Pedersoli Charles Moore sights

[Stony Broke]

I have a couple Pedersoli .45 pistols and one is being difficult to sight in. I normally shoot the Kentucky, but I have a Charles Moore that has been sitting in my safe for some time and I decided to sight it in today....that was a surprise. I have never purchased a muzzleloader pistol that shot almost a foot high at 25 yards. The rear sight is about 3/8 inch or so wide and really not what I would have chosen for a target pistol. I filed about 1/3 of the rear sight off while at the range and got it to shoot only about 4" high.
Basically what I think I'd like to do is replace the sights with something more akin to a target setup, but the dovetails are tiny on this pistol. Perhaps I will have to open up the dovetails to accommodate better sights, if I cannot find sights that will work in the factory dovetails.
Any suggestions of a better approach to this problem ?

 

[arcticap]

Many folks hate to complain, but if this is an ongoing manufacturer's issue that perhaps has already been known or resolved by Pedersoli, why not complain to either Pedersoli or their US agent, the Italian Firearms Group in Texas and begin by asking for a new set of sights after describing the problem.
You can also provide the serial number and the original receipt of where it was purchased if you care to bolster your complaint.
It was posted in a Colt sight thread just today that a front sight needs to be raised about 1/4" to raise the point of impact of a 10.5" barrel 10 inches at 25 yards.
I believe that may be based on a known formula.
In other words, you had a choice to either raise the front sight or to lower the rear sight, or a combination of both.
If the rear sight is unacceptably low now, then that is not only a basis to complain, but can also serve as more reason to ask for a new sight set so that you can find a way to acquire and replace the rear back to original configuration.
A front sight can be built up by adding solder to the blade or by soldering a new blade to the base.
A sight base that's too wide can also be made narrower to fit instead of changing the dovetail.
And in the process, try to duplicate the contour of the original front sight if you want to.
It's usually preferable to alter the least expensive part rather than the most expensive part.
In this case the front sight instead of the barrel and it's dovetail.
Unfortunately, you already altered the rear sight a lot, so perhaps you really would prefer that Pedersoli provide you with a new one.
But that's up to you to decide.
Also, Pedersoli has an authorized repair facility at Lee Shavers gunsmithing according to the Pedersoli website.
Maybe they can help you out if you contact them with complaints about a new gun.
If necessary, let Pedersoli know that you're a loyal customer and that you expect them to help you out or risk losing your future business.
People have written letters [or personal emails] to the president of a company for far less reasons and have received their personal attention.
You can also try Track of the Wolf or other vendors to see if they have any sights with bases that will fit your dovetails and will meet your needs.
VTI Gun Parts is probably the largest Pedersoli parts distributor in the USA.
I wish you success obtaining satisfactory results.

The formula for front sight adjustment or replacement is:
Record:
error on target in inches
distance to target in inches
sight radius in inches.
divide error on target by distance to target,
multiply by sight radius.

The sight radius is the distance between the front and rear sight expressed in inches.

If the rear sight is adjustable, adjust it to the middle of its adjustment limits to allow a range of adjustment up or down after replacing or modifying the front sight.

For example, if the sight radius on a pistol is 10 inches:

error on target= 12" low.
distance to target is 900".
sight radius is 10".
12" divided by 900" = 0.01333 x 10" = 0.133".

The front sight has to be lowered by 0.133 inches or a bit more than 1/8 of an inch (.125).

 

[Stony Broke]

I'm thinking about altering up a set of sights to match their tiny little dovetails and go from there. I have used a lot of the old design called California Sights in the past on pistols and rifles and have gotten to where that was sort of a standard for me, but haven't been able to locate any of them anymore. The Gun Works in Oregon carried them for years, but don't anymore.
I think if Pedersoli were to acknowledge a problem with the sights, at the best they would possibly supply me with another set of the same goofy setup I have now.
I did enquire with Flintlocks etc., to see if they had front sights available. They said the did for a price of 32.00 for a sight and 7.95 to mail it to me......I think I'll go a different direction.

 

[arcticap]

Correction: "It was posted in a Colt sight thread just today that a front sight needs to be raised about 1/4" to raise the point of impact of a 10.5" barrel 10 inches at 25 yards."
I should have said " a front sight would need to be raised about 1/4" to lower the point of impact....."

 

[Stantheman86]

If I'm paying that much for a pistol , I don't want to have to mess with the sights.

A Target pistol that hits a foot high at a standard 25 yard range is crazy, for the price they ask for these they should be factory sighted to a standard charge and round ball load.

 

[Stony Broke]

Most muzzleloaders I have had over the years didn't need anything but a little adjustment or trimming of the front sight to get them to shoot where they should. This one is going to be a challenge. I have to agree that for the price of their product a guy shouldn't have to go through all this...

 

[arcticap]

I agree.
I think that the front sight should be made high enough to simply need to file it down to the desired height.

 

[Stantheman86]

I was actually torn between a percussion Charles Moore or Continental Target pistol for when I get into "real" matches , and Dixie has the Charles Moore for $600.......I would hope for that price range I wouldn't have to perform my own gunsmithing to it.

Dixie lists the dovetail size it's like some wierd .270 size.

If it were me I would just hound Pedersoli and get a higher front sight and install it. They weren't ashamed to ship it like that , I wouldn't be ashamed to demand service from them.

This is the issue with them, is that they use geography as a barrier to direct service and make you use 3rd party distributors, the one doesn't even have a web store you have to call some shop phone # to order things.

 

[Stony Broke]

I doubt that anyone actually makes a higher front sight for the Charles Moore specifically. I find it's strange that my Pedersoli Kentucky needed nothing but a little trimming and tapping on the front sight and it works just fine. I've won quite a few matches with it already, and just got the Charles Moore to upgrade a little since it has a longer sight radius and a set trigger. Looks like I will still be using the Kentucky for some time until I get the bugs worked out of the Charles Moore.
There are a couple places that advertise parts for Pedersoli firearms, but we would just be dealing with replacement parts like they came with originally, not a proper upgrade to something that would actually work better.

 

[arcticap]

My concern is that the bore may not be in alignment with the barrel flats.
If most every other Moore pistol isn't as far off with their sights, then perhaps some pistols have too much barrel run out to be able to be regulated even with a new set of sights.
That's why the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
If the problem isn't brought up promptly after being discovered, then a person loses their chance to resolve a potential problem under an implied warranty period.
Beyond the 25 yard sighting in that was already made, will the point of impact stay consistent?
Will it hold 4 inches high at distances between 30 to 50 yards?
If the POI continues to rise beyond 25 yards then there could possibly be more than a sight problem.
Not saying there is, but isn't it possible?
Pedersoli could potentially provide a new barrel if a defect exists with it.
That's why Pedersoli has a US service center to consult with and to help resolve "issues".

 

[TFoley]

I was actually torn between a percussion Charles Moore or Continental Target pistol for when I get into "real" matches , and Dixie has the Charles Moore for $600.......I would hope for that price range I wouldn't have to perform my own gunsmithing to it.

Dixie lists the dovetail size it's like some wierd .270 size.

If it were me I would just hound Pedersoli and get a higher front sight and install it. They weren't ashamed to ship it like that , I wouldn't be ashamed to demand service from them.

This is the issue with them, is that they use geography as a barrier to direct service and make you use 3rd party distributors, the one doesn't even have a web store you have to call some shop phone # to order things.

The 'weird size' is because it has been converted from metric. Likely to be 9.5mm.

 

[Stony Broke]

Guess it wouldn't hurt to get some input from Pedersoli. I may be a little pessimistic about that sort of thing as in the past I've had things get completely warped out of a realistic solution to the problems when dealing with folks like that, but I'll give them a chance I guess.

 

[F.G. Ford]

Guess it wouldn't hurt to get some input from Pedersoli. I may be a little pessimistic about that sort of thing as in the past I've had things get completely warped out of a realistic solution to the problems when dealing with folks like that, but I'll give them a chance I guess.

I have a couple Pedersoli .45 pistols and one is being difficult to sight in. I normally shoot the Kentucky, but I have a Charles Moore that has been sitting in my safe for some time and I decided to sight it in today....that was a surprise. I have never purchased a muzzleloader pistol that shot almost a foot high at 25 yards. The rear sight is about 3/8 inch or so wide and really not what I would have chosen for a target pistol. I filed about 1/3 of the rear sight off while at the range and got it to shoot only about 4" high.
Basically what I think I'd like to do is replace the sights with something more akin to a target setup, but the dovetails are tiny on this pistol. Perhaps I will have to open up the dovetails to accommodate better sights, if I cannot find sights that will work in the factory dovetails.
Any suggestions of a better approach to this problem ?

Here is my input.
I have a Pedersoli Charles Moore .45 Pistol.
It actually shoots a .437 ball very well.
The Front sight is 0.135" high, and the rear sight is 0.185" high.
This pistol is the most accurate pistol I have ever owned, including modern hand guns as well.
Please let us know your sight height dimensions.
Fred

 

[Stony Broke]

Well...I bit the bullet today again, and went to the range with the Charles Moore. I managed to hammer, file and maybe defile the pistol some more, but actually got a group out of it. I think for the time being, I'll try to live with it as is....The pic is 5 shots at 25 yds. at a 5" target.

 

[johnfrommd]

I too have a Charles Moore flinter and it too shoots high. I am playing with modifying Dixie sight number EP1375 (https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/page/search?FullText=EP1735) It has a .270 dovetail and is .330 high. All this will need is to narrow the dovetail to fit the C.M. and file to adjust elevation. This sight is actually made for 1851 Colts but I believe it will work in this installation.

John

 

[Stony Broke]

I too have a Charles Moore flinter and it too shoots high. I am playing with modifying Dixie sight number EP1375 (https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/page/search?FullText=EP1735) It has a .270 dovetail and is .330 high. All this will need is to narrow the dovetail to fit the C.M. and file to adjust elevation. This sight is actually made for 1851 Colts but I believe it will work in this installation.

John

Keep us posted on how it works for you....and good luck..

 

[F.G. Ford]

Well...I bit the bullet today again, and went to the range with the Charles Moore. I managed to hammer, file and maybe defile the pistol some more, but actually got a group out of it. I think for the time being, I'll try to live with it as is....The pic is 5 shots at 25 yds. at a 5" target.

Not bad shooting.....too bad you had the two flyers!
With practice you will keep them all in the black.
Fred

 

[Stantheman86]

I'd be more than happy with that target.