Loading a 36 caliber Colt revolver

[SinCityPatriot]

Need a clarification please...would you ever use an over the powder lubed wad AND a cream of wheat (or other suitable) filler? If I am reading this thread correctly, the lubed wad is used to take up some space and also too lube the cylinder behind the ball (to make cleaning easier later and reduce fouling I presume.) The filler is used to simply take up space to move the ball forward to the mouth of the cylinder. So, is there ever a need to use both lubed wad and filler?

 

[cynthialee]

need?
no

I use some corn meal to fill it up some and then a wad to help keep the barrel cleaner.

 

[SinCityPatriot]

That's what I figured...thanks for the reply!

Charlie

 

[crockett]

You raise a good question and maybe everyone could share their thoughts. Lubed wads are pretty expensive if you buy them. One thing on the wad is a barrier to help ward off a chain firing. If you loaded powder, then a good amount of cream of wheat, and then a ball, does the cream of wheat form a sufficient barrier to prevent a chain firing? Off hand I would think that it probably would and the big plus is in hot weather you don't have Crisco melting, etc if you are carrying the revolver in a holster. There is the advantage of the lube softening any fouling but in a carry situation, maybe powder, cream of wheat, and ball would be a good combination.
Can anyone think of any shortcomings to that approach?

 

[cheetah4570]

Fired the Colt yesterday and it did pretty well. Shoots about eight inches high, with ball or conical bullets. Ran about 24 shots through it with only one minor malfunction when a fired cap got hung up in the revolving cylinder and had to be cleared. Cleaning was easy using Ballistol mixed with water, a tip I found on the internet. In my earlier post I wrote that I'll try a patch, but I meant lubed wad over the powder. With the 17.7 grain load, I should have just enough space.

 

[crockett]

Yeah, forgot to mention that is one thing about the Colt Navy. I'm told you were supposed to aim for the guy's belt buckle because they shoot high. You can modify the sights or use a big bullseye where a 12 O'Clock hold puts the ball in the X ring.

 

[Wes/Tex]

Yeah, forgot to mention that is one thing about the Colt Navy. I'm told you were supposed to aim for the guy's belt buckle because they shoot high. You can modify the sights or use a big bullseye where a 12 O'Clock hold puts the ball in the X ring.

This problem dates back to the military's requirement that cavalry pistols be sighted for 75 yards. Probably the same officer who thought percussion caps would get lost so let's stay with flint!! :youcrazy:

 

[crockett]

On the military aspect, the military didn't load with balls, they used combustible cartridges loaded with conicals and moderate powder charges. Maybe they shot closer to the point of aim.

 

[Zonie]

They might have shot closer to the aim point.

On the other hand, with pistols usually a heavier (slower) bullet will cause the barrel to raise more while the bullet is still in the barrel when the gun is fired.

This usually makes them hit higher at pistol range.

 

[crockett]

I agree on the heavier bullet shooting higher, just thought maybe the mild to moderate (17 gr.) powder charge.

 

[cheetah4570]

I have to say I don't agree, though I'm not an expert. While the bullet is contained, the pressure in the "chamber," in this case the barrel, is contained and exerting equal pressure in every direction. As the bullet exits the barrel, a large force vector will be created to the rear, which will force the muzzle up since your hand is below the plane of the force vector. I don't think the barrel rises until the bullet exits it.

 

[bpd303]

It's a matter of physics, "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction". As soon as the powder is ignited and the projectile begins to move forward the barrel moves rearward an equal amount. I have seen ultra slow motion videos of pistols being fired and recoil commences prior to the bullet leaving the muzzle, although it is a matter of milliseconds.

 

[Zonie]

Your not alone in your thoughts.

A lot of people think there is no recoil until the bullet has left the barrel. They usually attribute the recoil to the "jet" type thrust that is caused by an imbalance of internal pressure inside the barrel after the bullet has left.

They are right about some of the recoil being caused by the imbalance of pressure causing a jet like reaction, but a far greater source of recoil is due to the reason given by bpd303.

The energy's force that accelerates the bullet forward also is acting to force the breech of the gun rearward in an equal amount. This begins as soon as the bullet starts to move.

Fortunately, the gun far outweighs the bullet so its acceleration (recoil) to the rear is much less than the lighter bullets acceleration to the front.

This explains why if a 127 grain patched roundball is shot with 80 grains of powder the recoil will be much less than if a 450 grain slug is shot in the same gun with the same 80 grain powder load.

 

[Dickydalton]

All I know is that in 48 years of reloading and shooting black and smokeless guns every one of my revolvers hit lower with lighter/faster bullets than with slower/bigger bullets, with the same sight setting and aim point. :hmm:

 

[Bob in iowa]

So you discovered that 30 grains of powder cannot be put into your gun.
30 grains won't fit in mine either. There is a little pile of powder sitting on top of the full chamber.
The people who load 30 grains into an 1851 Navy Colt, must have a lot longer cylinder than the one on my gun.

 

[cheetah4570]

Good points from all. I'm learning a lot, and I agree with the gentlemen above and stand corrected: recoil will start as soon as the bullet accelerates forward in the barrel.

 

[bigted]

a bit more on the 'chainfire' thing.

I had an old Italian 44 shooter back in the 70's and it were a old one and worn out then... at that time revolver that was worn out ... or maybe as a kid I didn't use it correctly when loading ... but that revolver is the only 'chainfire' I ever had...exciting is what I recall.

at the same time I had several navies and never had any problems with a chainfire. that old worn out army tho did it several times and when my dad seen me cleaning the lead off the sides of that revolver he laid down the law and made me sell it and get something that in his words "wont take out a bystander" that innocently watches you as you fire that nasty thing... :shocked2:

at any rate I seem to recall having a serous thinking pause at some time and discuss with an old friend in Springfield Or about the chainfire concept and his opinion was that having loaded the correct diameter ball and cap with the correct cap , the revolver should be capable of carrying for quit some time without firing or re-loading fresh. and that the only reason for the Crisco or lube wad's was for target work where several cylinders were to be loaded without the need to clean between.

his concern with chainfire never occurred to him if everything was loaded and fit rite in his C&B revolvers.

I have adopted his same opinion and with my experience I don't have a need for the Crisco or wads until I desire several cylinder fulls of shooting and want the fouling to remain soft and accuracy to remain with the several loadings.

the navies are to my thinking the most fun of C&B shooters. I love the 36 cal and they do all I ever wanted them to do.

 

[crockett]

Bigted: There aren't that many folks who have have a chain firing, actually it is pretty rare and sort of hard to collect information. If you can relate as many details as possible- I'm sure a lot of folks would be interested.
1. What do you think was the cause? Poor fitting balls? Loose Caps? Etc.
2. When did it occur? First cylinder of the day? After you had been shooting for while?
3. How many cylinders went off?
Any other data you can remember?
Thanks.

 

[Billnpatti]

20 grains of 3f black powder will give you a really good safe load for that gun. 30 grains of 3f is way too much. Don't do it. :nono: Your revolver really won't like it. :shake: You will have plenty of fun with 20 grains of 3f black powder. :grin: If you find that 20 grains of 3f in a .36 caliber is not giving you enough romp and stomp to suit you, then do not increase the charge in your gun, just go buy a larger caliber revolver. :thumbsup: Think about it for a second :hmm: wouldn't two revolvers be more fun than just one? :wink:

 

[crockett]

For my Navy about 25 grains is it, I'm crammed down the ball to get it into the chamber and that's without a wad.