Lyman Deerstalker 100 yard Accuracy Achieved

[webfeet]

I have been working on getting a load dialed in for my 50 and 54 caliber Lyman Deerstalkers. The goal is three shot groups under an inch center to center with open sights. This week I got the 54 to do it. The 50 won't budge past 1.5 inch C/C so I will keep working on that one. The rifles are stock except for addition of Lyman 57 rear sights. An inch C/C at 100 yards is nothing with a fast twist inline, but I'm pretty happy with a stock 1/48" twist 24" barrel. The 54 is the stainless version with the shallower lands that come with it, and the 50 is the blued version with the regular height lands.

In case anyone wants the load direction, the bullets were hand cast, ladle poured Maxi Balls from original T&C molds (420 grain and 370 grain). I weigh the bullets and anything +/- .5 grain gets recast. The lead is a lead/tin alloy of 1:60. The powder is Pyrodex P at 80 and 90 grains by volume (the respective rifle maxes). I use Ox-Yoke wads lubed with 50% bee wax, 40% Crisco, 10% Canola oil. I pan lube the bullets with the same and only lube the back lube grove. Velocity is 1310-1340 fps with standard deviations in the high teens. I compress the wad and powder charge to 35 lbs of pressure on the rod. I use an old Bonanza Benchrest die with a replacement spring calibrated for 35 lbs to push down on the rod. The caps are RWS 1075+ (#11). They cost more but they work every time. Finally I patch wipe after each shot.

I am thinking of weighing volume charges (yes, they will be lighter than a black powder charges and seeing the median weight and sticking +/- 0.5 grains from that. I'll check the chronograph and see if that makes a difference on SD. I have weighed some volume charges and once in a while I got a charge that was 4 or 5 grains over. When I can get some Swiss BP I'll try it the whole experiment again.

This post is half humble brag and half "maybe this load detail will be useful to someone". Frankly I am kind of amazed that a $450 generic muzzleloader with a compromise twist and hooked breach can shoot like that. I'll try for 200 yards next and see what that does. That is past my ethical elk hunting energy range with these rifle/bullet combinations but it will be interesting to see.

 

[Vikingman1981]

That is a lot better shooting that I can get with my .54 Deerstalker! Good shooting! I'm sure the gun is capable...I am not great on targets as far as grouping/cloverleaf shots but I am a pretty good shot on deer!

 

[smokeum54]

Nice shootin. I've taken countless critters with my 54 deerstalker, never once thought it to be generic tho.

 

[Wisconsin Relic]

Good shooting, but do you think you may be somewhat obsessed with this? Ol Daniel Boone never concerned himself with that much detail. Just as long as the deer, bear or elk fell over, he was happy.

Thanks for taking the time to detail all that info for us.

 

[hanshi]

 

[Iceman]

Nice shooting. Did you find that consistent loading pressure made much of a difference? I think it does but have no proof. As a follow up did you try different pressures or just go with 35 for consistency? In other words is consistency more important than the actual pressure?

I am thinking of weighing volume charges (yes, they will be lighter than a black powder charges and seeing the median weight and sticking +/- 0.5 grains from that. I'll check the chronograph and see if that makes a difference on SD. I have weighed some volume charges and once in a while I got a charge that was 4 or 5 grains over. When I can get some Swiss BP I'll try it the whole experiment again.

Keep us updated. Once I made a bunch of pre-weighed charges and brought them to the range in plastic tubes. It didn’t seem to make a difference at 50 yards but I think at 100 yards it would.

 

[webfeet]

Nice shooting. Did you find that consistent loading pressure made much of a difference? I think it does but have no proof. As a follow up did you try different pressures or just go with 35 for consistency? In other words is consistency more important than the actual pressure?



Keep us updated. Once I made a bunch of pre-weighed charges and brought them to the range in plastic tubes. It didn’t seem to make a difference at 50 yards but I think at 100 yards it would.

I started with 25 lbs pressure and went to 35 lbs with 35 lbs being better. I think consistency in pressure is the key, as increasing pressure via a powder compression die does make a difference in BP cartridge accuracy and velocity standard deviations. It would follow the same is true with muzzleloading powder loads. I would try 45 lbs but 1) have not found the right spring for that amount yet 2) read in one of the Blackpowder books that 35 lbs had been a good load pressure with the Katoody tool.

I'll keep working on the loads. Wind is an issue where I shoot. The range has a 10-15 mph desert wind almost every day. It plays havoc with my group sizes with low BC bullets like these Maxi-Balls or using PRB.

 

[Dobegrant]

I don’t get groups like you do probably my 67 year old eyes but my .54 deerstalker is more accurate than my .50 blued guns. Love the .54
That is some awesome shooting.

 

[webfeet]

I forgot another thing that I do. I bought two brass seaters for sabot bullets that are each maybe .01" smaller than the bore size. I then changed the angle of the seating taper with a countersink cutter that matches the angle of the Maxi-Ball conicals. The sabot angle is quite a bit different than the angle of the Maxi-Balls. Finally I lapped the interior angles with Clover lapping compound using a series of conicals. I simply placed the seaters in a drill chuck and spun it around the conicals loaded with the Clover compound.

The lapping compound makes a nice polished finish and a close to perfect fit. The point of this was that the bullet to seater fit will not mark the conical nose at all when I seat them under pressure. The bullet nose isn't as important as the base in maintaining accuracy but keeping the bullet straight when seating does matter. The added bonus of the just under bore size fitter is that it keeps everything inline as it gets seated.

One more thing I will try is a 3/8" OD 26" or 28" brass or copper tube to drop the powder down the bore. I figure some of the powder doesn't make it all the way to the bottom of a fouled barrel. A drop tube would insure that the full charge goes where it is supposed to go. That would just be a range addition, I won't be packing a brass tube around the woods.

That is everything I can think of that I am doing while loading. It's probably overboard but the information is here if anyone wants to try it.

 

[Iceman]

That drop tube is a good idea.

I did a little practicing with my ram rod on the scale yesterday to get a feel for the pressure, 35 pounds is a lot more force that I thought it would be. I Need to get my rust bluing job done so I can get back to the range and try some of these techniques.

 

[webfeet]

On the 35 lb loading: I use delrin muzzle guides on all my rods so if they bend they do not touch the muzzle. All my rods are fiberglass. I trust fiberglass far more than I trust wood for not cracking from use. I made some brass muzzleguides on my lathe but now just use delrin as they are so light to carry around. You can buy delrin bore guides for muzzleloaders off Amazon if you don't have a way to make them yourself. They fit have a perfect fit on standard diameter rods

As far as the pressure on the rod, I think either 25 to 35 lbs is probably adequate. It would be interesting to see exactly how much compression the weights have on a bore sized column of powder. I should say I apply the pressure slowly i.e. I don't bang on the rod or slam it down. That seems like a bad idea as it could damage the bullet and also breakdown the powder kernel composition and thus alter the burn rate. I see people at the range bang their rods down hard on loads after they seat them and think "why would you do that?"