Minie Bullet advice - .58 cal Musket Newbie

[commando223]

Hi everyone I'm new to this forum and muzzleloading in general Right now I have a new to me Armi Sport 1853 3-band Enfield I'm getting ready to shoot for the first time. I just need to order supplies. I bought 5 pounds of FFg Powder (3goex - 2 swiss) so I'm good on that but as far as ordering ammo I'm thinking of getting minie bullets and lubing them with bore butter but my question is how do I apply the lube to the bullet? just smear it all over or just in the rings? how about the base? would that affect the powder?

I was considering using round ball but I read that you must clean between shots and minie bullets are far more simple to use.

Any advice would be great and sorry if this has been posted before I just wanna be pointed in the right direction.

 

[mb3]

I used bore butter on my minnies and had very good results, but it was kind of messy. I swithched to SPG and also had good results with less mess. To answer your question, yes you can just smear it on the rings. I have heard you can also fill the base but I have never done that.

 

[commando223]

How do you apply the SPG lube? I've heard great things about it.

 

[Trot]

You will need to get the right size minie or accuracy will be poor. The minie should be no more than .002 under bore size. You can measure the bore, or get different size bullets to experiment with.

 

[Zonie]

I agree with Trot about the Minie' size and that's one of the hard parts about finding some of them that will shoot accurately.

There are a lot of various sizes available and many of the Rifled Muskets have a 3 groove rifling in them making it difficult to measure the bore.
You need to know the bore size to find the correct size Minie'.

Also, as you may know, Minie' bullets should not be shot using large powder loads.
A powder load of 60-70 grains is about right.

As for the need to wipe between shots when using patched roundballs I say Hooey.
There is no need to wipe between shots unless the fouling has accumulated to the point that ramming the lubricated patched roundball becomes difficult.

How many shots does this take? Anywhere from 3 to 10 or more depending on the powder and the lubrication that's being used and the humidity where your shooting.

Liquid patch lubes like Stumpkillers Moose Juice will automatically wipe the bore each time the patch/ball is loaded.

 

[charcoal]

I used a 50/50 mix of melted parafin wax and lithium grease. I dipped the mini-ball nose first in, to just depth of the edge of the base. Pulled them out and set them to cool.

 

[badpenny]

i put bore butter in the base of the minnie ball load and fire it.never had any problem,but i shoot it as soon as it's loaded.

 

[ken.clements]

good morning,
there’s lot’s of info here about .58 and minie’s. Take the time and look up a couple of the earlier posts.
the first thing is get ready to expieriment. If you think you can buy minie’s, powder, lube and shoot 9 out 10 rings......you will be the first here to do that.
first things first.....
Lube: Anything will do. It’s there to keep your barrel from leading. Some use motoroil and beeswax, others use ready made. I’ve tried everything I can buy or make and I get the best results from Wonderlube (and it smells nice). I lube the rings (rings full) not the nose or the inside of the base.
Powder: Weigh it, do not use volume measure methods. Every Powder burns differently, stick with one only untill you have the results you want. I use Swiss 2, 52.5 grains. I would suggest start with 50 grains, 2,5 grain incraments, 5 shot groups up to 62,5 grains. Any more than that is useless in finding your working load up to 100 Meters (yards). You are shooting for accuracy at paper targets up to 100 Meters (yards) and not trying to drop a Cape Buffalo charging at you.
Minie’s: Different weights and forms confuse everyone in the beginning. They all fly, some truer than others. I have had no luck with Lyman old style, new style, light minie’s. I use Lymann Parker Hale Minie, visually inspected, weighed. My 5 shot groupings weighed + / - 1 grain (=5 minie’s the same weight).
Shooting: Start at 50 Meters (yards), get your grouping together first. You need time and patience.

Take your time, have fun.

 

[Piotr20]

I am the proud owner of a 2 band parker hale enfield. I recently got it and my first time shooting it resulted in a minie being stuck 7" above the charge. You can read allll about it on here :hatsoff: I cannot stress lubing the minies enough. I now lube them with bore butter. A bit on the base and a nice thick layer on the grooves. I use the.577 minies from trackofthewolf.com and they work great. Today I was shooting 200 yards at a 14" steel plate. I rarely missed and in fact ended up damaging one of the chains holding it up :grin: Great rifles, great minies, great lube. I also clean the bore out every 5 shots or so. Not an intense cleaning, just enough to clean out a bit of the gunk.

 

[mb3]

I buy my SPG in the stick form and just rub it on the groves. I dont know how an Armi Sports CS Richmond (my rifle)compares to your rifle but I use both the 577-611 and 575-213 minnies and they both shoot well. The 577-611 groups a little better. For ball I have been using the .570 round ball with .015 lubed patches. When I get lazy or the rifle dirty I use the .010 lubed patches as they load easy and still provide good acuracy. I have shot as many as a dozen shots with the .010 patch and the rifle still loaded reasonably well.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

I disagree with the notion that minies "are far more simple to use". Quicker to load, yes, but getting accuracy with a minie can be quite a test of one's patience, involving lots of experimentation with a variety of minie bullets and powder charges. That can get to be pretty expensive whether you're buying experimental bullets or molds to cast your own. For that matter, casting minies can be a challenge in itself. Hollow base bullets are the most difficult to cast perfectly, especially in pure lead, where as round balls are the easiest of all projectiles to cast.
If you'll try a .570 ball, pillow ticking patch lubed with spit and 60-80 grains of powder I'd bet you get at least acceptable accuracy from your very first trial load. Using a wet lube you will not need to swab the bore at all. Balls cost less, kick less and shoot flatter, making hits on targets at unknown range much easier.

 

[MattNH]

i use crisco and squirt it in the hollow base, usually get good results

 

[Rifleman1776]

you can also fill the base

No. The base is meant to help expand the skirt to grip the rifling.
The grease grooves are meant to be.....uh ....greased. :wink: Use as the gun was designed to be used and you will get better and more consistent results.
The 'old style' minie is favored by the top CW musket shooters. Later I'll post some references by one of the country's greatest musket shots.

 

[Rifleman1776]

OK, here is my promised follow-up. The information was written by Robert J. Butcher, one of the winningnest musket shooters of his time at Friendship and elsewhere. His reccomendations are in the book Muzzle Loading Shooting and Winning with the Champions as compiled and edited by my old, departed, friend Don Davis.
Butcher said the original CW minies were lubricated, on the outside, with a mix of tallow and beeswax. The skirts were not filled.
After years and countless of rounds of experimentation he says the bullet (mini) that worked best for him was the 575213OS. This is the original (OS for "old style") CW minie design from the Lyman mould.
He also cautions against excessive charges in a CW style rifled musket, 60 gr. being nearly universle by avid shooters.

 

[rickystl]

I have a Euroarms 2-Band Enfield. (I hear the Parker Hale is more accurate?). I picked mine up at a local gun show a few years ago for $300.00. It was in un-fired condition. Sure glad I bought that one :haha: Starting out, I did everything wrong. I was trying to shoot minnies with 75 grains of FFG. Fortunately, I was able to talk to a long time shooter with the North/South Skirmish Assoc.who was able to educate me. He told me most of the shooters in the Association use 55-60 grains of FFG. Some like FFFG. He told me heavy charges will strip the skirts off the minnie balls. So, I stick with 60 grains and maintain good accuracy. The one problem I (and others) experience with these muskets is that they shoot HIGH. The fellow told me these muskets (like the C&B Revolvers) were all sighted in to be right on at 75 yards. Then he went into the history as to why. Anyway, I recently sent my barrel to Joe Fisher at Ball Accueacy and had him install a TALLER - semi-authentic looking front sight. My "therory" was that the taller front sight will allow me to sight the gun in more like a custom built round ball type gun. This way, I can carefully file the front sight where I want it. Anyway, it should be an interesting experiment. I'll Post a range report and let y'all know what happens. Rick.

 

[Piotr20]

I have the euroarms with the Parker Hale barrel off of DixieGW. Love it. Im working on getting my loads together, but so far am able to hit a 10" steel plate at 100 yards no problem.