Middlesex Double Barrel

[mikeoosting]

I'm on a quest to find the perfect flintlock for pheasant, grouse and partridge. I'd consider going to percussion, but I can't, in Ontario we have two classes of hunting permits and I have the non-firearm version of the two (up until now I have only owned a bow) and up here flintlocks are not classified as firearms, while percussion caps are. Getting the firearm version would involve me taking another lengthy and costly safety course :bull:

Anyway, I'm really interested in a double barrel. The only options I've got out there in that department are:

a) Get this parts set from The Rifle Shoppe, pay a few hundred dollars for a barrel, and then pay close to a grand to have it all put together (it's not a kit, but literally just gun parts, and would require a professional). While the result would be spectacular, it would cost me around $2000 :shake:

b) This gun from the Middlesex Village Trading Company.

The latter is much more affordable, and I'm curious, but also wary. Can anyone tell me anything about this gun, has anyone actually seen it or used it?

I'm just worried about the quality for firing, not whether it's historically accurate. I just need it to hunt :haha: If there's anything in particular that is off with this gun, could it be replaced with something a bit higher quality?

It's a 7 hour drive to New Hampshire from here in eastern Ontario, and I won't be making it if it's a garbage gun.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Junk. Look for an original. I see them occasionally for around $2500.

 

[mikeoosting]

Junk. Look for an original. I see them occasionally for around $2500.

Damn, I knew it wasn't great.

And I'm being told that building the double barrel from The Rifle Shoppe is going to cost me around $3000 or so. :shocked2:

Things are looking bleak for a double barrel flintlock.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Junk. Look for an original. I see them occasionally for around $2500.

Damn, I knew it wasn't great.

And I'm being told that building the double barrel from The Rifle Shoppe is going to cost me around $3000 or so. :shocked2:

Things are looking bleak for a double barrel flintlock.

Yes , flint doubles are expensive. You'd have just as much fun with a single barrel flint. I'd suggest a 16,12 or 10 bore if you are wing shooting....I don't know how you do things in Canada.

 

[hawk]

why not a single barrel fowler they can be had for half that....or maybe that firearms course and a sxs percusion gun even less again.
double flint is a pricey game.
what experience do you have with flint guns

 

[mikeoosting]

I did just find this, I'll contact this guy and see what he wants for it: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=293270597

Yes , flint doubles are expensive. You'd have just as much fun with a single barrel flint. I'd suggest a 16,12 or 10 bore if you are wing shooting....I don't know how you do things in Canada.

My dad hunts grouse with a .410 shotgun. To hell with logic, this is Canada.

why not a single barrel fowler they can be had for half that....or maybe that firearms course and a sxs percusion gun even less again. double flint is a pricey game.

Being able to buy a percussion would make this easier, Pedersoli makes a few double barrel percussion. However, the reason I want a flintlock and not a percussion or modern shotgun is because I just hate having to take tests, and the firearms safety course was full of them. The hunter safety course was bad enough.

what experience do you have with flint guns

Zilch, but I think they're purdy. I've used a percussion cap rifle once when I was maybe 12, and I've used plenty of modern rifles and shotguns on a range.

For hunting, I've only ever used my bow. But you can't hunt small game with a bow, and small game's all my dad hunts. So I'd like join him, without taking more damned classes.

 

[mikeoosting]

The double fowler just seemed better to me. And it is, but, "better" is coming at a hefty price.

 

[mikeoosting]

Junk. Look for an original. I see them occasionally for around $2500.

But what exactly makes this gun junk, I'm curious.

I've done some digging and apparently it's a mass produced version of this gun:

At least, that was the first of it ever made, a prototype. Apparently it was manufactured in India, an Afrikaner user on this forum by the name of Christiaan owns it. Apparently this was in 2007, and in 2008 this same Indian manufacturer started building them for MVTC.

The pictures of the prototype Christiaan has are much better quality than those on the MVTC website and reveal a beautiful gun. I don't think the two guns are exactly the same (the prototype and the one MCTV sells) but I don't see how this gun is exactly junk.

 

[nkbj]

Made a few inquiries a while back trying to find people that build double flinters. Want one barrel slow twist rifled, one smooth. Hard to come by.

 

[mikeoosting]

Made a few inquiries a while back trying to find people that build double flinters. Want one barrel slow twist rifled, one smooth. Hard to come by.

It seems so! One would think these guns would be more popular, they're certainly the best looking guns around.

 

[Mike Brooks]

but I don't see how this gun is exactly junk.

Well then, I suggest you buy one. :thumbsup:

 

[juancho]

I'm glad you asked, I'm also from Ontario.For some reason I convinced myself to WASTE the money that they asked for that piece of s%^&*&. Save yourself that money and put it towards something worth more than the 50 bucks that gun is only worth, and a wall hanger for that matter.
Yes , I understand that you WANT a double.You do not really need it.Get a used one in 20 gauge or so and you will be a happy guy.
A flinter is only as good as the lock (everything else being equal).
Where in Ontario are you? I'm in Barrie area.
If you are not too far , I nivite you to see for yourself the gun. That alone will change your mind in a millisecond.

 

[mikeoosting]

I think that's suppose to be pointing out that the gun "looks" like junk. It doesn't to me, it's not as ornate as some guns for sure but it doesn't look poorly built.

 

[Mike Brooks]

I think that's suppose to be pointing out that the gun "looks" like junk. It doesn't to me, it's not as ornate as some guns for sure but it doesn't look poorly built.

As I said, if that looks good to you then go buy one. :thumbsup: You always get just exactly what you pay for. :wink:

 

[juancho]

Please come see for yourself. If not entirely convinced we can have a deal , but I must warn you: no returns accepted :nono:

 

[justtim]

OK, I'll wade in on this against better judgement. I have a friend that has one of those doubles. The locks are JUNK. I can't say it any other way. He had to buy two Silers and pay someone to fit them to the gun. That'll add about another $500 to the gun. Here's my view, coming from someone who had built one double 16ga flinter and two swivel breechs. Two damn heavy ! Yes they look cool and sexy but carry one a day afield and they might not seem as cool.I'd love to have another double flint if for no other reason but to say I have one, but it would get left home in favor of one of my single barrels. I have a 12 ga fowler with a fairly heavy 44" Getz oct to round swamped barrel and it's still much lighter than the old 16 double flintlock.
I agree with Mike, if you have your heart set on it, buy it. But 32 years in this game and having built over 50 guns I think I stand on firm ground with my opinion.

 

[F.G. Ford]

As most fellows have said the Middlesex double is junk.
You have posted a query here as to the thoughts on this questionable double, and you got their answers, it would seem that you have already made up your mind in purchasing this fine piece of junk.
The good people try to help those that ask for help......some don't listen. And so those that don't listen, will ultimately pay the price of ignorance.
This is not meant as an insult, just a friendly advice.
If you are going to hunt here in Canada, sooner or later you will have to obtain a complete hunting license, and not skirt around the angles.
Good luck in your quest.
Old Ford
Ontario, Canada

 

[Lorne Johnson]

The Middlesex gun is primarily a wall hanger. The locks are slow and relatively inconsistent. The gun is most unlikely to be quick handling. You are talking wing shooting here, and grouse to boot.

The suggestion of a good single-barrel fowler is probably the most rational approach here given your priorities. An old (read light-weight) Pedersoli SxS and struggle through the tests would be a good choice (that's what I mostly hunt upland game with).

 

[Robby]

Michael, Sometimes the heart wants what the heart wants, and will not be denied.
I don't know anything about the double you referenced, never seen one, other than your picture. I personally don't know anyone that has any hands on experience with one.
My main concern with it would be from a safety aspect. Again, I know NOTHING about these products.
If it is safe to use as it is sold, and you are good with tools and good at problem solving, and it is a piece of junk as sold, you might look at it as buying a set of parts for less money than the cost of a set of barrels. There is nothing made by man that cannot be made better. BUT, if there are safety issues, its not worth the price you will eventually pay. Good luck in your search.
Robby

 

[Grizzled Roberts]

I have one of the Middlesex double barrel flintlock shotguns. It handles great and patterns well. Mine turned out to be a 19 gage. The locks on mine were junk I replaced them with L&R Manton locks which made it a real shotgun. I also browned all the polished metal. I have friends who have also replaced the locks and one friend who had functional locks. The locks are a manure shoot with the odds against you. Still with the cost of the two replacement locks I wound up with a double barrel flintlock shotgun for well under $1000. All India made guns are kits but this was one of the easier ones.