Lyman Trade Rifle

[Zonie]

Hi, it would help this newbie if you could explain why you consider #13 to be crap. As a rookie, I'm prepared to avoid it on your say-so, but would like to know the back story.

Jamie

Several years ago I bought a used muzzleloading rifle from a guy.
As often happens, he gave me a bunch of his stuff along with the rifle and one of these things was a bottle of Thompson Center #13 bore cleaner.

Some time after that, when I got back from a days shooting one of my Cap & Ball revolvers I decided to try using the #13 on a Colt open top to clean it.

Normally, I use warm water with a bit of dish washing soap in it to do my cleaning so I wasn't prepared for what I saw.

Wetting a cleaning patch with the #13 I ran it down the barrel. It seemed to clean the fouling out with one pass but changing the dirty patch to a clean one I moistened it with the #13 and ran it thru the barrel and then followed it with a dry patch on the jag.

The dry patch came out with a dark red/brown coating of rust on it. :cursing:

After using a few more dry patches, with each one showing less sign of rust I thought that it might be a good idea to run another wet patch soaked with #13 just to see what would happen.

Immediately after running the wet patch thru the bore I ran a clean dry patch.
Again, instant rust had formed in the bore and the dry patch came out of the barrel coated with red/brown rust. :cursing: :cursing:

After cleaning the barrel once more with warm soapy water and running a number of new, clean patches thru the barrel there was no rust on any of the patches so I swabbed the bore with a patch coated with Birchwood Casey Barricade to protect the metal from rusting.

I then vowed to never use Thompson Center #13 and pitched the almost full bottle as far as I could throw it.

Sense that unhappy event, I've read many accounts of this same "instant rusting" happening to other Forum members and as soon as I see #13 in their post my back hair goes up and I warn them about what this crap can do to their guns.

 

[jamieorr]

Okay, got it.

Jamie

 

[azmntman]

I'm pretty sure the old timers used the # 13 to clean the sling swivels on their trade guns. Rusted em plumb off from what I hear. :surrender:

 

[good ole boy]

You all use what works for you all but these accusations are ludicrous.Wrong cleanin procedures don,tgive good results.If this stuff was so bad do you all really think TC would be sellin it?Plus this stuff would have been pulled off of the shelf decades ago and would not still be a great seller.Use some common sense.

 

[azmntman]

I have exercised common sense and no longer use #13 to lubricate my sling swivels.

Truth be told I never tried it, but I believe Zonies experience will stop me from that, after all soap n water have never failed me yet (for gun cleanin, failed a time or two in the shower).

 

[kodiakmarine]

All sorts of things will work at the range, alcohol, store bought bp cleaners, home recipes, even spit, although my spit turned a rifle into a smooth bore. The most important thing is soap and water when you get home. I like the water really hot. I dry out the barrel and the heat gets rid of any residual moisture. Then, while the barrel is nice and warm, I run a patch down the bore heavily lubed with Old Zip mutton tallow and bees wax. It works for me. Good luck. - John

 

[azmntman]

although my spit turned a rifle into a smooth bore :shocked2:

You dont drink scotch whist shootin I hope?? :rotf:

 

[William O.]

***SNIP***
I cut a bunch of patches from 100% cotton linen that I keep in a bottle...
***SNIP***

Hey Bull35540,

What do you mean by "100% cotton linen". Cotton and linen are two entirely different things. Was this just a slip or do you really use something that you're calling "100% cotton linen"?

Thanks,
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:

Yep, meant to say cotton flannel; my mind wandered off...

 

[good ole boy]

The hotter the water the faster and more severe flash rust occurs.

 

[Zonie]

I just explained what happened to my pistol barrel after using TC # 13.

As for "wrong cleaning procedures", how can you explain the product forming rust in the bore within seconds of it being applied? Not once but twice in a row?


What part of running a patch wetted with the product thru a 8 inch long barrel a few times caused the problem?

I ask because although I've been shooting and cleaning muzzleloading guns for over 43 years and every one of my more than 18 guns are in pristine condition, I'm willing to learn.

I also should mention that the shooting range is less than a 1/2 hour drive from my home, the barrel was rust free before I started shooting and in dry Arizona, 1/2 hour is not long enough for a fouled bore to start to rust.

 

[kodiakmarine]

although my spit turned a rifle into a smooth bore :shocked2:

You dont drink scotch whist shootin I hope?? :rotf:

No, I only use scotch at the range to swab between shots. :rotf: - John

 

[Twisted_1in66]

No worries Bull3540, I have to go round up mine from time to time, so I know how that goes. :wink:

Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:

 

[good ole boy]

I just explained what happened to my pistol barrel after using TC # 13.

As for "wrong cleaning procedures", how can you explain the product forming rust in the bore within seconds of it being applied? Not once but twice in a row?


What part of running a patch wetted with the product thru a 8 inch long barrel a few times caused the problem?

I ask because although I've been shooting and cleaning muzzleloading guns for over 43 years and every one of my more than 18 guns are in pristine condition, I'm willing to learn.

I also should mention that the shooting range is less than a 1/2 hour drive from my home, the barrel was rust free before I started shooting and in dry Arizona, 1/2 hour is not long enough for a fouled bore to start to rust.

I say that because that same result would be happening to me and everyone else that uses this product.

 

[larry wv]

I tried TC-13 many years ago. I don't remember the details but remember that it rusted bad. I have a bottle or so but won't use it. But to cheap to throw it away. :redface: Always think I will find a use for it. But after 40 years it's not looking likely. :grin:

Larry

 

[Semisane]

I tried TC-13 many years ago. I don't remember the details but remember that it rusted bad. I have a bottle or so but won't use it. But to cheap to throw it away. :redface: Always think I will find a use for it. But after 40 years it's not looking likely. :grin:

Larry

Might be just the thing for browning a rifle. :wink:

 

[kodiakmarine]

I have never had flash rust, but it could be that some barrels are more subject to that than others. I will definitely watch for it. - John

 

[dodger]

My GPR flash rusts pretty darn quick with soapy boiling water.
So I dry it with a couple of patches. whilst it's hot to avoid the problem.

 

[Zonie]

Many feel that very hot water will speed up the flash rusting process. Heat speeds up many chemical reactions.

You might want to try using luke warm water the next time you clean your gun just to prove ole' Zonie wrong. :grin:

 

[dodger]

Sure will Zonie .I'll try anything once . :shocked2:

 

[jamieorr]

Well, we got out today and managed to use up some thirty round balls. Still slow but getting there.

I wiped between shots with just a bit of alcohol on the patch, followed by a dry patch. Dry wiped the frizzen and flint and pricked the vent each time - the only misfire was the time I didn't prick.

We (my son and I) wore out the first flint, a sawn one. It gave up the ghost just before the range closed, but one of the club members gave us an English knapped flint and my son clipped the X-ring with the last shot - a good finish!

I can't say we shot good groups but my last half dozen shots were reasonably close. We were only shooting at 25 yards, but any progress is good to see. I'm looking forward to learning to shoot this rifle - very impressed with how quick the flintlock is. No trouble with flinching, I'm staring too hard at that front sight to notice.

My eyes aren't what they might be, I'm wondering if a bead might be clearer than a blade - any thoughts?

Cheers,

Jamie

PS I've seen Dutch Schoultz' book spoken well of on this forum so I'm ordering that.