100 yards with a musket? Gotta admitt, there is a challenge there. :grin:
It's all for fun (no cash awards :cursing: )
The way I shoot,,,, I couldn't hit an outhouse if I was sitting inside! :winking:

 

[steve stanley]

Unti I get some new glasses,I probably couldn't even SEE said outhouse........
Steve

 

[Swampman]

The Japanese and Italian Brown Bess replicas are capable of remarkable accuracy. I've seen my friend hit an upper torso sized steel plate at 200+ yards. Since we hunt with them, I see nothing wrong with using a patched ball.

 

[TN.Frank]

The Japanese and Italian Brown Bess replicas are capable of remarkable accuracy. I've seen my friend hit an upper torso sized steel plate at 200+ yards. Since we hunt with them, I see nothing wrong with using a patched ball.

I think a lot of the stories about smooth bore muskets being inaccurate stems from the undersize ball that was used in paper ctgs. for fast loading during war time. In a hunting enviroment where you can take the time to load a proper size ball and patch you should be as accurate as any modern smooth bore shotgun shooting a slug. Paper plate accuracy should be possible at 75 yrds. with the right load, if not even better. JMHO,YMMV.

 

[J.D.]

Mark,
Do you know what powder charge you friend shoots in his bess for those 200 yard shots, and about how much hold over he takes?

I can consistently hit an 18 dia gong at 100 yards with mine, but have not shot at longer ranges.
thanks,
J.D.

 

[Swampman]

I believe he was using 90 grains of 3f. He passed away recently.