Maxis in a 1 in 66" barrel!

[PreglerD]

Hello from Germany!

After getting my Deerhunter in .45 with the 1 in 66" ROT I tested around with Maxis to have a heavier bullet available. I used .452 maxis and 90 grs of Wano PP. I shot at 30 m and was very surprised. Accuracy was really good with these conicals out of a roundball barrel. So with this possibility the .45 ML which are mostly available in Germany can also be used to harvest bigger game like wildboars or red stag.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[BrownBear]

I would expect that with maxis and a very strong powder charge such as you used. But as the range gets longer, the maxis slow quickly and their accuracy decreases dramatically. If you double the range to 60 meters, I bet your groups more than double in size. I know with both my 50 and 54 caliber rifles with 1:66 twist I can get decent groups at 25 yards, but they are getting almost too large for hunting at 50 yards. At 100 yards, I can seldom keep all my shots on the 15" x 15" target paper.

 

[PreglerD]

I will test that, too. With my .45 GPR with the 1 in 60" twist I get also good groups at 50m using 60 grs of Wano PPP.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[larry wv]

I have a cva Hawken and it holds a 5 inch group with 90 gr 3f and a maxi at 100 yards. It is 1-66 twist. I know it is not a .45 and probley is the exception and not the rule :idunno: . Been a good gun for 30 yrs or so. I have had no luck with maxi hunters but I think they are shorter. Maybe they will shoot better? Brown Bear would have a better idea than me on that. Larry Wv

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

I've found the same with my slow-twist Ithica Navy Arms Hawken in .50 cal. The Maxi's fly off of the paper at 100 yards . I haven't tried closer--didn't see the need at the time.

Too bad our German friend is limited in bore size in a M/L rifle!

Dave

 

[ohio ramrod]

If you can find them across the pond the hollow based shorter mini's work well in slow twist barrels. If you cann't find any over there I could send you some to try as I make my own for hunting deer with my 45's.

 

[nkbj]

Lymans made a hollow base 45 for one of their rifles once upon a time. Looked like a heavy 45LC slug. Were they any good?

 

[BrownBear]

I'm sure it's a question of the length of the maxi. The longer the maxi, the less likely it's going to work well out of slow twist. That's the whole principle behind Ballets and other short "maxis" for use in slow twists.

 

[redwing]

I have used the Hollow Base slugs in a JBR not the best M/L ever built. However the bullets shot outstanding groups at 100 yds. 3" to 4" 3 shots. It is 1-66". With tang sights and a globe front I have shot Antelope out to 190 Yds. I did not think it would work, but it did. :hmm:

 

[MSW]

kirrmeister, i can't help but remember the 2d lieutenant at Hohenfels training area who was told by just abouot everybody (including his friend, me) to (1) not sleep on the ground, (2) leave the wildlife the ^&*(^* alone, (3) especially leave the boar alone, inasmuch as they're big and very agressive when injured, and (4) do not, under any circumstances, leave food or wrappers of any kind on the ground.

he carefull ignored this sage advice, and was nearly stomped to death by a boar in his sleeping bag, on the ground, right next to a pile of table scraps, whereupon he drew out his sidearm (we were using the .45 calibre Model 1911a1 at the time) and shot the boar, hitting it in the 'vitals' six out of seven shots. not bad shooting, but they found the boar about sixty meters away.

why the boar didn't finish what it had started is unclear.

needless to say, he was discharged and sent home within a matter of four or five days.

'take home point' -- if you go after boar with a .45 muzzleoader, you're much braver than i, and i hope that you're in a stand in a sturdy tree.

i'd use something bigger, say a .54, and i'd still stay in the stand. (not sure if you guys are allowed to stalk in Germany.)

as regards the possibility of conicals in a slow twist barrel, i've tried it with only marginal success, but some have been able to make it work, so the best advice i could offer (and remember it's freee, and worth what you paid for it) is to get some and give them a try.

good luck with your project!

 

[kentucky bucky]

Mine tumbled and keyholed every time in my .45, so I gave up.

 

[PreglerD]

kirrmeister, i can't help but remember the 2d lieutenant at Hohenfels training area who was told by just abouot everybody (including his friend, me) to (1) not sleep on the ground, (2) leave the wildlife the ^&*(^* alone, (3) especially leave the boar alone, inasmuch as they're big and very agressive when injured, and (4) do not, under any circumstances, leave food or wrappers of any kind on the ground.

he carefull ignored this sage advice, and was nearly stomped to death by a boar in his sleeping bag, on the ground, right next to a pile of table scraps, whereupon he drew out his sidearm (we were using the .45 calibre Model 1911a1 at the time) and shot the boar, hitting it in the 'vitals' six out of seven shots. not bad shooting, but they found the boar about sixty meters away.

why the boar didn't finish what it had started is unclear.

needless to say, he was discharged and sent home within a matter of four or five days.

'take home point' -- if you go after boar with a .45 muzzleoader, you're much braver than i, and i hope that you're in a stand in a sturdy tree.

i'd use something bigger, say a .54, and i'd still stay in the stand. (not sure if you guys are allowed to stalk in Germany.)

as regards the possibility of conicals in a slow twist barrel, i've tried it with only marginal success, but some have been able to make it work, so the best advice i could offer (and remember it's freee, and worth what you paid for it) is to get some and give them a try.

good luck with your project!

Sir, when I said that the .45 will work on wildboar I thought about using conicals because I knew some guys who had already harvested boars with .45 maxis at close range. All boars died in their tracks. I would never recommend a .45 PRB for boar.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[PreglerD]

Hello from Germany!

Yesterday I tested my .45 Deerhunter rifle 1 in 66" ROT at 50m with .452 maxis and 90 grs WanoPP. I have to say that the result was outstanding. 50m from the bench I got a 3 shot group of 18mm/.75". So nothing to say about it, except very suitable for hunting, especially when bigger cals are not available here!

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[Little Wattsy]

I always appreciate a range report! :thumbsup:

 

[David W.]

Hello from Germany!

Yesterday I tested my .45 Deerhunter rifle 1 in 66" ROT at 50m with .452 maxis and 90 grs WanoPP. I have to say that the result was outstanding. 50m from the bench I got a 3 shot group of 18mm/.75". So nothing to say about it, except very suitable for hunting, especially when bigger cals are not available here!

Regards

Kirrmeister

Howdy from Tennessee, USA!
Are you talking about the Maxi as from T/C? What brand of powder do you use? How about the lube?

 

[PreglerD]

Hello from Germany!

Yesterday I tested my .45 Deerhunter rifle 1 in 66" ROT at 50m with .452 maxis and 90 grs WanoPP. I have to say that the result was outstanding. 50m from the bench I got a 3 shot group of 18mm/.75". So nothing to say about it, except very suitable for hunting, especially when bigger cals are not available here!

Regards

Kirrmeister

Howdy from Tennessee, USA!
Are you talking about the Maxi as from T/C? What brand of powder do you use? How about the lube?

I'm not talking about the T/C maxis, but mine look similar. They have only a bigger diameter, because the T/C are too small for Ardesa barrel rifling (guess the T/C have .451 Dia). Mine are selfcast and lubed with a bp cartridge lube. I only lube the lower groove. I found that a maxi will work well in a slow twist barrel when it is not much longer as 1.5 of the cal. and when you take a stout load. This result makes the .45 usable for deersized game and even bigger game like red stag and boar.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[Billnpatti]

The stability and resultant accuracy of an enlongated projectile depends on its rate of spin. The longer a projectile is in relation to its diameter (greater aspect ratio) the faster it must spin in order to be stabilized in flight. So what this means is that if you shoot an enlongated projectile in a slow twist rate barrel, you must increase the muzzle velocity so that the spin rate is increased. So long as you can get sufficient spin rate to stabilize an enlongated projectile, it will shoot accurately from a slow twist barrel. There is, of course, a limit to how fast you can force any projectile down a barrel. Too fast, and the lands and grooves cannot grip the projectile sufficiently and it will simply strip lead from the projectile and lead up your barrel while failing to empart sufficient spin to the projectile. This will reduce accuracy even more.

 

[Dphar]

Hello from Germany!

After getting my Deerhunter in .45 with the 1 in 66" ROT I tested around with Maxis to have a heavier bullet available. I used .452 maxis and 90 grs of Wano PP. I shot at 30 m and was very surprised. Accuracy was really good with these conicals out of a roundball barrel. So with this possibility the .45 ML which are mostly available in Germany can also be used to harvest bigger game like wildboars or red stag.

Regards

Kirrmeister

If I were going to use a conical for hunting it would not be a Maxi-Ball. Nor would I risk it even with a 48 twist. I have accounts by trusted friends of the Maxi not tracking straight when striking game. This means having a well placed shot deflect and not reach its intended target inside the animal.
This was also noted with the Minie ball when used in the military. During the Crimean War British surgeons were noting that the Minies would sometimes turn a full 90 degrees on striking a man. These are also marginally stabilized in a 72 twist but in a much larger bore.
There are other deficiencies in the Maxi-Ball as a hunting projectile. I believe this is why TC developed the Maxi Hunter bullet.

Having a bullet deflect and miss the vitals is an excellent way to produce wounded rather than dead game and is a very poor idea if hunting something with a bad attitude.

I would do extensive testing of any conical is a 66 twist before hunting with it if you have not already.

Dan

 

[PreglerD]

Hello from Germany!

After getting my Deerhunter in .45 with the 1 in 66" ROT I tested around with Maxis to have a heavier bullet available. I used .452 maxis and 90 grs of Wano PP. I shot at 30 m and was very surprised. Accuracy was really good with these conicals out of a roundball barrel. So with this possibility the .45 ML which are mostly available in Germany can also be used to harvest bigger game like wildboars or red stag.

Regards

Kirrmeister

If I were going to use a conical for hunting it would not be a Maxi-Ball. Nor would I risk it even with a 48 twist. I have accounts by trusted friends of the Maxi not tracking straight when striking game. This means having a well placed shot deflect and not reach its intended target inside the animal.
This was also noted with the Minie ball when used in the military. During the Crimean War British surgeons were noting that the Minies would sometimes turn a full 90 degrees on striking a man. These are also marginally stabilized in a 72 twist but in a much larger bore.
There are other deficiencies in the Maxi-Ball as a hunting projectile. I believe this is why TC developed the Maxi Hunter bullet.

Having a bullet deflect and miss the vitals is an excellent way to produce wounded rather than dead game and is a very poor idea if hunting something with a bad attitude.

I would do extensive testing of any conical is a 66 twist before hunting with it if you have not already.

Dan

Dan!


I have already tested around. Otherwise I would not have posted all this. I have also harvested game with the Maxiball. And I can say my Maxis with my charge of bp hit there where I aim up to 50 m.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[Buck Snort]

Ya Vole heir Kirrmiester, Gates in de velt. My grandparents were from Germany. My dad was always talking to them in German. I only remember some things, don't know what I'm sayen.
To the bullets. I used to have a Hawken that was 45 cal and I believe it had a quite slow twist. ??? I used to shot a hollow base slug in it made by CVA called DeerHunter and were about 240 grain. (I have not much memory, these days) Anyway, they shot very well to 100yds and I took a whitetail doe with them at about 110 yds. It went right through the boiler house and she went about 30 yds and toppled over.