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Lyman Plains Pistol vs. Pedersoli Kentucky Pistol?
- Thread starter Al Bently
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Cpl. Ashencheeks
40 Cal.
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The Lyman Plains Pistol has loads written for some rather high velocities and energies in a few publications, I think including some performance results published by Sam Fadala.
I really can't speak for the Pedersoli Kentucky, but I assume the loads for it are a bit lower and therefore lower velocities and energy.
How well each one does on accuracy is probably dependent on how familiar the shooter is with each pistol.
High power loads are great if you can be accurate with them, but I would prefer accuracy first before any possibility of issues like flinch, which often comes with the more powerful pistols.
Still, that extra power gets through thicker stuff.
I really can't speak for the Pedersoli Kentucky, but I assume the loads for it are a bit lower and therefore lower velocities and energy.
How well each one does on accuracy is probably dependent on how familiar the shooter is with each pistol.
High power loads are great if you can be accurate with them, but I would prefer accuracy first before any possibility of issues like flinch, which often comes with the more powerful pistols.
Still, that extra power gets through thicker stuff.
Bear Rider
45 Cal.
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The stock on the Lyman is for people with longer fingers. The one that I had was a bit of a stretch for me -- comparable to shooting a large frame (.44 mag) double action revolver in double-action.
The Lyman pistol in .54 cal. will shoot one hole groups all day with 30 grains of 3f, a patched .530 round ball, off the bench.
The groups will open up some with a .54 minie ball.
You can load more powder, but you won't hit much of anything.
Sorry this does not give a comparison to the Pedersoli pistol, as I have never had one. One of the few bp guns that I have not had.
Fred
The groups will open up some with a .54 minie ball.
You can load more powder, but you won't hit much of anything.
Sorry this does not give a comparison to the Pedersoli pistol, as I have never had one. One of the few bp guns that I have not had.
Fred
Jumpshot
54 Cal.
Cpl. Ashencheeks said:
I'm not sure why you would assume the Pedersoli's loads would be lower. I've shot mine (a .54 flintlock) with plenty of hefty loads and it does fine. And the barrel is 5/8" longer than the Lyman (according to the listed specs), so if anything the velocity will be a tiny bit higher with the same load (in theory, of course; they're close enough that the difference is probably negligible for most peoples' needs).
It's a nice gun, excellent fit and finish and a great shooter. I'm picking up another one soon, NIB for an excellent price, also a .54, but a caplock. Gotta have one of each. :wink:
I also find the grip fits my hand better than that of a Plains pistol, but I guess that will vary from one person to the next.
Cpl. Ashencheeks
40 Cal.
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That is good.
The only reason I made such an assumption is because I have a Spanish Kentucky (sounds like a hefty mixed drink) in .45, so I really can't make a fair assessment of this kind of pistol in .54 caliber.
Supposedly the quality of the steel and manufacture is much better in the Pedersoli than it's Spanish counterpart, which I do not doubt at all.
Many of the loads that I have come across in books for the Kentucky have shown best accuracies at moderate loads. Most were published for the .45 Kentucky pistol.
I have run higher loads in my Kentucky .45 when I first started using it, but found that cutting those loads down yielded better results. About 25 grains of FFFG in this pistol is what I will use now.
The published plains pistol loads for .54 showed results which would be comparable to the lower end of modern magnum (another can of worms) velocities and energies.
There was one other pistol that was higher at this aspect of performance than the Plains pistol, but I don't remember what it was.
However, this does not mean hitting the target well.
It sounds like Old Ford found a good load for the plains pistol without suffering a loss in accuracy and probably still retaining plenty of energy.
The only reason I made such an assumption is because I have a Spanish Kentucky (sounds like a hefty mixed drink) in .45, so I really can't make a fair assessment of this kind of pistol in .54 caliber.
Supposedly the quality of the steel and manufacture is much better in the Pedersoli than it's Spanish counterpart, which I do not doubt at all.
Many of the loads that I have come across in books for the Kentucky have shown best accuracies at moderate loads. Most were published for the .45 Kentucky pistol.
I have run higher loads in my Kentucky .45 when I first started using it, but found that cutting those loads down yielded better results. About 25 grains of FFFG in this pistol is what I will use now.
The published plains pistol loads for .54 showed results which would be comparable to the lower end of modern magnum (another can of worms) velocities and energies.
There was one other pistol that was higher at this aspect of performance than the Plains pistol, but I don't remember what it was.
However, this does not mean hitting the target well.
It sounds like Old Ford found a good load for the plains pistol without suffering a loss in accuracy and probably still retaining plenty of energy.
matt denison
54 Cal.
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I own or have owned both. I aree with Old Ford that the Lyman pistol will shoot one hole groups when loaded right. (I use only 25 gr. 3Fg in mine) The Pedersoli might well be capable of the same if worked with diligently, can't say that mine was a tack driver though. You should consider style. There is a world of difference betwen them as far as looks, construction ( I think the Lyman is better designed and built and also has a hooked breech for easy cleaning access.) Lymans have a reputation for being tough as a Russian tank, ya' can't hurt them and they last forever. Mine is still like new after 9 years. I bedded the barrel and soldered the tang to the barrel for a little more potential accuracy and stiffness. That might not be necessary but is what guys like me do... 
I suppose a good question to ask is "What are you going to use the gun for?"
If your going to hunt with it a .54 seems good for certain applications.
If you want to have a good target gun, you might want to think about a smaller caliber.
I have not shot either one, but I have heard that the triggers on some of the Pedisoli Kentucky's leave a lot to be desired, and to me a hooked breech is an advantage in doing a thorough cleaning.
And then there is the matter of looks. I like the looks of the Pedersoli, but that is a real personal thing.
If your going to hunt with it a .54 seems good for certain applications.
If you want to have a good target gun, you might want to think about a smaller caliber.
I have not shot either one, but I have heard that the triggers on some of the Pedisoli Kentucky's leave a lot to be desired, and to me a hooked breech is an advantage in doing a thorough cleaning.
And then there is the matter of looks. I like the looks of the Pedersoli, but that is a real personal thing.
CKeshen said:
It would largely be for plinking and competitive shooting of both paper and steel plates. I'm already a hyper-competitive 3-gun shooter in the cartridge/smokeless world so I don't want or need to be when it comes to muzzleloading.
I would just like a pistol to match my .54 Hawken rifle -- try to keep things as simple as possible.
As was already asked, what are you planning to use the pistol for?
If it is for plinking and target shooting I'd say it's a tie between the two.
Styling and workmanship might go to the Pedersoli Kentucky.
If the idea is hunting and using heavy powder loads, my vote would go to the Lyman Plains pistol.
Why?
The Lyman Plains pistol barrel is held into the stock with the hooked breech plug and a key thru the for-end. This method is quite stout when it comes to keeping the barrel in the stock.
The Pedersoli Kentucky on the other hand uses the rear tang and the nosecap to keep the barrel in the stock.
"The nosecap?", you say?
Yes. Below the barrel at the very front of the PK stock, a small projection of the stocks wood sticks out. It protrudes about 1/8 inch into the area where the nosecap meets the wood.
This wooden projection is about 2mm (.080") thick.
With this wooden projection entrapped by the lower area of the nosecap, a screw passes up thru the bottom of the nosecap and threads into the barrel to hold the muzzle in place.
This works fine for light to moderate powder/ball loads however, some of our members over the years have found that a heavy powder/ball loads recoil is enough to shear off the wooden projection.
When I restocked my Pedersoli Kentucky pistol with a curly maple stock and German silver furniture I installed a steel underlug into the bottom of the barrel behind the muzzle and secured it to the stock with a 5/64" diameter pin.
You can see the hole for this pin in the center of the silver inlay.
If it is for plinking and target shooting I'd say it's a tie between the two.
Styling and workmanship might go to the Pedersoli Kentucky.
If the idea is hunting and using heavy powder loads, my vote would go to the Lyman Plains pistol.
Why?
The Lyman Plains pistol barrel is held into the stock with the hooked breech plug and a key thru the for-end. This method is quite stout when it comes to keeping the barrel in the stock.
The Pedersoli Kentucky on the other hand uses the rear tang and the nosecap to keep the barrel in the stock.
"The nosecap?", you say?
Yes. Below the barrel at the very front of the PK stock, a small projection of the stocks wood sticks out. It protrudes about 1/8 inch into the area where the nosecap meets the wood.
This wooden projection is about 2mm (.080") thick.
With this wooden projection entrapped by the lower area of the nosecap, a screw passes up thru the bottom of the nosecap and threads into the barrel to hold the muzzle in place.
This works fine for light to moderate powder/ball loads however, some of our members over the years have found that a heavy powder/ball loads recoil is enough to shear off the wooden projection.
When I restocked my Pedersoli Kentucky pistol with a curly maple stock and German silver furniture I installed a steel underlug into the bottom of the barrel behind the muzzle and secured it to the stock with a 5/64" diameter pin.
You can see the hole for this pin in the center of the silver inlay.
Jumpshot
54 Cal.
Nice work, but I've not had that problem and don't personally know anyone who has. But just to be safe, I came up with a much simpler solution for that, only takes a couple of minutes. I might put a video of it on youtube just for fun.
I've also heard about some people using heavy loads in the .54 Plains pistol and cracking the stock around the lock mortice, but again, no one I know personally.
I've also heard about some people using heavy loads in the .54 Plains pistol and cracking the stock around the lock mortice, but again, no one I know personally.
It's interesting to compare the two pistols' specs:
OAL: 15"(L), 15 3/8"(P)
Barrel length: 9" although some sources say 8"(L), 10 3/8"(P)
Weight: 3.1 lbs.(L), 2.31 lbs.(P)
Lyman Plains Percussion Pistol
Davide Pedersoli Kentucky Percussion Pistol
OAL: 15"(L), 15 3/8"(P)
Barrel length: 9" although some sources say 8"(L), 10 3/8"(P)
Weight: 3.1 lbs.(L), 2.31 lbs.(P)
Lyman Plains Percussion Pistol
Davide Pedersoli Kentucky Percussion Pistol
Jumpshot
54 Cal.
CalGunner said:
There's the Traditions Trapper, priced around $275, but it's only available in .50 caliber.
Here is a nice comparison of the two with the Pedersoli on top:
The photo isn't displaying... Hmm, here's the direct link: castboolits dot gunloads dot com/attachment dot php?attachmentid=110308&d=1405022216
Are we not allowed to display images from Castboolits here? What's up with that?
After looking at this photo I think the Lyman might possibly fit my hands better...
The photo isn't displaying... Hmm, here's the direct link: castboolits dot gunloads dot com/attachment dot php?attachmentid=110308&d=1405022216
Are we not allowed to display images from Castboolits here? What's up with that?
After looking at this photo I think the Lyman might possibly fit my hands better...
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
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The Italians typically recommend light loads for liability reasons, and because their targeted audiences in Europe will never fire a black powder pistol at anything but paper.
If you want to go .50 cal I would highly recommend the Traditions William Parker.
http://www.kitterytradingpost.com/...ons-william-parker-50-cal-black-powder-pistol
For about $370 it is one heck of a gun. Made by Ardesa in Spain it is highly accurate and a well made firearm. I own one and I love it. Shoots about as well as my Pedersoli Le Page which cost more than twice as much.
http://www.kitterytradingpost.com/...ons-william-parker-50-cal-black-powder-pistol
For about $370 it is one heck of a gun. Made by Ardesa in Spain it is highly accurate and a well made firearm. I own one and I love it. Shoots about as well as my Pedersoli Le Page which cost more than twice as much.
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Bear Rider
45 Cal.
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I noticed two things other than the large stock on my Lyman .54.
First, it was the only pistol that I have ever owned with a bore so large in relation to its length that I could inspect the breech plug without a bore light. :grin:
Second, if you didn't swab it between shots or used the wrong patch material, you would be hard pressed to keep them on the paper at 50 yards. If you paid attention, it was easy to keep them all in the black at 50 yards.
Somewhere (30 years ago) I acquired a few wadcutters that fit this gun if patched. They had the general proportions of a trash can, were much heavier than a round ball, and had reasonable accuracy at 50 yards. With stout loads of powder, the recoil could be painful. That load would have made a good backup for hunting.
The slug may have been for a .54 percussion Sharps.
First, it was the only pistol that I have ever owned with a bore so large in relation to its length that I could inspect the breech plug without a bore light. :grin:
Second, if you didn't swab it between shots or used the wrong patch material, you would be hard pressed to keep them on the paper at 50 yards. If you paid attention, it was easy to keep them all in the black at 50 yards.
Somewhere (30 years ago) I acquired a few wadcutters that fit this gun if patched. They had the general proportions of a trash can, were much heavier than a round ball, and had reasonable accuracy at 50 yards. With stout loads of powder, the recoil could be painful. That load would have made a good backup for hunting.
The slug may have been for a .54 percussion Sharps.
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