melting lead

[rabbit03]

Ok a question for the forum. I have been melting lead for a long time but really not sure what temperature is the best to keep the lead while pouring the lead to create the round balls.

Another question is i have been using a bottom spout Lee Production Pot in my melting and pouring but I would like to use a fairly large cast iron pot in the future. The pot measures roughly 10 inches across the top and about 5 inches high and about 8 inches across the bottom. Obviously I will be melting a large amount of lead (for me) and want to know if I can get an electric burner/hotplate to sit under it that would get the pot/lead hot enough to melt.

I was at the store today and found a hotplate that I thought might work. However I called the Hamillton Beach People and they said that the hotplate would only get to about 350 F and I did not think that it would be nearly hot enough to do what I need to do. I suppose I could use the fish frier I have at home but would prefer electric heat if I could find something that would do the job.

So my questions for the forum members are:

(1) At what temp does lead need to be in order to pour a good round ball,

(2) What source of electric heat could I use to heat up the pot I have with that amount of lead,

I appreciate any info thank you

rabbit03

 

[Zonie]

You will need something that will heat the lead to a little over 700 degrees F to cast balls.
Pure lead has a much higher melting point (621 degrees F) than solder (380-590 degrees F) for instance. The added tin lowers the melting point.

Maybe someone else has a better idea, but the only thing I can think of is a Coleman Gasoline stove and I'm not sure if even it would be big enough to handle the size of pot your talking about.
I do know a gas stove will handle a 6 inch diameter X 2 inch tall pan because I've done that.

 

[gmww]

Greetings Rabbit. Check out this link about bullet casting. Has the make up of the different types of casting and the temp. for them also.

Link to bullet casting information.

As far as a stove for something that large. Check out the ones they use for deep frying turkeys. Cabelas, Redhead, Basspro sell them.

 

[TANSTAAFL]

Ok a question for the forum. I have been melting lead for a long time but really not sure what temperature is the best to keep the lead while pouring the lead to create the round balls.

Let the lead balls do the talking, as a rule, if wrinkled, too cold, if frosted, a bit warm. But frosted is not altogether a bad thing, just an indication of casting temp.

Another question is i have been using a bottom spout Lee Production Pot in my melting and pouring but I would like to use a fairly large cast iron pot in the future. The pot measures roughly 10 inches across the top and about 5 inches high and about 8 inches across the bottom. Obviously I will be melting a large amount of lead (for me) and want to know if I can get an electric burner/hotplate to sit under it that would get the pot/lead hot enough to melt.


I too have been using a bottom pour Lee pot for decades, for general casting it works well for me, but too small for large amounts.

I use a cheap hotplate from Wally World and a large cast iron skillet melting scrap lead & wheel weights for casting ingots, it does a very good job indeed.

(Particulars on the hotplate are: Durabrand, model WS100, 1100 watts, single burner, variable temp control, 6 inch element)

 

[sledgemeister]

The pot I use is about 8 inches accross the bottom and I use a gas stove to melt my lead for casting. It seems to handle it quite easily and is easily adjustable, you get to know when its too hot or not hot enough.

 

[roo shooter]

I also use a gas stove and adjust the flame when needed,I dont check the tempreture if Iam casting good balls I just keep going.
I hope the term gas isnt confusing things, I think the Americans term for gas is different to ours.

 

[Slamfire]

When I was casting bullets for a 7mm I used one of the propane burners that sat on the large disposable propane tank. At one time I melted 25 lbs of shot, 10+ lbs of wheel weights and 1 lb of 50/50 bar solder to make ingots out of. The little burner handled it just fine. :thumbsup:

 

[2172]

Big Mitch, we understand you. We call "petrol" gas, and we call natural gas, "gas" and we also use the term "gas" for LPG and Propane...unless we need to be very specific...
I just use a little "hotpot" bought from soneone's catalog, about 3" across, 3" high, and use a little dipper to fill my mold...slow, but it works...I do about 100 balls at a sitting..Hank

 

[wszumera]

Please keep in mind that your pot filled to one inch from top is going to weigh 104 pounds or so. Please keep that in mind to make sure whatever you heat with can support the weight.


Clutch

 

It might be good to reconsider this whole idea.

It takes a Lee production pot 30 minutes to melt 10 pounds of lead from a cold start. I have used Coleman stoves many times and they take about the same.

It might take as much as three or four hours to melt 100+ pounds of lead to casting temp. It would take half the night for that mess to cool down to a safe temp.

If you keep it fired up 12-16 hours to heat and then cast up 100 pounds of balls it might be worth it but I have always found it better to work in smaller batches that heat quick, let me cast until I am tired (usually a couple of hours), then quit. Usually that is about two fills with my production pot.

Depending on caliber that will give 600-1000 balls.

Whatever you do be careful!! That much lead would kill you if it spills!

 

[CrackStock]

Rab,

Why are you wanting to melt such a large batch of lead?

If you are casting canon balls or cleaning a large batch of lead for pouring into convenient ingots, I could understand it, but for the average shooter, you would be upscaling unnecessarily. As has been pointed out, there are risks associated with a hundred pounds of lead heated to between 650 and 700 degrees fahrenheit.

Maybe some less ambitious process?

CS

 

[sequoia]

When I have a large amount of bulk lead to melt I use an aluminum pot about the size being discussed here and a Coleman stove. The trick is to not let the pot go empty. The first batch will take 10-15 minutes to get hot enough to melt. When it gets down to an inch or so hot lead in the pot slowly add more lead until the pot is full again. Using this metheod I can melt 60 lbs. of lead into ingots in less than an hour. When I used to do this with my litle electric pot it would take an entire afternoon!

 

[Stumpkiller]

I too use my Coleman to melt the cruddy scrap lead in a cast iron plumber's pot (holds about 20 pounds) and then pour ingots after fluxing, stirring and plenty of skimming with a stainless tablespoon with a dozen 1/8" holes drilled in it (works great). I then use the ingots in my Lee bottom pour.

Pre-casting the cruddy lead, mine is mostly from sewer pipe seals and roof flashing, sure keeps the Lee pot clean and pouring well.

 

[Zonie]

"...mine is mostly from sewer pipe seals ..."
_________________________________________________

Are you sure your not looking for another good excuse for those "crappy" groups? :grin:
Sounds like your sittin' us up.
I can almost hear it now: "Those 3 wild shots are because of the ****** lead I cast the balls out of.
I don't think I skimmed all the crap off of the top of the lead."
BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG!

"Yup! See? More poor groups. I'm tellin' you, it's because of the sewer lead I'm using!"

:rotf: :grin: :rotf:

 

[rabbit03]

Thanks Crackstock and eveyone so far for all their input and posts. Great advice also from all and I will for sure take it all in to consideration especially the safety point too.

The question of why is pretty simple for me. It had been brought to my attention that pouring from a bottom pour would sometime leave cavities in the balls. There is also a more consistent mix of the lead if your using just one pot of lead compared to replacing the lead during any one casting session of perhaps different types (hardnesses) of lead. I know the amount is perhaps excessive to some and there is a safety concern also when using that much lead. However I may not have to fill the pot up to the top each time, I know I will probably get too tired before casting all that it would hold too. I don't have to wait for the lead to come back to temp each time either is another point in using the larger pot. Keep in mind the pot I am going to be using is one I have on hand so the dimensions of this particular pot although large compared to most, were not by any means pre thought of in shape.

I like the idea of being able to just dip and pour as compared to holding the mould in the right place each time and running the lead into the small hole of the mould. It is not difficult to do but I think that working on top of the pot instead of under it might be a bit easier on the back also.

So I am looking for several things with using this larger pot: More consistant weight of balls by using the one pot of lead versus different types, hopefully less air pockets in a lessor amount of balls poured, with the elimination of adding more lead in one casting session you also have less down time for bringing the lead back to the desired temperature, and there is also the elimination of the forever clogging up of the bottom pour like I seem to have. Althoguh I know this is 99% my fault by not doing as I should and making ingots first and then using those ingots for making the round balls. I am forever picking the little hole in the bottom of the Lee Pot to unclog it )(&(*^*&%&^#^%#^%($*)&%(&*^*. So hopefully that won't be an issue any more.

Basically I am trying to get more balls more consistant in the same casting session. I DON'T LIKE TO SIT AND MOULD BALLS! :nono: :shocked2:

Thank yall again for the advice,

rabbit03

 

[JOHN L. HINNANT]

Greeting All,

I can certainly testify to the fact that Rabbit03 definately does not like " TO SIT AND MOULD BALLS".

Especilly when he can "borrow" all of my labor intensive hand cast, carefully inspected, sorted, weighed to the limits of small butterfly wind dust, and handled only with my secret special color coded pre-sterlized rubber glooves on my sensitive, atuned, blessed in Holy Water, hands.

And not only that, he did not even return the so few balls left OR THE SPECIAL BOX they were so pain-stakenly arranged in by order of casting.

And now, you know a part of the untold story of how he was able to shoot those small groups at the TMLRA State Shoot.

At the next shoot, A CAREFULLY GUARDED Wells-Fargo armoured truck with big, burley. mean, armed guards will be on site to store and protect these Heavenly Spheres of exacting accuracy.

By the way Toney, bring your barrel over. I have been busy at the computer running intensive calculations. I can now re-crown your barrel at the proper 31 degree, 17 minute, 3 second angle that will be preset to offset the wind conditions at Brady. :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

Best regards and good shooting,

John L. Hinnant

If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.

 

[omgb]

I do a lot of casting and have been at it since the early 70s. I also melt huge amounts of wheel weights as well as pure lead. By huge amounts I mean I do 50-75 pound batches (about 10 at a time) and make 200 -300 1 lb ingots at a setting. Here are the things I've learned.
1. Coleman stoves ar crap for any amout over 10 lbs and a poor substitute for real heat even at those weights.
2. The propane turky fryer at 60,000 btu or greater is your friend. By one from Wally World. it will be the best 100 bucks you ever spent for casting bullets that is.
3. Only cast iron is really suitable for casting/melting posts. Wally World sells 4 quart or larger Dutch Ovens for under $20.00. A 4 qt Dutch oven will hold 40 to 50 lbs of lead and more importantly, it will retain heat so you use less fuel to get the job done.
4. dipping makes better 40 cal and up bullets than bottom pour but, you need a good ladle. Rawl makes an excellent bottom pour ladle, buy it and you'll never be sorry.
5. Lee ladles are some kind of joke :bull: or kiddy toy. Who in the heck is Mr. Lee trying to fool with that POS? Considering how good most Lee stuff is, I gotta wonder who was smoking crack the day they dreamed that turd up. :cursing:
6. Bullet lube makes a perfectly acceptable flux. marvelux is good but expensive and messy.
7. When you get serious about casting bullets using the dip method, you'll want a WAGE pot. The web site doesn't list it, but a phone call will get you the real deal. Just ask for the 20 lb pot all of the bullet casters use. It's about $125 plus shipping. It will hold what ever temp you set it for and it is repeatable. Not a big deal for lead balls but for match quality 45 cal bullets...it's a near neccessity.
8. Cast balls at the lowest possible temerature that casuses the mould to fill out nicely.
9. Keep temps uniform or ball size will vary.
10. Don't at cold metal directly to a melted batch. That is of course, unless you like silver showers. In that case, add away. Just let me know beofre you do it so I can leave the room. My epidermis does not tollerate hot lead well. :shocked2:

That's my story and I'm sticking to it. YMMV but I doubt it. :v

 

[omgb]

When I have a large amount of bulk lead to melt I use an aluminum pot about the size being discussed here and a Coleman stove.

Aluminum? :shocked2: Good grief man, Aluminum goes soft at 500 or so degrees. A pot full of molten lead can easily exceed that. Once it does, it will suddenly and without warning collapse spuing molten lead every where. :youcrazy: Steel or Cast Iron only, anything else is un-freeken-safe...really! I honestly do know this from personal experience.

Yours truely,

Web-fingers :bow:

 

[Zonie]

"...Aluminum goes soft at 500 or so degrees...."
________________________________________________

This is true.

Aluminum, which isn't the strongest stuff at room temperature looses almost all of its tensile and yield strength above 500 degrees F. :shocked2:

Zonie

 

[gmww]

2. The propane turky fryer at 60,000 btu or greater is your friend.

Where did I hear that before? :rotf: Great minds....