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My drum is broken ?
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Pittsburghunter
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CVA will fix it for $65 they put on a new one and replace the breech for that price. both kinda go together.
JOHN L. HINNANT
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Greetings NYhunter,
While I do not know what the CVA drum threads are, there is a good possibility they are meteric.
Since the drum is sheared off flush, you might be able to remove the remaing portion with a tool called an Ezeout (pronounced easy out)
The key is a product called KROIL and PATIENCE, PATIENCE, PATIENCE, and more PATIENCE.
Apply the KROIL around the threadeds, insert the Ezeout into the drum fire chamber, and tap the Ezeout in place with a light weight hammer.
The idea is to start a viberation that starts the KROIL to working into the threads.
GENTLY, GENTLY turn the Ezeout with a SMALL wrench while tapping on the Ezeout with a hammer. You might get lucky and have the drum screw right out. The odds are 50-50.
If it is stuck, keep applying KROIL while tapping on and turning the Ezeout at least once a day.
Eventually the sheared drum will begin to move.
Once the broken part is removed, you can determine the thread size and order a new drum from CVA.
If memory serves me correctly, I think the CVA factory drum nipple threads are meteric, thus requiring a special nipple. If you have the capability, you might want to consider making a new drum that uses the standard 1/4 - 28 NF nipple threads. Stainless steel drums are also nice.
If the nipple threads are not meteric, I stand corrected.
Whatever you do, DONOT,DONOT, REPEAT DONOT, attempt to remove a CVA breech before removing the drum.
The CVA is designed with the drum screwed into the breech. This locks the breech into place.
Best regards and good shooting,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
While I do not know what the CVA drum threads are, there is a good possibility they are meteric.
Since the drum is sheared off flush, you might be able to remove the remaing portion with a tool called an Ezeout (pronounced easy out)
The key is a product called KROIL and PATIENCE, PATIENCE, PATIENCE, and more PATIENCE.
Apply the KROIL around the threadeds, insert the Ezeout into the drum fire chamber, and tap the Ezeout in place with a light weight hammer.
The idea is to start a viberation that starts the KROIL to working into the threads.
GENTLY, GENTLY turn the Ezeout with a SMALL wrench while tapping on the Ezeout with a hammer. You might get lucky and have the drum screw right out. The odds are 50-50.
If it is stuck, keep applying KROIL while tapping on and turning the Ezeout at least once a day.
Eventually the sheared drum will begin to move.
Once the broken part is removed, you can determine the thread size and order a new drum from CVA.
If memory serves me correctly, I think the CVA factory drum nipple threads are meteric, thus requiring a special nipple. If you have the capability, you might want to consider making a new drum that uses the standard 1/4 - 28 NF nipple threads. Stainless steel drums are also nice.
If the nipple threads are not meteric, I stand corrected.
Whatever you do, DONOT,DONOT, REPEAT DONOT, attempt to remove a CVA breech before removing the drum.
The CVA is designed with the drum screwed into the breech. This locks the breech into place.
Best regards and good shooting,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
NYhunter: For what it's worth, Dixie Gunworks lists a drum for the CVA Precussion rifles.
They say the thread is a 10 X 1.25mm thread and their 2005 catalog price was $5.25 plus postage.
Their part number for this is NP0905 (NP zero nine zero five).
That 10 mm thread would have an outside diameter of .393 inches.
They say the thread is a 10 X 1.25mm thread and their 2005 catalog price was $5.25 plus postage.
Their part number for this is NP0905 (NP zero nine zero five).
That 10 mm thread would have an outside diameter of .393 inches.
Pittsburghunter
50 Cal.
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Zonie doesn't it need to be tapped by a special tool after replacement or is that only if they replace the breech as well? CVA told me doing one required replacing the other. I called them to get a new drum for my Missori rifle and that's what they told me. I guess I should order one myself if this is the case. :hmm:
Well, I'm not sure what your Missouri rifle is built like, but as you know, there are several different types of Precussion systems.
The type with a "snail" which has the nipple hole as an integral part of the breecn would require replacement of the entire breech.
Rifles with this type of breech are the TC guns, the Lyman Great Plains etc.
Then there is the precussion system which uses a side drum. Rifles that come to mind are some of the older CVAs, Junkers, and most of the Custom Precussion Kentucky/Tennessee rifles.
This side drum just screws into a threaded hole in the side of the barrel and it has little if anything to do with the breech plug.
Speaking of the side drum system, the main requirements of installing one is that the threads are trimmed back so the threaded area does not project into the bore of the gun.
The other requirement is that the nipple is properly aligned with the hammer. This is not always easy to do if the nipple hole is pre-existing like Dixie says their replacement drum is.
When building a gun with this side drum system, the drum is screwed tightly into the barrel. The barrel is then installed into the stock with the lock. The hammer on the lock tells the builder where to locate the hole for the nipple. After drilling and tapping the threads in the nipple hole, if everything was done correctly, the nipple will be aligned with the hammer.
With the pre drilled drum like Dixie sells, the game plan would be to install it and hope the nipple hole is close to where it should be.
If it is just a little below the hammer nose, adding a little more torque to tightening it might align things. If it does, your in business.
If it doesn't, my method would be to remove a little material from the shoulder of the drum, adjacent to the threads. This would allow it to screw in a little further thereby allowing the nipple to rotate up to align with the hammer.
A cruder but not necessarly worse method would be to tighten the drum in the barrel. If the nipple rotates past the hammer nose before the drum is tight, remove the drum and apply LocTite thread locking compound to the threads. Screw the drum in until it bottoms and then back if off until the nipple aligns with the hammer nose. Let it sit there while the thread locking compound cures.
If everything is "right", the drum will be supported by the lock when the barrel is installed. Because of this, the threads really don't have to absorb the impact of the hammer hitting the nipple so the only thing they have to do is to keep the drum from blowing out the side of the barrel when the gun is fired.
Many of the less expensive or poorly made guns locate the drum up above the lockplate so the drum is not supported. In these guns, the threads have to take all of the shear force of the hammer hitting the nipple. This can cause the threads to fail, and I wouldn't be suprised to find that the gun which is the subject of this post failed for exactly this reason.
It's not PC by any means, but if your gun has a side drum which is not supported by the lockplate, it is a good idea to apply some grease to the outside of it. Then mix up some strong Epoxy, the kind with steel fillers in it and apply a little to the lock plate where the drum will fit. Reinstall the barrel letting the drum settle in this Epoxy bed until it hardens. Remove the barrel and file/sand off the extra Epoxy from the sides of the lockplate. This will help absorb the impact of the hammer when it hits the nipple.
(Your Results may vary)
Zonie
The type with a "snail" which has the nipple hole as an integral part of the breecn would require replacement of the entire breech.
Rifles with this type of breech are the TC guns, the Lyman Great Plains etc.
Then there is the precussion system which uses a side drum. Rifles that come to mind are some of the older CVAs, Junkers, and most of the Custom Precussion Kentucky/Tennessee rifles.
This side drum just screws into a threaded hole in the side of the barrel and it has little if anything to do with the breech plug.
Speaking of the side drum system, the main requirements of installing one is that the threads are trimmed back so the threaded area does not project into the bore of the gun.
The other requirement is that the nipple is properly aligned with the hammer. This is not always easy to do if the nipple hole is pre-existing like Dixie says their replacement drum is.
When building a gun with this side drum system, the drum is screwed tightly into the barrel. The barrel is then installed into the stock with the lock. The hammer on the lock tells the builder where to locate the hole for the nipple. After drilling and tapping the threads in the nipple hole, if everything was done correctly, the nipple will be aligned with the hammer.
With the pre drilled drum like Dixie sells, the game plan would be to install it and hope the nipple hole is close to where it should be.
If it is just a little below the hammer nose, adding a little more torque to tightening it might align things. If it does, your in business.
If it doesn't, my method would be to remove a little material from the shoulder of the drum, adjacent to the threads. This would allow it to screw in a little further thereby allowing the nipple to rotate up to align with the hammer.
A cruder but not necessarly worse method would be to tighten the drum in the barrel. If the nipple rotates past the hammer nose before the drum is tight, remove the drum and apply LocTite thread locking compound to the threads. Screw the drum in until it bottoms and then back if off until the nipple aligns with the hammer nose. Let it sit there while the thread locking compound cures.
If everything is "right", the drum will be supported by the lock when the barrel is installed. Because of this, the threads really don't have to absorb the impact of the hammer hitting the nipple so the only thing they have to do is to keep the drum from blowing out the side of the barrel when the gun is fired.
Many of the less expensive or poorly made guns locate the drum up above the lockplate so the drum is not supported. In these guns, the threads have to take all of the shear force of the hammer hitting the nipple. This can cause the threads to fail, and I wouldn't be suprised to find that the gun which is the subject of this post failed for exactly this reason.
It's not PC by any means, but if your gun has a side drum which is not supported by the lockplate, it is a good idea to apply some grease to the outside of it. Then mix up some strong Epoxy, the kind with steel fillers in it and apply a little to the lock plate where the drum will fit. Reinstall the barrel letting the drum settle in this Epoxy bed until it hardens. Remove the barrel and file/sand off the extra Epoxy from the sides of the lockplate. This will help absorb the impact of the hammer when it hits the nipple.
(Your Results may vary)
Zonie
I just replaced the drum on my 1970's vintage CVA Mountain rifle for under $5.00. A local shop had one. :thumbsup:
Pittsburghunter
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Interesting I guess the boys at CVA just wanted to look at my rifle for a spell seeing as they have forgoten what sidelocks look like :rotf:
I just fixed one a few weeks ago.........Go to Dixie Gun Works site and buy a Drum and Nipple size 1/4x28 with the 7/16'ths drum size.... Buy yourself a 1/4 x28 tap and appropriate drill bit and drill and tap the hole in whats left of your drum...........I did this on a CVA Bobcat............BTW your new nipple will be the same 1/4x28 size..............Good Luck
JOHN L. HINNANT
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Greetings NYhunter and All,
Well getting a new drum so easily is cetainly good news, but you have neglected to tell us how you removed the broken part of the drum left in the barrel.
Best regards,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
Well getting a new drum so easily is cetainly good news, but you have neglected to tell us how you removed the broken part of the drum left in the barrel.
Best regards,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
Sounds like you done good!!
While modern high power rifles use ultra strong steel and other finicky parts, these good ole muzzleloaders are fairly easy to work on.
One more good thing to say about them!
While modern high power rifles use ultra strong steel and other finicky parts, these good ole muzzleloaders are fairly easy to work on.
One more good thing to say about them!
JOHN L. HINNANT
45 Cal.
- Joined
- May 29, 2004
- Messages
- 711
- Reaction score
- 2
Greetings NYhunter,
Good show. Sounds like patience an persisience paid off.
Did you pre-treat the threads with any kind of penetrating oi and for how long? Was it helpful?
If you have access to a metal turning lathe, you might want to consider making a few spare drums. I like to use Type 304 or 306 Stainless Steel. Actually any stainles steel that can be easily filed can be easily machined.
Of course, stainless steel is not PC, but neither are the Green Mountain Stainless Steel barrels.
Best regards and good shooting,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
Good show. Sounds like patience an persisience paid off.
Did you pre-treat the threads with any kind of penetrating oi and for how long? Was it helpful?
If you have access to a metal turning lathe, you might want to consider making a few spare drums. I like to use Type 304 or 306 Stainless Steel. Actually any stainles steel that can be easily filed can be easily machined.
Of course, stainless steel is not PC, but neither are the Green Mountain Stainless Steel barrels.
Best regards and good shooting,
John L. Hinnant
If you are not an NRA Member, why not? I am carrying your load.
