NAA Super companion

[SwampBilly]

I have a North American arms super companion 22 caliber muzzle loading revolver. Misfires are very frequent.

I'm using Swiss 4f powder that was just open the other day and has never been exposed to moisture. I have used several different brands of number 11 percussion caps and all have misfires. CCI number 11 and RSW number 11s and Winchester magnum number 11 and Remington number 10s.

I know they recommend Remington number 11 but I haven't been able to get my hands on any. Could they really be that much different than all of the rest of them?

I use all of these same percussion caps on my 1858 with misfires being exceedingly rare. I am thinking that the tiny Hammer just does not hit that transfer bar firing pin hard enough consistently. The gun has fired less than 50 rounds. The other day I fired a cylinder loaded with four rounds. The first round misfired, the second round misfired and the third round went off while the fourth round also misfired. The first round went off after being struck twice.

I struck the other two rounds repeatedly with no fire until I pulled off the percussion caps and replaced them. They were getting hit hard enough that the priming compound had come out of the cups.

Does anyone else have one of these and what is your experience? Also during penetration testing, it seems that when it is loaded with hodgdon triple 7 2f equivalent.... The bullets get more penetration than when loaded with an equal amount by volume of Swiss 4f. But 95% of my firing has been with the Swiss 4f.

 

[Bad Karma]

I would expect more energy from the T7 powder than Swiss. Not much really, especially in a revolver like yours with its small bore and short barrel.
I wonder if the caps are fitted properly to the cones… as you say, the hammer is very small and it also has to transfer energy through the transfer bar? Seems like perfectly seated caps would be critical.
edit: yes, Remington 11’s are different from the other caps. Dimensions really matter here.

 

[SwampBilly]

I would expect more energy from the T7 powder than Swiss. Not much really, especially in a revolver like yours with its small bore and short barrel.
I wonder if the caps are fitted properly to the cones… as you say, the hammer is very small and it also has to transfer energy through the transfer bar? Seems like perfectly seated caps would be critical.
edit: yes, Remington 11’s are different from the other caps. Dimensions really matter here.

Thanks for the info, I do have to slightly pinch all but the Remington number 10 caps that I have mentioned.

Locating Remington number 11 caps seems to be like locating hen's teeth at the moment

 

[SwampBilly]

My completely unscientific way of determining the 777 is hotter?

Shooting at an old freezer door with 4f was producing dents in the metal but the triple 7 was actually penetrating

 

[windini]

My completely unscientific way of determining the 777 is hotter?

Shooting at an old freezer door with 4f was producing dents in the metal but the triple 7 was actually penetrating

AH yes: the Refrigograph!

Is there room to get a small dowel end onto the cap to seat it firmly on the nipple? That might help eliminate one variable - shock-absorbing empty space btw the cap compound and the "anvil" (nipple). Or is the diameter of the caps you have so large that it won't stay seated?

 

[SwampBilly]

AH yes: the Refrigograph!

Is there room to get a small dowel end onto the cap to seat it firmly on the nipple? That might help eliminate one variable - shock-absorbing empty space btw the cap compound and the "anvil" (nipple). Or is the diameter of the caps you have so large that it won't stay seated?

I have tried pushing them down as firmly as possible. All but the Remington number 10s that I mentioned require a little pinch of the cap or they fit loosely.

And judging by the way that the priming compound falls out of the Caps that I have to remove after several good strikes.... Tells me they should be getting hit against the anvil pretty good.

At least I would think so. Because I was going to take the removed caps and try them on my 1858 but it had all fallen out

 

[Jim in Wisconsin]

I think if you want a good, reliable Companion, you should get a dog.

 

[necchi]

Misfires are very frequent.

Want the truth?
You should have very judiciously cleaned the nipples and chambers of all oils "before" you popped the first cap.
Any storage/shipping oils left in any gun will immediately foul the fire channel when present during a shot, and cause exactly what you describe.
It would have been a good idea to follow their directions prior to shooting.

 

[necchi]

I know,, reality suck's, right?

 

[SwampBilly]

I know,, reality suck's, right?

Like making assumptions about things that you don't know of?

 

[BBGun]

I have a North American arms super companion 22 caliber muzzle loading revolver. Misfires are very frequent.

I'm using Swiss 4f powder that was just open the other day and has never been exposed to moisture. I have used several different brands of number 11 percussion caps and all have misfires. CCI number 11 and RSW number 11s and Winchester magnum number 11 and Remington number 10s.

I know they recommend Remington number 11 but I haven't been able to get my hands on any. Could they really be that much different than all of the rest of them?

I use all of these same percussion caps on my 1858 with misfires being exceedingly rare. I am thinking that the tiny Hammer just does not hit that transfer bar firing pin hard enough consistently. The gun has fired less than 50 rounds. The other day I fired a cylinder loaded with four rounds. The first round misfired, the second round misfired and the third round went off while the fourth round also misfired. The first round went off after being struck twice.

I struck the other two rounds repeatedly with no fire until I pulled off the percussion caps and replaced them. They were getting hit hard enough that the priming compound had come out of the cups.

Does anyone else have one of these and what is your experience? Also during penetration testing, it seems that when it is loaded with hodgdon triple 7 2f equivalent.... The bullets get more penetration than when loaded with an equal amount by volume of Swiss 4f. But 95% of my firing has been with the Swiss 4f.

Well ant that a cute little pop gun, I bet it's a hoot to shoot!
Probably can find the answer here.

 

[Sparkitoff]

Mine works flawlessly with the Remington #11 caps. No other cap is reliable as they are either pushed down on the nipple or mushroomed when the hammer strikes. You know they have a Lifetime Warranty. I've sent mine back twice for other things and it was repaired and returned each time at no cost.

 

[user 16256]

I have a North American arms super companion 22 caliber muzzle loading revolver. Misfires are very frequent.

I'm using Swiss 4f powder that was just open the other day and has never been exposed to moisture. I have used several different brands of number 11 percussion caps and all have misfires. CCI number 11 and RSW number 11s and Winchester magnum number 11 and Remington number 10s.

I know they recommend Remington number 11 but I haven't been able to get my hands on any. Could they really be that much different than all of the rest of them?

I use all of these same percussion caps on my 1858 with misfires being exceedingly rare. I am thinking that the tiny Hammer just does not hit that transfer bar firing pin hard enough consistently. The gun has fired less than 50 rounds. The other day I fired a cylinder loaded with four rounds. The first round misfired, the second round misfired and the third round went off while the fourth round also misfired. The first round went off after being struck twice.

I struck the other two rounds repeatedly with no fire until I pulled off the percussion caps and replaced them. They were getting hit hard enough that the priming compound had come out of the cups.

Does anyone else have one of these and what is your experience? Also during penetration testing, it seems that when it is loaded with hodgdon triple 7 2f equivalent.... The bullets get more penetration than when loaded with an equal amount by volume of Swiss 4f. But 95% of my firing has been with the Swiss 4f.

I have one of each of the NAA bp revolvers. I use CCI magnum #11 caps. I bought 10,000 of them back in the day when they were plentiful and cheap. I only use the magnums on the NAA revolvers. I also only use triple seven ground in a mortar and pestal to a powder to increase volume. This makes the magnum version perform on par to a 22lr verified by chronograph. Triple 7 has approximately 20% more power for the same volume as traditional BP.
I rarely have a misfire when they are clean. After shooting a cylinder several times without cleaning it does happen on occasion but almost always goes off with a second strike. One thing I do after loading the bullet with the included tool is to spin the cylinder in that tool and gently mash the primers into the rubber material on the handle to seat them. I've never had one go off while doing this, but I always keep the business end pointed away from my vital parts just in case. Wear a good leather glove if you have doubts.
Practice this method to seat caps with caps only, no powder in the cylinder, until you get it down. If it still misfires, you have a problem.
The hammer on these is flat and uses a round disc shaped transfer bar type thingy on a tiny spring. It may be misshaped, not flat, or out of alignment. It may be stuck, or you may have a weak mainspring. If you don't have eagle eye vision or have never taken apart a regular sized revolver and aren't familiar with what all the parts are and where they should go, absolutely DO NOT take one of these little things apart. NAA used to send them with a warning about disassembley. I figured the warning didn't apply to me and took my first one apart to clean. After 4 hours searching the living room carpet for a spring the size of a splinter, I was finally able to put the little b@stard back together.
Call NAA. Mail it to them, and they will fix it for you and mail it back.
If you plan on shooting more than 100 rounds through it, go ahead and order a new cylinder pin and nipples while your at it. The pin is the weakest link on these and it can get bent and slightly elongate after 100 rounds or so.

 

[PastorB]

I got an old Super Companion that I have shot once in the last 20 years. Mine came with instructions to only use Remington #10 caps, I heard the newer ones are made to use Remington #11's. Mine would only fire with Remington #10's, and the cylinder could not be re-inserted with any other cap. I have maybe shot it 50 times or so, it just really isn't all that fun. I have shot it over the chrono with various powders, using the supplied 30 grain bullets. Max charges, so much so I could only seat the bullets with Herculean effort, resulted in mediocre results. Less than max charges were dismal and varied wildly. According to my notes, 4f Goex gave 650 fps, Swiss 3f and Pyro P was a little better at around 700 fps, and 3f 777 about 50 fps more. 40% of my bullets hit sideways, keyholing, at a few feet distance. MY gun came with instructions that a certain powder, named after the center ring of a target, could be used. I tried that and got scary high velocities. I would not recommend it. Additionally I heard the ATF took a dim view of those instructions and required NAA to quit publishing that information. In my opinion, anybody curious about these guns would be well advised to squash their curiosity and not waste money purchasing a NAA cap and ball revolvers.

 

[BBGun]

I have a North American arms super companion 22 caliber muzzle loading revolver. Misfires are very frequent.

I'm using Swiss 4f powder that was just open the other day and has never been exposed to moisture. I have used several different brands of number 11 percussion caps and all have misfires. CCI number 11 and RSW number 11s and Winchester magnum number 11 and Remington number 10s.

I know they recommend Remington number 11 but I haven't been able to get my hands on any. Could they really be that much different than all of the rest of them?

I use all of these same percussion caps on my 1858 with misfires being exceedingly rare. I am thinking that the tiny Hammer just does not hit that transfer bar firing pin hard enough consistently. The gun has fired less than 50 rounds. The other day I fired a cylinder loaded with four rounds. The first round misfired, the second round misfired and the third round went off while the fourth round also misfired. The first round went off after being struck twice.

I struck the other two rounds repeatedly with no fire until I pulled off the percussion caps and replaced them. They were getting hit hard enough that the priming compound had come out of the cups.

Does anyone else have one of these and what is your experience? Also during penetration testing, it seems that when it is loaded with hodgdon triple 7 2f equivalent.... The bullets get more penetration than when loaded with an equal amount by volume of Swiss 4f. But 95% of my firing has been with the Swiss 4f.

Nice looking little thing, Search YouTube for some info on this it's there.

 

[Brazos John]

I have some old Remington caps that have a membrane or some kind of coating that comes loose and that has blocked the fire channel in the nipple. I clear the nipple, and it fires again.
After a FTF, have you removed the cap and pricked the nipple?
Just a thought. Hope you figure it out.