Gleason.Chapman
32 Cal.
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- Dec 23, 2004
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Both guns were .50 cal inlines. Chap Gleason
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Need Advice on a Elk Muzzleloader
- Thread starter Hiker
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
I agree with Slenk about the reliability of in-lines vs. traditional frontloaders. I shoot mainly flintlocks and, though I rarely use the range at Friendship (I'm a member and I can, but I've got closer places where I can play alone), on two occasions I've watched between shots while in-line owners fussed and cussed over their rifles not functioning. The irony of the one case was that the two proud owners of new Remington 700 muzzleloaders had just been lecturing me on how a flintlock isn't a "serious" hunting gun. Unreliable, inaccurate, etc -- they said.
It's all about maintenance of your firearm. A traditional sidelock with a fast-twist barrel will do anything an in-line will; a well-placed shot with a roundball will do anything a conical or saboted pistol bullet will. Plus, you might not place much value, now, on the traditional aspects of muzzleloading, but shooting, hunting with, and eventually killing your deer or elk with a traditional gun is -- indescribable. Trust me on this. I shot modern guns throughout my life. To this day I could own and use pretty much anything I want. My weapon of choice is a .50 flinter with a 43-inch barrel -- it does any job I ask of it and shoots a whole lot better than I do.
It's all about maintenance of your firearm. A traditional sidelock with a fast-twist barrel will do anything an in-line will; a well-placed shot with a roundball will do anything a conical or saboted pistol bullet will. Plus, you might not place much value, now, on the traditional aspects of muzzleloading, but shooting, hunting with, and eventually killing your deer or elk with a traditional gun is -- indescribable. Trust me on this. I shot modern guns throughout my life. To this day I could own and use pretty much anything I want. My weapon of choice is a .50 flinter with a 43-inch barrel -- it does any job I ask of it and shoots a whole lot better than I do.
You guys know your stuff. Great points, you hit a couple hot buttons on that post and I really appreciate all of you taking time to educate me a little.
Wow, .62 that is a hunk of lead. How far will that shoot accurately?
I appreciate all the help and will let you know what route I go.
Jeff
Wow, .62 that is a hunk of lead. How far will that shoot accurately?
I appreciate all the help and will let you know what route I go.
Jeff
bradmartin
40 Cal.
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- May 7, 2005
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Welcome to the forum Hiker. What states are you going to hunt in?
Hiker- Echoing previous sentiments, I have several friends out here in CO as well who use inlines, I use a .50 Great Plains 1:32 for conical. Everytime we go out with them I take all the jibes about Daniel Boone and how I should be wearing buckskins etc. Yet everytime we head out those same inliners are always fiddling with their equipment because something isn't working. And the best they can do at 100 yrds. is a hubcap sized group. Yet I have put 6 shots into a 1.75" hole at 100 yds. with my Lyman GP using a 395 grn. Lyman Plains Conical Bullet, w/bore butter lube (off a rest) and have never had a misfire rain or shine.
I have reliably taken cow elk in CO out to 75 yards with said conical bullet (90 grns. ffg). I wouldn't go much past 100 yards (2.5 inches of bullet drop using these bullets from 50 - 100yds) In all cases I would opt for a minimum of .54 caliber (I'm asking for the spare .54 barrel from Santa wife this year). Even with well placed shots the .50 just doesn't seem to fold them up like a .54 can.
Also I have read on this forum that folks using the fast twist barrels have also been able to achieve acceptable accuracy out of PRB through the same barrel. So you have that option if you want to exercise it.
Remember in CO that you cannot use sabots or powerbelts during Muzzleloading season, PRB or pure lead conicals only. Best of luck!
I have reliably taken cow elk in CO out to 75 yards with said conical bullet (90 grns. ffg). I wouldn't go much past 100 yards (2.5 inches of bullet drop using these bullets from 50 - 100yds) In all cases I would opt for a minimum of .54 caliber (I'm asking for the spare .54 barrel from Santa wife this year). Even with well placed shots the .50 just doesn't seem to fold them up like a .54 can.
Also I have read on this forum that folks using the fast twist barrels have also been able to achieve acceptable accuracy out of PRB through the same barrel. So you have that option if you want to exercise it.
Remember in CO that you cannot use sabots or powerbelts during Muzzleloading season, PRB or pure lead conicals only. Best of luck!
pennsyltucky
40 Cal.
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- Jul 23, 2005
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Hiker said:
just as far if not farther than the smaller bore. my .62 shoots 1360 +/- with a .610 ball and 100g ffg. its a smoothbore and i can shoot 4" groups at 75 yards with it. i load it up a little more for bear huntin. i used 130g ffg and it shot 1510fps. 1480fps with the "dangerous game slug" from ballistic products.[url] http://shop2.mailordercentral.com/bpicart/prodinfo.asp?number=0721620[/url]
my barrel has a screw in mod choke and the ball is a nice tight fit through it since i dont use a patch. just the wads. i am sure that the choke stops any spin on the ball because all of my retrieved balls are smashed perpendicular to the ring left by the choke. i guess that has nothing to do with the question at hand tho....
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pennsyltucky
40 Cal.
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- Jul 23, 2005
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want a real gun? how bout a .72 rifled double? that'll kill it whatever it is!!!!
[url] http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=40918880[/url]
[url] http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=40918880[/url]
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Scarecrow,
I live in Colorado and plan on hunting here, plus I am planning on hunting NM/UT as soon as I get drawn on a tag. Down the road I'd like to bring a couple of my kids and hunt Idaho in the youth program you have there. I'll have to hand it to Idaho, they are doing the best job on promoting the future of hunting with their youth mentor program, incredible deal.
Jeff
I live in Colorado and plan on hunting here, plus I am planning on hunting NM/UT as soon as I get drawn on a tag. Down the road I'd like to bring a couple of my kids and hunt Idaho in the youth program you have there. I'll have to hand it to Idaho, they are doing the best job on promoting the future of hunting with their youth mentor program, incredible deal.
Jeff
Styr and you others,
Slowly you guys are changing my thinking. I'm open to going traditional but I want to make sure I get a good shooter that is accurate and will shoot out to 125-150 yards and kill a Elk, dead, if that is possible.
What would be my best choice, if I went traditional?
In rifle season, I use a .300 Winchester Magnum in a Weatherby Vanguard, because I want to be able to reach out and touch em. I know with a MZ I'll be limited to 125-150 yards but want to get the best shooter that I can.
Thanks,
Jeff
Slowly you guys are changing my thinking. I'm open to going traditional but I want to make sure I get a good shooter that is accurate and will shoot out to 125-150 yards and kill a Elk, dead, if that is possible.
What would be my best choice, if I went traditional?
In rifle season, I use a .300 Winchester Magnum in a Weatherby Vanguard, because I want to be able to reach out and touch em. I know with a MZ I'll be limited to 125-150 yards but want to get the best shooter that I can.
Thanks,
Jeff
pennsyltucky
40 Cal.
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u should look at the lyman great plains hunter. in .54.
its a faster twist barrel for use with the bullets u will be using.
[url] http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976652916.htm[/url]
its a faster twist barrel for use with the bullets u will be using.
[url] http://www.gunsamerica.com/guns/976652916.htm[/url]
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I think you will do well to follow Jim Bobs advise it is the best of the bunch so far many longtime Trad ML Elk hunters use the RB in .54 or .58 and use good judgement in range and shot placement and have not found the need to use modern design conical bullets. these guys have been doing it for 30 years, I have found the .50 will work but you must really watch the range and think like a bowhunter and hold yer water till they get real close, even with the bigger bores with open sights 75 yds is a good limit on the range, if you have to shoot out to 125 yds a ML may not be the best choice.
Hiker, Check the stats on a ML at those distances. I've shot a few elk and they're big animals. For me, 100 yds is about it. MLs lose alot of energy beyond 100 yds.
I'm a trad bowhunter at heart, so the hunt for me is getting close to the animal. Not saying it can't be done, just I don't like to shoot beyond 100 yds.
I'm a trad bowhunter at heart, so the hunt for me is getting close to the animal. Not saying it can't be done, just I don't like to shoot beyond 100 yds.
longcruise
70 Cal.
Hiker, as said before in this thread, in CO it's no sabots, scopes or pelletized powder in the ML only season. I think you can use those things in the regular rifle season if you wish.
Here's my thopughts on this. If you are set on using a .50 cal get one that will shoot a conical. That would include the TC Hawken and Renegade since they will both shoot them well. There's also the Lyman fast twist gun too.
If you are going to shoot round balls get a .54 minimum cal even though the .50 is legal for round balls.
The NEF will probably work ok but if you must shoot conicals avoid the .54 since the extra conical weight will only abuse you and the .50 with a conical has more than enough killing power.
Here's my thopughts on this. If you are set on using a .50 cal get one that will shoot a conical. That would include the TC Hawken and Renegade since they will both shoot them well. There's also the Lyman fast twist gun too.
If you are going to shoot round balls get a .54 minimum cal even though the .50 is legal for round balls.
The NEF will probably work ok but if you must shoot conicals avoid the .54 since the extra conical weight will only abuse you and the .50 with a conical has more than enough killing power.
Jeff
I bought one of those new fangel muzzleloaders to start with. Then I found a side hammer CVA Kentucky rifle. :grin: Well the inline is out the door :blah: and the Kentucky stays. :thumbsup: Shooting the PRB is a lot more fun. :rotf: Buy the tradional. Own a real muzzleloader. :hatsoff:
I bought one of those new fangel muzzleloaders to start with.
Then I found a side hammer CVA Kentucky rifle. :grin: Well the inline is out the door :blah: and the Kentucky stays. :thumbsup: Shooting the PRB is a lot more fun. :rotf: Buy the tradional. Own a real muzzleloader. :hatsoff:
Actually you can use an in-line MZ in Oregon. It has to have an exposed ignition and iron sights.My neighbor bought a new Rem 700 MZ and I thought we had to use sidelock or flint, but the book says as long as the firing mech. is open it's legal. He uses a #11 cap and it is exposed. I will still hunt traditional!!I love my TC WM Carbine!
I shot a HUGE 6 X 6 in New Mexico years ago with my .53 Sante Fe Hawken. Patched roundball and 120 grains of FFg,,about 100 yards and that elk went about 10 yards,, the shot was good,,great penetration. Just make sure you're over .50 caliber for a CLEAN kill.
