Older shooters

[gmww]

I have not been active much lately mostly because I was preparing for and hunting. After my deer hunt I found myself at a store in Spokane called the White Elephant.

They carry just about everything. I was in an aisle looking at the muzzle loading products. An older store employee asked to help. I explained I was shooting a traditional style ML and was looking for related items.

He had this glint in his eye and smile when I told him that. He said he sure missed his traditiona rifle. He now shoots a modern centerfire scoped rifle. I asked him why he gave it up. He explained that his eye sight had gotten so bad that he could not use iron sights anymore. It wasn't bad enough to qualify as handicapped. If it had he would be able to mount a scope to his muzzleloader.

He was telling me fond stories about being in the woods with his muzzleloader. He said he only wished that that they would allow folks with poor vision to mount a non-magnifying scope on so they could keep their ML.

Please don't flame me as I'm not in agreement with Toby and his group. However, I couldn't help but feel for the old gentleman and the other just as old gentlemen who joined in saying the same thing.

Seems we've lost two fine fellas to centerfire.

 

[roundball]

I have not been active much lately mostly because I was preparing for and hunting. After my deer hunt I found myself at a store in Spokane called the White Elephant.

They carry just about everything. I was in an aisle looking at the muzzle loading products. An older store employee asked to help. I explained I was shooting a traditional style ML and was looking for related items.

He had this glint in his eye and smile when I told him that. He said he sure missed his traditiona rifle. He now shoots a modern centerfire scoped rifle. I asked him why he gave it up. He explained that his eye sight had gotten so bad that he could not use iron sights anymore. It wasn't bad enough to qualify as handicapped. If it had he would be able to mount a scope to his muzzleloader.

He was telling me fond stories about being in the woods with his muzzleloader. He said he only wished that that they would allow folks with poor vision to mount a non-magnifying scope on so they could keep their ML.

Please don't flame me as I'm not in agreement with Toby and his group. However, I couldn't help but feel for the old gentleman and the other just as old gentlemen who joined in saying the same thing.

Seems we've lost two fine fellas to centerfire.

No flame...and I agree that's a tough situation...but...gosh darn it every thing in life can't be "excepted" away.

If a ball player blows out a knee, he sits the bench...it would be wrong to make an exception and let him use a dirt bike to run the bases.

In the PGA, there are strict rules...one is that you must walk & play the course, no golf carts because that's part of the "tradition" of the game of golf.
A few years ago at a PGA Tour match, some player was trying to get some sort of medical exception to use a golf cart and you would not believe the uproar heard round the world from players, fans, etc.

And remember, these types of muzzleloading restrictions are for deer/big game hunting, not small game...there's a tremendous variety of small game to hunt in virtually every state and they are usually very, very long seasons compared to brief muzzleloading deer seasons...all those many, many fond days with a traditional muzzleloader could still easily be had by the gentleman with a scope on his muzzleloader.

Interesting coincidence, my truck is loaded right now for a Saturday morning squirrel hunt tomorrow with a .28ga Flint smoothbore & #6's...

:thumbsup:

 

[BrownBear]

I'm gettin there all too fast with my aging eyes, but let's face facts. I can still mount a scope or such on my ML and hunt during the regular season. In my mind it's a matter of leavin the special season to folks who can cope with its limits, and going on to do something else when you can't cope any more. When the day comes I have to do that and someone gives me snot about mounting a scope on my gun, I'll show him a new way to brown a barrel, but I still won't try to change the regs on a traditional hunt.

For now, adding a receiver sight and a FO front has let me keep shooting. PC it aint, but give me grief for using it and we're back to the barrel browning lessons.

 

[Claude Mathis]

No flame, just some personal observations.

I'm 60 years old. "Years ago", I used to teach technical rock climbing and still climb today. The differences is, I can't climb like I used to. That happens as we get older.

I still backpack. As time goes on, I'm sure I won't be able to hike into some of the remote wilderness areas where I used to camp. But, I don't expect them to change the law just so I can drive my truck into the "roadless areas".

Loosing my ability to climb, hike, see or swim like I used to, doesn't necessarily mean I'm "handicapped" - It just means I'm older. :winking:

 

[TANSTAAFL]

I have not been active much lately mostly because I was preparing for and hunting. After my deer hunt I found myself at a store in Spokane called the White Elephant.

They carry just about everything. I was in an aisle looking at the muzzle loading products. An older store employee asked to help. I explained I was shooting a traditional style ML and was looking for related items.

He had this glint in his eye and smile when I told him that. He said he sure missed his traditiona rifle. He now shoots a modern centerfire scoped rifle. I asked him why he gave it up. He explained that his eye sight had gotten so bad that he could not use iron sights anymore. It wasn't bad enough to qualify as handicapped. If it had he would be able to mount a scope to his muzzleloader.

He was telling me fond stories about being in the woods with his muzzleloader. He said he only wished that that they would allow folks with poor vision to mount a non-magnifying scope on so they could keep their ML.

Please don't flame me as I'm not in agreement with Toby and his group. However, I couldn't help but feel for the old gentleman and the other just as old gentlemen who joined in saying the same thing. Seems we've lost two fine fellas to centerfire.

Here is iron for old eyes, once I tried one, can't do without. For open sights only, a thin blade cut with a jeweler's saw in center top of aperture, takes away nothing for effectiveness.

[url] http://trackofthewolf.com/(S(...SUBID=167&STYLEID=768&PARTNUM=RS-CA-PEEP[/url]

 

[bwhoffman]

your mentioned golfer is casey martin, lives here in oregon. IIRC, he got an exemptiontion but his game didnt pan out. I feel sorry for him, but the same aspect seems to apply to the threads in other forums here. where does one draw the line as far as traditional goes?
I best should refer all feedback and dialog to the existing threads.
But I do feel for the guy from washington with "aged" eyesight and primitive open sights.

Brett

 

[gmww]

Thanks all for the tone of the thread. Like I said I'm a traditional shooter/hunter. It just caught me off guard meeting that kind old fella with the poor eye sight. Kinda made me pause and think. This was even before I became aware of the suit. I sure hate losing one who so much enjoyed traditional shooting.

I'm really enjoying what everyone is doing to fight the suit. I'll be doing my part by speaking to my buddies in the Game Dept. and a local State Senator who I used to work with.

regards,
Gmww

 

[redwing]

Thats a neat little sight. I have to use the Merit Aperature that fits on my glasses. After years of being a handgunner I needed a little help. Some of the BP matches allow them some don't. If they are not allowed I don't shoot. I don't expect the rules to change because I have had too many Birthdays. :snore:

 

[ss1]

"Loosing my ability to climb, hike, see or swim like I used to, doesn't necessarily mean I'm "handicapped" - It just means I'm older." I am 9 yrs older, and still looking for those "golden years". Scope would not help me. I can see fine with peeps on front and rear. Its the targets that will not stand still. :grin:

 

[Dave K]

I guess I will know when I get there. I can't see as I used to either. I just changed my style. No, not to scopes, but to the style of open sights I use. Maybe moving the rear sight further down the barrel, a wider sight, a narrower sight, a silver sight, an eye doctor, if there is a desire, there is a way. You may never have 16yr. old eyes again, but you can change how you look at things.

 

[No Deer]

IF you can't see the sights, it is time to get a smoothbore :rotf: :rotf:

 

[BrownBear]

Actually not too far out there. I find wiht age I shoot shoguns more and more, and I'd go to a smoothy with a good load of buck before I gave up hunting altogether. Just get a little closer, but that's what it's all about anyway.

 

[gordy]

I too understand the old guys delima, but when I exhaust all the iron sight options,I'll go to a smooth bore also. I'll be 69 on Halloween and intend to make smoke untill I can no longer hold up a weapon. I would not consider changeing the Regs.

 

[Wehrmacht]

gordy I'm a year younger than you,and I still function very well with my traditional flintlock rifles with conventional iron sights.

My eyesight did get pretty bad,but I went over to the Mayo Clinic and had cataract surgery on both eyes a few months ago,and I now have 20/15 in my right eye and 20/10 in my left. Wish I had developed cataracts years ago :rotf:.

 

On the other hand there is no reason that he couldn't use a scoped muzzleloader during the regular season.......dependent on state laws anyway - in most general rifle seasons a muzzleloader is allowed and without any conditions......

 

[TN.Frank]

IF you can't see the sights, it is time to get a smoothbore :rotf: :rotf:

That's pretty much my take on things. That way you only have the front sight to deal with and you'll be forced to take closer shots at game. :v

 

[Jumpshot]

I couldn't help but feel for the old gentleman and the other just as old gentlemen who joined in saying the same thing.

Excuse me if I sound rude, but all I feel for these guys is :bull:
I knew somone years ago that just adored his sidelock but could not use open sights anymore because of deteriorating vision. Do you know what he did? He put a scope on it and used it in the general season. When he stopped hunting because of health problems he still cotinued to use his beloved scoped muzleloader for target shooting at the range. This is what I will do if/when my vision ever goes south. This is the approach of somone that really loves shooting muzzleloaders, not just giving up and getting rid of it.

I have found that many people tell stories about thier past and put more feeling into the story than they really felt at the time.

 

[Gary]

What No Deer says has precedence. Former NMLRA President, the late Max Vickery told me that when his eyes went, he went to smoothbore. RIP Max.

 

[Jumpshot]

...someone gives me snot about mounting a scope on my gun, I'll show him a new way to brown a barrel

:rotf:

 

[Stumpkiller]

It's a shame, but there is a time to every season.

You can't shoot a traditional muzzleloader with a scope on it, because at that point it ceases to be one.

I can't skate, so should I be able to play hockey with ice cleats on my boots? Fish with dynamite because I can no longer see well enough to tie flies or thread a hook?

If you can't do you do as you can. If I get to the point where I can't draw a hunting weight bow I may consider a compound, but I won't add wheels or cams to a recurve and call it a traditional bow with wheels. He can mount a scope on anything he pleases, but a traditional muzzleloader has no scope. It becomes something else then.

No flame. Just clarification of definitions.