Nipples plugging

[SOLANCO]

after I clean and oil the barrel of either my .50 Green River or thhe Pedersoli flintlock they get put in the storage rack muzzle down on a piece of white paper towel. That will soak up the oil as it migrates out the muzzle instead of making an oily mess in the breech. You will be surprised at the stain on the towel and I clean carefully.
Load 'em heavy boys They air a'comin'
Bunk

Aim low! They are riding Shetlands!!

 

[Professor flintlock]

I think mooman76 has the right idea. You patch and jag combination is too tight. Take your jag and chuck it in a drill. Put a file to the side and decrease the diameter of your jag. You want the patch slide over the powder residue then when you pull the ramrod the patch wads up on the jag and pulls the powder residue out the barrel not making it into your flash channel. But it does help if the channel is clean . Pipe cleaner soaked in Hoppes 9 plus will do the job. Been there done that!

 

[Snydly]

Have numerous Pedersoli rifles. When new you have to degrease the nipple channel thoroughly. Before you shoot it! A plug developers if you shoot it before you clean it. Remove nipple and thoroughly clean nipple and the channel between nipple and breach.

 

[toot]

This one is easy:

1. Remove the nipple and clean the flame channel with a bristled pipe cleaner.

2. Keep the nipple clean.

3. Lean the rifle on it's lock side when loading the powder and give the stock a couple slaps with the hand. This will allow powder to enter the patent breech and flame channel.

I use a burner cleaning tip from the cleaning of an OXY ACETELEANE cutting tip.

 

[Flinty Scot]

Reading through descriptions of this problem and suggested fixes has me agreeing with JCKelly; these cap-fired guns are an unreliable "improvement".

 

[renegadehunter]

I think mooman76 has the right idea. You patch and jag combination is too tight. Take your jag and chuck it in a drill. Put a file to the side and decrease the diameter of your jag. You want the patch slide over the powder residue then when you pull the ramrod the patch wads up on the jag and pulls the powder residue out the barrel not making it into your flash channel. But it does help if the channel is clean . Pipe cleaner soaked in Hoppes 9 plus will do the job. Been there done that!

I swab between every shot and after 4-7 shots I'd start getting fail to fires. I started popping a cap after swabbing and this issue flat went away.
I then read about turning the jag down. Being the frugal person I am (definitely would rather not use double the caps right now) I tried turning my jag down. Worked like a charm. I don't have to pop a cap after swabbing and can't remember the last time I had a fail to fire.

 

[wb78963]

I use a burner cleaning tip from the cleaning of an OXY ACETYLENE cutting tip.
Excellent advise from Toot and after cleaning store the rifle muzzle down in the rack and let the extra oil migrate. out. I leave mine inverted for a week or so and hardly ever have problems.
Also using a nipple primer for the first couple of shots will assure a dry fire path and no caps wasted.
Make some SMOKE
Bunk

 

[Flinty Scot]

This is more of a "woods walk/trekking" technique but works well with my flintlock and doesn't require carrying a separate wiping/cleaning rod.
Take a stout string/cord, a bit longer than your barrel, tie a loop in one end (I loop both ends); and double the loop over a cleaning patch. Using the smaller end of my ramrod, I push the rag end downs the bore -without expanding it into the fouling. Once it's at the breech, I switch ends on the ramrod, so the end spreads the rag out to fill the bore.
I then draw out the cord, holding a bit of pressure against it with the rod, to keep the rag expanded to fill the bore.

If I'm a bit careful, the rag doesn't sweep up much of the fouling until it is expanded out to fill the bore. My intent is to minimize the fouling I carry to the breech, while wiping as much as I can as I draw the rag out.

I have a clean rag in the loop at the other end of the cord. I run this in and out to finish the cleaning if the fouling seems heavy.

I will also dampen the first rag with 70% alcohol if the fouling seems heavy.

This has worked well for me; I hope this helps you.

 

[Blitz]

Pedersoli's have a patent breech that is quite narrow and hard to clean. As mentioned in the other posts, it is likely that moisture or oil is in the breech area and contaminating any powder charge. When i clean my Pedersoli's, that I can't take the barrel off for flushing, I use a .22 caliber bronze cleaning brush with a patch wrapped around it to get down into the breech area to dry out any residue oil or water. The air compressor can be your best friend when available, otherwise, an alcohol soaked patch will do the trick while in the field,

I can relate to that narrow pedersoli breach chamber, at range and fired several times using 2f powder , ran out so loaded up with Swiss1 1/2 caped and fired several times with no resulting discharge. I pondered this situation and came up with patent breach idea being bridged over by the greater flake size of the 1 1/2 f power. Took of nipple and drum and probed and got no powder at all, worked in 3 to 6 grains of 3fffg maybe, as much as I could anyway. unfortunately have not been able to prove my theory yet, soon I hope.

Buzz

 

[smoothshooter]

I shoot 2 rifles, a Pendersoli Frontier 50 cal and lyman 50 cal. Pendersoli is new i shoot once and clean it and shoot again the cap goes off but not powder . i try 3 or 4 caps and same. Im useing goex 2f cause i have a 58 cal also. Is the bottom of the nipple plugged?

Why are you cleaning after every shot?
Take the nipple out and look at it. Look below the nipple also, and run a pipe cleaner down there.
Percussion guns are more susceptible to having moisture and crud trapped the breech area than flintlocks.

 

[fillwa]

if you keep cleaning and oiling and letting that oil run into the flash channel it will just be a new and different ignition issue

Clean the oil out of the gun before shooting it. Have fun!

 

[Danny Ross]

Since others have mentioned about cleaning the barrel which doesn't help you at the range with the problem you are having. What I do to clean the barrels of my caplocks TC Renegades and Lyman GPRs . I use a 5 gallon bucket about half full with warm soapy water then plain water. Pull the barrel from the stock put the breech end into the bucket of soapy water with the nipple still in. I have a Range Rod I put my cleaning jag on, wet the cloth patch I am using to bilge clean the barrel with then push it to the bottom of the barrel and work it up and down in the barrel about 10 or so strokes. Even with the nipple in you will be surprised how much water is pulled in when you push back down. This will flat out clean your nipple. After you do the 10 or so strokes pull the nipple, then finish bilge cleaning your barrel. The turbulents this causes when bilge cleaning, will clean ANYTHING out of the flash channel and ANYTHING in the patented breech, as if being high pressured power washed. If you use a greasy type of lube (BoreButter or the like) the soap will help clean that out of the barrel just like cleaning greasy dishes. Then I rinse with clean water to rinse out any soap residue, probably don't have to, but I do. I swab the barrel dry, then turn the barrel upside down and use a can of compressed air using the red hose that comes with it, blow out where you screw the nipple in and the flash channel, this will also blow the patented breech dry, then re-swab the barrel with a dry patch to remove any moisture blown down the barrel. Also I blow out the nipple, it is stainless steel but it gets any moisture out of the threads. After drying the barrel thoroughly I put Barricade into where the nipple goes, use the compressed air to blow it through the flash channel into the patented breech and all the excess into the barrel. All you need is a very thin film of that stuff and using the compress air, that is all that is left. Then swab the barrel with Barricade, put the nipple back in, barrel back into the stock, then put the rifle on its muzzle with a paper towel under it for 2-3 days for the excess Barricade to drain out as others have mentioned. Cleaning it this way you don't need to try and push any kind of brush or pipe cleaner through the flash channel or remove a clean out screw to clean it. DANNY

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

I always remove the nipple and swab the flash channel with a pipes cleaner and rubbing alcohol. Also I poke the nipple hole with a little wire and pop a cap before loading.

I haven't had a misfire in a percussion rifle in years.

 

[S.Kenton]

I use bore butter when not shooting for a week or so

There’s your issue. Clean that stuff out and use it as a patch lube... not a bore preservative. More than likely your pushing that “ bore butter” into the patent breech and clogging it up.

 

[maineguy]

Thanks but do a complere cleaning before shooting . my probleem is between shots

 

[Grenadier1758]

Then let's go back to your original post.

I shoot 2 rifles, a Pendersoli Frontier 50 cal and lyman 50 cal. Pendersoli is new i shoot once and clean it and shoot again the cap goes off but not powder . i try 3 or 4 caps and same. Im useing goex 2f cause i have a 58 cal also. Is the bottom of the nipple plugged?

Let's reference the original post and your recent post.

You haven't provided the details of how you are cleaning between shots, so we have to speculate. My speculation was that the cleaning between shots used patches that were too wet and a lot of moisture was left at the bottom of the chambered breech. Both the Lyman and Pedersoli have chambered breeches. Since the cap fires but doesn't ignite the powder charge, there is something preventing the flame from the firing of the cap reaching the powder charge. That something in my experience is a sludge formed by the moisture left in the chambered breech by cleaning with a very wet patch that isn't being dried by the dry patches. It has been thoroughly demonstrated that wet powder does not ignite. What has been suggested is to address having a dry flash channel. Some of us have wandered down a rabbit hole of general cleaning.

The best procedure that I have found to ensure reliable firing for shot after shot starts with a clean and dry barrel and flash channel. You have done a good enough job of cleaning so your rifle goes off on the first shot. That bring us to what is happening after the shot. You clean it. Then the rifle fails to fire even though the cap fires. What has changed? The rifle has been cleaned. How wet ae the patches? Has the chambered breech been dried? Is the flash channel been cleared? 2fg GOEX should be very reliable in your rifles. What is likely plugging your nipples is the sludge from the powder and the moisture from the cleaning blocking the flash channel.

Cleaning between shots should not be necessary. No problem with a wipe to control the fouling, but the patch needs only to be damp, nearly dry and the jag slightly undersized so the damp patch rides over the fouling in the barrel. The patch will bunch up on the jag and pull the fouling out. You can follow with a dry patch. If you run the damp patch down the barrel after firing you will push residual smoke out the nipple verifying the flash channel is clear. There won't be any embers in the barrel and the chambered breech embers will be extinguished by the rush of air.

A very tight jag and patch can push fouling into the chambered breech creating a dam of fouling that prevents ignition of the main charge.

I have several rifles with chambered breeches. Using the process I described, I don't have firing problems. You shouldn't have any either. If you don't want to believe me, then get Dutch Shoultz's Black Powder Rifle Accuracy system. He describes this process in detail in his system.

 

[smoothshooter]

Pedersoli's have a patent breech that is quite narrow and hard to clean. As mentioned in the other posts, it is likely that moisture or oil is in the breech area and contaminating any powder charge. When i clean my Pedersoli's, that I can't take the barrel off for flushing, I use a .22 caliber bronze cleaning brush with a patch wrapped around it to get down into the breech area to dry out any residue oil or water. The air compressor can be your best friend when available, otherwise, an alcohol soaked patch will do the trick while in the field,

I never bought a patent breeched gun due the cleaning problems in the field, and at home that you describe and will hear about in other in other posts in this thread.
The Italians seem to be in love with them and put them in many models that that never had them originally. The original Mortimers, and some others of their type were patent breeched as far as I know.
There is no excuse for putting them in their smoothbore trade guns and copies of American rifles. I blame this situation on the likelihood that the owners, designers, and product engineers of the various Italian replica companies are not black powder shooters at all except for maybe firing 5 to 10 shots every year or so ( if that often ) during some media or industry event, after which some lower-level employee totally disassembles the gun in the shop and takes care of the cleaning and reassembly after the shooting is done.
What I am saying is that the Italian management likely never has to deal with problems inherent with patent breech guns.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I never bought a patent breeched gun due the cleaning problems in the field, and at home that you describe and will hear about in other in other posts in this thread.
The Italians seem to be in love with them and put them in many models that that never had them originally. The original Mortimers, and some others of their type were patent breeched as far as I know.
There is no excuse for putting them in their smoothbore trade guns and copies of American rifles. I blame this situation on the likelihood that the owners, designers, and product engineers of the various Italian replica companies are not black powder shooters at all except for maybe firing 5 to 10 shots every year or so ( if that often ) during some media or industry event, after which some lower-level employee totally disassembles the gun in the shop and takes care of the cleaning and reassembly after the shooting is done.
What I am saying is that the Italian management likely never has to deal with problems inherent with patent breech guns.

What problems?
Not much difference than a nipple drum or bolster.
Near all percussion guns have places oil can get trapped....that is if one uses oil that is. Did I ever tell how I DON'T use oil! Yeah , i expect my guns to be 100% reliable and for the most part are. I dont even get a brush in the patent breech. Just good old hot water.

Now, how many championships have been won with Italian guns again......hmm i just forget but it is alot.

 

[smoothshooter]

What problems?
Not much difference than a nipple drum or bolster.
Near all percussion guns have places oil can get trapped....that is if one uses oil that is. Did I ever tell how I DON'T use oil! Yeah , i expect my guns to be 100% reliable and for the most part are. I dont even get a brush in the patent breech. Just good old hot water.

Now, how many championships have been won with Italian guns again......hmm i just forget but it is alot.

I am not saying patent breeched guns don’t shoot well. My point is that cleaning them in the field is more of a problem, especially with guns having pinned barrels that are not meant for removal for cleaning.
With patent breeches it’s another inside diameter thing to clean or brush out, meaning an additional sized brush and patch retrieval worm has to be carried.
I am very familiar with the history, development, claimed advantages ( actual and otherwise ), and variations of the patent breech design. In my humble opinion, the only real advantage is from a stylistic viewpoint because they allow the breech end of a barrel to be made narrower for some English styled guns so that the lock sets in closer to the bore.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I am not saying patent breeched guns don’t shoot well. My point is that cleaning them in the field is more of a problem, especially with guns having pinned barrels that are not meant for removal for cleaning.
With patent breeches it’s another inside diameter thing to clean or brush out, meaning an additional sized brush and patch retrieval worm has to be carried.
I am very familiar with the history, development, claimed advantages ( actual and otherwise ), and variations of the patent breech design. In my humble opinion, the only real advantage is from a stylistic viewpoint because they allow the breech end of a barrel to be made narrower for some English styled guns so that the lock sets in closer to the bore.

No problem with your opinion. However. I dont clean in the field. Never had to and I dont brush or use any tool to clean the patent breach when at home.
In my humble opinion. It is cleaning to much that is causing the problem. Not the design of the breach!