Opinions Needed on 54 Cal...

[mtharney]

I am interested in a 54 cal Perc. I've located 2 kits on[url] possibleshop.com[/url]. The first is a Deerhunter by Traditions 1:48 the other is a Northwest 1:66. Both are sidelock 54 cal. I'll mainly be shooting No Excuses conicals and some PRB. Does anyone have one of these or know about them? I may also be interested in mounting a scope on it, eyes aren't what they used to be.

:thanks:
Mike

 

[BrownBear]

If you are going to shoot conicals as well as PRB, I'd go with the Deerhunter and its 1:48 twist. The Northwest with its 1:66 twist might shoot PRB a little better than the Deerhunter, but the list of conicals that will work in it is going to be pretty short.

If on the other hand you simply prefer the looks of the Northwest, you probably need to ask yourself why you want to shoot conicals. There are good reasons to shoot them, but there's an awful lot that can be done with the PRB while never shooting a conical. I've found that 54 cal round ball to be devastating on deer within the 100 yards that I've shot them. I probably wouldn't stretch the range beyond that much even with a scope, but I have no qualms about performance on deer and even elk. In fact, I have never even managed to recover a 54 RB from any deer I've shot. If moose were on my list, I'd look closer about using a 54 cal RB, and in fact would probably either go for a conical or a bigger caliber RB.

 

[Tahquamenon]

You may have some trouble finding a scope mount for the traditions sidelock.

Thompson/Center has a mount for their Hawken and Renegade 15/16ths and 1" octagon barreled sidelocks as well as a mount for their round barreled sidelocks.

The T/C mount may be able to be McGyver'ed on to the Traditions barrel with some drilling and tapping.

Another option might be a used Thompson/Center 54 caliber sidelock?

Thompson/Center ML's are excellent quality and the lifetime warranty and support is superb.

I just saw a used T/C Hawken 54 cal percussion, 1:48" with a primo bore and great overall condition for a couple hundred dollars at a local shop.

 

[cayugad]

I agree with Brown Bear. A .54 caliber is a great choice without doubt. If all you're going to hunt for the most part is deer, there is really no reason to look further then a roundball rifle. I would then go with the 1:66 twist Northwest rifle.

The Tradition's Deer hunter is a great rifle and will shoot the roundball and conicals with the 1:48 twist, but it might not shoot the No Excuses. That does not mean it will not shoot REALs, or Great Plains or some other conical like that.

The .54 roundball is an excellent choice for deer. I am not familiar with the Northwest rifle. I have some Tradition's rifles and they are good shooters. Also there are some excellent deals on Used T/C .54 caliber Renegades on[url] GunBroker.Com[/url]. Then you have an excellent rifle, and a excellent warranty.

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

Since you need the scope to compensate for vision, I don't think either gun (as they are currently configured) would be the best for you.

As far as .54 caliber goes, "I think" it's one of the most efficient bore sizes above the .45 Both round ball or conical (saboted bullets too) are quite effective on deer and larger game. I don't think anyone would argue that point. But if availability ever became an issue, a .50 caliber is the equivalent of the .30-30 in cartridge guns. Not ballistically of course... in that I mean that if a store only carries one caliber of round ball or conical (or sabot), it's most likely going to be the .50 cal.

You give up some power by dropping down to a .50 caliber, but you gain a LOT of versatility and variety of projectiles, accessories, et cetera...

Most sidelock guns aren't conducive to scope mounting without some modifications. There are problems to consider with hammer interference and high mounting. It may also put you into an uncomfortable position when trying to shoot.

There are some replacment hammers available for certain model guns that have an offset spur to allow for scope clearance.

It might be possible that you'd be best served by a different type of muzzle loading design gun.

Example: An H&A Underhammer .50 caliber gun would work great. Though most of them are 1:66 twist, you can get them fitted with just about any barrel, caliber, twist, combination you could possibly want. Scoping it would be very easy and you don't have to worry about hammer interference or mounting issues. They also are handy for left-handed shooters.

There are a whole slew of "modern designed" inlines in various brands and prices. Most have much faster twists needed for shooting saboted rounds. (long conicals might work well also) They aren't the best for patched round ball shooting, but that doesn't necessarily mean you can't.

I'm not trying to change your mind about what you want, but just giving you some alternatives & ideas to think about.

Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[jdixon]

Mike Muzzle:
Don't know where in Indiana you are but, if you can get away down to Friendship this week, there are a bunch (literally hundreds) of new and used MZ's for sale there during the spring shoot. As for the used ones they are being sold by people who have (in most cases) taken care of them.
As for a scope - that is something you gargle with :crackup:, look into Lyman 57ML rear, tang peep sight with an #17 front hood sight. I have this set-up on a 1:48 Hawken and I can shoot some pretty tight groups out to 120 yards with it. A pair of these sights should set you back around $110.00 new. :thumbsup:

 

[mtharney]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I currently have a Knight Disc .50 and love it. That is one reason for wanting the .54 sidelock. I know Knight makes a 52 cal inline, but I'm not sure if they have any sidelocks in the larger cal. BP shooting is so additive!
I also have a dream/death wish of going on a bear hunt. My wife says, just keep you life insurance paid up.
I knew about the spring/fall shoots in Friendship, just not the exact dates. Fortunately, I live between Evansville & Louisville, so Friendship isn't too far. Unfortunately, I won't be able to make the spring shoot, my wife just had our twins 2 wks ago. If I try a trip like that, she'll probably shoot me with my ML. Thankfully, she doesn't know how to load it, I think I'll keep it like that.

Again,
Thanks for all the info.
Mike

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

Congrats on the new twins! These your first set of kids? Father's Day is going to mean a whole lot more now in your househould. AND... Now you have an excuse to buy at least 2 of everything, right?

"Bigger is mostly always better"...
Since you're wanting to go "loaded for bear", don't forget about the various "Civil War"--that's an oxymoron if ever there was one--.58 caliber muskets that can deliver really huge chunks of lead into close range targets and game. Don't forget about the '42 & '47 Springfields in .69 caliber (Smoothbore and rifled--take your pick!) which can chuck even larger and heavier missles at your quarry.

"A good option to try"...
If you did manage to latch onto a nice Renegade on an auction site, you can replace the barrel with a Green Mt. .54, .58, or .62 (smoothbore) and have a very nice gun for a reasonable price. With the European imports' prices getting higher all the time; a used US gun with a US made replacement barrel is not a very expensive proposition. They are very nice shooters as many others here will confirm as well.

"Going all out"...
You could get a nice 8 bore rifled H&A design Underhammer gun made for you at Blue Grouse. Put a low power scope or magnifying red dot setup on it, and you could feed that bear his last meal of 2 1/2 oz or more of lead. Make absolutely sure you aren't afraid of the recoil of 300gr of powder and 1000 gr of lead.

"When all else fails"...
I'd also have a really good backup gun and a good shooter ready to follow up on that bear. You want to be around to watch those twins grow up there Dad!

Hunt safely, friend!,
WV_Hillbilly

 

[BrownBear]

Hey Mike.

J.R. is onto something about the Lyman sights rather than a scope if you're set on a sidelock. I have a Lyman GPR 54 caliber outfitted with those sights, and frankly they work better than anything else with my aging eyes. I have no qualms about taking deer at 100 yards with mine, but I would have reservations about taking them any further even with a scope. If the sights work for you within the effective range limits of the caliber, why bother with a scope?

Congrats (twice) on the new additions to your clan!

 

[jimbo15563]

Mike,

I did what Hillbilly recommended and went with the underhammer. My .54 is being built and it will look something like this when it's done:

I also need a scope, but will use quick-release mounts for when I want to use the action-mounted peep sight/ghost ring. I don't like see-thru mounts bacause I think they ruin the sleek profile of the rifle.

If you're interested, check out my thread in the builder's bench section:

Jimbo's Underhammer

You'll find a lot of information building an Underhammer. I'm hoping to have mine ready for deer season this fall.

Jimbo