Musket grain question

[Comfortably_Numb]

Mr. Kibler-

I didn't contact you first because my attempts to ask questions prior to ordering were unsuccessful. I tried the phone about a year ago; due to my hearing loss I had to have someone call for me. I think whoever was on the other end thought it was some kids messing around, as we got hung up on twice. I received no reply to a couple of emails. I did read every page at Kiblerslongrifles.com, and didn't notice the terms "red maple" or "soft maple" anywhere. It is my fault for not knowing I wasn't ordering a sugar maple stock, but it isn't like I didn't try to find out before ordering. I would have been willing to wait, and to pay more, for the wood I was expecting.

I posted here (without identifying the maker) because when I did try again to contact you, I wanted to be able to correctly describe what I saw as a potential issue. My previous experience stocking longrifles has been from quarter-sawn planks, so I've not encountered this grain structure in the wrist. Between the grain structure in the wrist and the degree of mineral staining, I wondered if I had accidentally received a "second" (but remember, at that point I still thought the stock was sugar maple).

One of the fellows who stopped by last night worked for the FPL for about a decade and had some neat tricks up his sleeve. He did a ferrous sulfate test that showed the wood is definitely red maple (and I now have a blue spot in the barrel channel). He also brought a nifty doohickey to field-test hardness that indicated an estimate Janka hardness at different spots on the butt ranged from ~850 to ~1,000 (and now I have a few dents to steam out).

The consensus seems to be that I don't need to worry about the grain in the wrist (I didn't know). I've got dents to steam out, a crack to glue, and half a pin-knot to excise and patch. Then I can get this put together. What I previously characterized as "soft spots" won't affect function, just whether or not I carve the stock. I've not had satisfactory results carving wood that varies in hardness this much, but someone else might. I don't have much experience "blending in" mineral streaks, so I'll test both asphaltum and ferric nitrate in the barrel channel before staining the stock.

God bless Kibler for his patience.

 

[James Kibler]

Okay…. First let me mention again we are here to help and we know our products better than anyone.

I’m not sure what trouble you encountered previously, but we have two sales employees who’s job is to answer the phone, take orders and answer questions. They can be reached at 330-551-5844 or email at [email protected]. Do not call or message myself or Katherine regarding orders or questions about our products. If you call Katherine or me, you might or might not get reach us.

As to the stock, we would have been happy to exchange it for a stock made of sugar maple if you would have just asked. This won’t be possible now since you’ve indented / cracked the stock from unnecessary hardness testing. Again, you can find any answer you might need just by asking. We are on your side.

As to the carvability of the wood, I can assure you it will be fine with reasonable techniques. If you feel uncertain, I invite you to our shop and can help get you started. If you look at some of my work, you should see that I know how to carve.

Finally, probably 95 percent or more of all kit guns produced in maple are red maple. This is the industry standard. We do however have sugar maple at times or on request.

PLEASE, let me know if you have any questions or if we can help.

Oh, don’t forget about considering the iron nitrate stain. I’m pretty sure it will give you the best results.

Jim

 

[James Kibler]

Thanks Comfortably Numb Brooks! I need all the help I can get.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Thanks Comfortably Numb Brooks! I need all the help I can get.

No problem. This can be a very challenging place.

 

[tom mesa]

God bless Kibler for his patience.

Truer words were never spoken.

 

[LongWalker]

Okay…. First let me mention again we are here to help and we know our products better than anyone.

I’m not sure what trouble you encountered previously, but we have two sales employees who’s job is to answer the phone, take orders and answer questions. They can be reached at 330-551-5844 or email at [email protected]. Do not call or message myself or Katherine regarding orders or questions about our products. If you call Katherine or me, you might or might not get reach us.

As to the stock, we would have been happy to exchange it for a stock made of sugar maple if you would have just asked. This won’t be possible now since you’ve indented / cracked the stock from unnecessary hardness testing. Again, you can find any answer you might need just by asking. We are on your side.

As to the carvability of the wood, I can assure you it will be fine with reasonable techniques. If you feel uncertain, I invite you to our shop and can help get you started. If you look at some of my work, you should see that I know how to carve.

Finally, probably 95 percent or more of all kit guns produced in maple are red maple. This is the industry standard. We do however have sugar maple at times or on request.

PLEASE, let me know if you have any questions or if we can help.

Oh, don’t forget about considering the iron nitrate stain. I’m pretty sure it will give you the best results.

Jim

The calls were made to the number posted as contact information on the website. The emails were sent to [email protected]. I have no idea why I didn't get answers: I'm not the business owner, I'm a customer more than 1,000 miles away. I asked, I received no response, I searched your website. What further should I have done to try to get answers?

Before testing the hardness of the wood, I'd accepted that this was the stock I was going to use. At that point in time, the type of maple used to make the stock was still unknown to me. I've not sought an exchange (though I do appreciate knowing after the fact that it might have been an option). The dents were done to get quantifiable data about the hardness of the stock, and steamed out nicely. The crack (a typical drying/shipping crack in the forend) was on the stock when i removed the stock from the box, and disappeared with a couple minutes work.

Kits are not something I "do"; the purchase of this kit was an experiment and an expediency for me. I'm no more familiar with the "industry standard" wood of choice than any newbie would be. Had information been available (e.g., had the type of maple been mentioned on the website, or hard maple been listed with walnut and cherry as options), I could have made an informed decision. Lacking that information my decision was based on prior knowledge, with the expectation that hard maple is what is used for stockwood.

I appreciate the invitation to stop by more than I can say, but unfortunately you're about an 18-hour drive away. I'm well aware of your skill as a carver, I was an active participant over on ALR for many years and clearly recall your work. My skills are far from that level, and not up to incised carving in this wood. The rifle was purchased primarily for teaching newbies: I'd rather have an uncarved rifle for this than one with less-than-my-best carving. The rifle will have a decent barrel and the best production lock I've ever seen, and that will be enough.

 

[64Springer]

Fret not.

I brought enough for everyone.