Lyman pistol load

[Andre V]

Hi guys,

I shot my 50cal Lyman pistol for the first time yesterday. After collecting some of my patches I noticed that i am getting holes in my patches, from what research i have done, it indicates that gases are blowing holes in the patch.

One recommendation was to use hornet nesting material on top of the powder.

Now i dont have that material, would it be appropriate to use a fiber wad on top of the powder charge, before the patch and ball. If yes should the patch be lubed or not.

I tried thicker patches but its almost impossible to get the ball into the barrel with them. I am shooting '490 ball with 1/1000 thick lubed patches; 50gr Sannadex FFG(black powder substitute) roughly equivalent to about 40gr FFFG blackpowder.I did try shooting 40gr FFG loads as well with the same results

I am still new to the pistol shooting game so any advice is appreciated.

 

[napolean]

How thick are those patches???
You must have typoed or I must have mis-read. .001" is about 1/5 of a hair. maybe you meant 10/1000, which is still pretty thin. Is it loading easy? you may just need a little thicker patch, or you can use the same material as your patches as an over powder wad, lube em a little so as not to have smoldering patches 10 ft. in front of ya. collect some of the blown out patches and post a picture. If the gun is new there may be some sharp edges on the grooves.
Some of the other guys will pitch in soon on this one with some other suggestions.
Jon D

 

[arcticap]

I think that it's a good idea to always use lubricated patches even when using an over powder wad.
A wood, rubber or plastic mallet can be used to gently tap, tap, tap the ball starter to help push the patched round ball down into the bore, even 1/2 down if necessary to make it easier to ram it home. When using a mallet it shouldn't be nearly as difficult to start and ram the ball.
A loading stand that holds the pistol upright during loading is another helpful item to use.

 

[mykeal]

Yeah, he must mean 0.010 (10/1000) patches, not 0.001 (1/1000).

He did say the rounds were very difficult to load with thicker than (assumed) 0.010 patches and a .490 ball.

1) use thicker lubed patches, 0.015 or 0.018 (pillow ticking); even just moistened with spit they'll load much easier.

2) an overpowder wad or card as a gas check will help, but you shouldn't need it.

3) with the thicker patch, use a short starter and hit it with your hand to start the ball. That first hit needs to be firm to get the bore, ball and patch material all compressed together.

4) a loading stand to support the pistol so you can use both hands with the short starter may be necessary.

5) it will get easier the more you shoot it. You said it was a new pistol - used but new to you, or brand new, like unused?

 

[Andre V]

Sorry about the thickness. it is 10/1000's.

The gun loads fairly easily with these patches.I do have about 500 fiber wads, they are about 5/6mm thick and unlubed. Would it be okay to use those?

Maybe cut them in half and lube them? Or should i just use a patch as an overpowder wad and then the patched ball

 

[MikeChapin]

Part of the reason for the holes in the patches is that you are shooting from a new barrel. The lands are still sharp from from the factory. That will go away after 100 rounds or so or you can use steel wool to polish the inside of the barrel.

If you need to use an over powder wad, you can just push a patch down the barrel before the patched ball.

Reducing the load will help also. I use 25 grains in my .50 pistol for accuracy. I only need 20 in my .54 pistol.

 

[Andre V]

I will try out a few loads and patch/ wad combinations. Hopefully this weekend.

Thanks everyone for your input, very much appreciated :thumbsup:

 

[Zonie]

I know nothing about Sannadex FFG(black powder substitute) but in my opinion 50 grains sounds like more powder than is needed in a .50 cal pistol.

For reference, an old rule of thumb for a starting load in a rifle is to match the load with the bore.
That is to say, a "50 caliber" would use 50 grains of powder to start with. The final rifle powder load after experimenting with the load may be far above that depending on which one gives the best accuracy.

Anyway, for general plinking and target shooting with a .50 caliber muzzleloading pistol I would start with about 25 grains of your synthetic powder before worrying about filler wads. The lighter powder charge will be a lot easier on your patches and your billfold.
Lighter powder loads often shoot more accurately than the heavy powder loads.

As for the patch tearing, the others are right. New square groove rifling often has razor sharp edges that will cut the patch.

A cure for this is as the others said, shoot it a lot.
A quicker cure is to wrap some #0000 steel wool around your cleaning jag and run it up and down the bore 50-100 times. That will remove the razor edges but it won't wear out the rifling.

 

[arcticap]

I found this about Sannadex:

Sannadex is a synthetic black powder equivelant, locally manufactured and granulated in South Africa. It burns a lot cleaner than black powder, but does burn a little slower, and is less dense than black powder. The slower burning could cause projectiles in some callibers to travel a lot faster in long barrelled guns than the equivelant load of bp.
Projectiles loaded with Sannadex in short barrels tend to be a bit slower than when loaded with bp.

The dex part in the name shows it is derived from dextrose, that is why it "degenerates" like sugar. But storing it inside the plastic containers that you buy your Wano in it keeps much longer.

I tend to achieve much better accuracy when using pistol grain in all guns we own. And also have higher muzzle velocity.

There's also 2 short videos of Sannadex being fired from a Lyman sidelock (60 grains with PRB and 90 grains with a conical).
It appears to shoot pretty good!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AO2QQuxa6h0

http://www.myvideo.co.za/video/50-cal-muzzle-loader-vs-benjamin


For Sannadex velocity data, click on the bp.xls file:
http://mp510sd.weebly.com/

 

[Andre V]

Thanks for the good info guys.

>mykeal it is a new gun.

Before i try the wads i will start off with the lower powder loads and see what the patches look like. I will start on 25gr and work up.

I will also try collect some patches and get some photos for you guys to see.

Thanks again for all the advice

 

[DUSTY 14]

i use 15 grs in my pistol and with a bump to 20 took a challenge and hit a rifle target at 75 yrds a few weeks ago. think about it. it takes 30 plus inches to burn all the powder from your rifle so how much is flaming out the front of your pistol without helping increase velocity

 

[Andre V]

One of the restrictions i have with shooting low charges is that the lyman has a powder channel that is narrower than the barrel.

I need to make sure that is full. I haven't measured the charge i need to fill this accurately yet, but on a guess where i filled it from one of my pre-measured charges it was about 1/2 of 50gr. So i am guessing a min charge of about 25gr. This of course is a guess it may be less/ more

 

[BigL]

Hi Andre

Welcome to the site and the sport - addiction, whatever. I have the .54 and shoot 25gr Wano FF in it. With 50gr you should be getting quite a pounding.

Regards
Lucas

 

[Andre V]

Thanks.

From all the posts i am definitely gathering i am shooting too much powder. With any luck i will get to try out some things this weekend. I will report back any findings.