Number 11 caps

[Taxidermydude69]

I've been having a time lately lo acting number 11 caps and when I did they don't fit my pietta 1858 that I put replacement nipples number 11 in and also just got a replacement cylinder from Taylor's &Co that has number 11 nipples and these caps fall right off. Yes of course you can pinch the cap and get it to stay but I shouldn't have to do that with a brand new cylinder and nipples. Are these caps just weird or what?

 

[bang]

Caps vary some between manufactures.
Very possible the new cylinder has nipples for #10 as that's pretty much standard up to the Dragoon and Walker.
I've been using same caps and they do fit the #11 nipples pretty snug.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

The replacement nipples are size 11 and was told by Taylor's and co that they would be 11's in the replacement cylinder as well. Both came from there

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Guess I'll have to call them Monday and get them to check numbers on both. I thought that only difference in the number 10 is that it's a longer cap?

 

[bang]

Guess I'll have to call them Monday and get them to check numbers on both. I thought that only difference in the number 10 is that it's a longer cap?

One would think so but if you look up the measurements of cap you'll find there are subtle differences in each of same number.
It's not unusual for venders to get it wrong sometimes. If they did make a mistake the better option might be to get a set of nipples for #11s. That way you have the convenience of both. Really not much if any difference in standard caps in hot gas delivery between the two just what size nipple they fit. I use #11s on a rifle that typically uses musket caps and find no issues in ignition.
I wouldn't pinch caps on a revolver. Hot gas can get in the gap and can cause chain fire. One option in to get tubing like for aquarium pumps and cut it in small pieces and put them over the cap to hold it on and seal it.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

These are brand new number 11 nipples and a new cylinder with number 11 nipples installed in it. It just came Friday so if they got the replacement nipples wrong or 1 of the other I could see that but not both cylinder with nipples in it and also the replacement nipples. This is a total of 12 nipples that is number 11 so don't see that they got it wrong

 

[Taxidermydude69]

The bag the nipples came in says: 6mm×0.75

 

[bang]

They say for #10 & #11 but I've never heard of a nipple being for more than one size.
Look at Track of the Wolf.
I couldn't find the measurements for these nipples but track has instructions on measuring.
Look at these for #11:
PIR-I & PIR-S
CONE .300
THREAD LENGTH .225
OVERALL .525
BASE .307

PIR-LI & PIR-LS
CONE .319
THREAD LENGTH .225
OVERALL .544
BASE .307

PIR-TS
CONE .260
THREAD LENGTH .225
OVERALL .485
BASE .307

Basically all you need to know is the overall length to know which one.
I would pull one out of the cylinder and measure it then check that the ones they sent match. Every 1858 I've had including pre CNC used #10s but luckily ones for #11s are available.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Spoke to someone at Track of the wolf before I ordered the cylinder and he said there were 3 different size number 11 nipples that they had and for me to measure but my pietta had 2 diff sizes in them to begin with and don't think they were correct as 2 didn't tighten up. So I found the stainless cylinder at Taylor'sand co and they said they had replacement nipples for my original cylinder that came with number 10's but insisted they had number 11's that would go back in. Well they did but no good if a cap won't stay on

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Barely found 11 caps and 10's are un heard of to get so guess I'm stuck with what I got unless track of the wolf has 11's to fit my caps

 

[bang]

All I can say is I've never received anything from track that didn't work.
For anyone to claim a nipple is for more than one size cap for me is unheard of.
I pulled a nipple from my Pietta 1858. It's the PIR-LI or the PIR-LS for #11. One is blued , other stainless. That's provided your's is not a very old one. Mine is 2000s year date. The cylinder I pulled it from I got only a month ago.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Well the guy at track told me it was 3 diff nipples that they had. He told me to measure them. Call and verify this. He told me to either measure mine or send him mine so he could get the correct # 11. So why would he tell me this? My pietta is 2004 stainless target model. No numbers on the nipples

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Here is what I ha e from Taylor's and co.

 

[bang]

Yes I saw that too but the fact remains that I've never ever in the near 50 years of shooting heard of a nipple that accepted two sizes. Some might accept one or the other but not either, that's a matter of manufacturing. From factory anything below Dragoon and ROA in revolver and pistol unless special ordered are #10 and no amount of company verbage will change that. Whoever wrote the discription obviously got it wrong because you hold the proof. Measure a nipple that fits and will pop a cap and get a set for #11s from Track and be done with it. If it measures .544 then you need the ,319 cone. If it measures .525 you need .300 cone. Measurements are subject to around .002 deviation. M6 outside thread diameter measures .224-.234.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

I can write that down and ask them at Track. So that is for a 1858 pietta 44 cal?

 

[Grenadier1758]

This table has been posted many times. Follow the link in the quote.

While it does not have dimensions for all brands of caps, the table is quite enlightening. Remmington caps have the same internal diameter for #10 and #11, the length is different.

There is an excellent treatise on percussion caps and nipples by "Mako".

Its been posted here on the forum before and here again. As you will see from the initial table of cap sizes, its just not that simple.

Percussion Caps and Nipples (guntoters.com)

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Yes I saw that too but the fact remains that I've never ever in the near 50 years of shooting heard of a nipple that accepted two sizes. Some might accept one or the other but not either, that's a matter of manufacturing. From factory anything below Dragoon and ROA in revolver and pistol unless special ordered are #10 and no amount of company verbage will change that. Whoever wrote the discription obviously got it wrong because you hold the proof. Measure a nipple that fits and will pop a cap and get a set for #11s from Track and be done with it. If it measures .544 then you need the ,319 cone. If it measures .525 you need .300 cone. Measurements are subject to around .002 deviation. M6 outside thread diameter measures .224-.234.

I really don't know what to measure on the cap. Cant locate any more caps period so need to get a nipple to fit them

 

[Archer 756]

Sounds like you have #10 nipples also 6.075 is the tread size not nipple #10 or #11 just as stated tread size !

 

[bang]

I really don't know what to measure on the cap. Cant locate any more caps period so need to get a nipple to fit them

It's just the nipples.

I can write that down and ask them at Track. So that is for a 1858 pietta 44 cal?

You'll find on their site has a very good detailed explanation of the nipples. The nipples I showed fit numerous revolvers. The older and I mean way back used different measurements. Do you know the manufacture date of the revolver? I can pretty much be sure yours will be the .319 cone, .544 overall length but do measure one to be absolutely sure. I fitted newer 1858 cylinder to a 1975 Euro Arms 1858 and the .319 cone, .544 overall fits it and 2 Pietta 1858 target models built in the 2000s.

 

[Taxidermydude69]

Sounds like you have #10 nipples also 6.075 is the tread size not nipple #10 or #11 just as stated tread size !

I dont know what they are but I do know they don't fit # 11 caps and if they are # 10's I might as well get rid of the thing or put it on the wall