Pedersoli Indian Trade Musket questions

[pacanis]

I wonder at Pedersoli using such a bad finish in the first place .

And why it was applied so poorly.

 

[rusticbob]

I have a Pedersoli trade gun. I could not stand the factory stock finish. I stripped it off, and applied many coats of TruOil. Happily there was a real nice piece of walnut underneath.

 

[pacanis]

I just brought my stock up from downstairs to finish drying where it's warmer.
I leaned it next to my Ped KY and I'm happy with the change.

I polished the trigger lever and sear bar. (I think that's what they are called). The trigger lever had a bunch of chatter marks in the direction you do not want them.
I can't loosen the screw holding the mainspring to disassemble the lock further, but I may not need to. It seems to be releasing from full cock OK. The screw holding the spring down had the head ground down some. First time seeing that.

 

[Snydly]

Looks like mine. I had to file the front sight WAY down to barely a nub before it would hit POA though. Probably just an issue of how I like to hold the gun & stick my cheek on it so that the flat of the barrel near my eye comes almost to the bottom of the front sight. Fun gun, though. Certainly got people scratching their heads when I showed up at a trap range with it.

I haven't filed the front sight yet but it is going to be just a nub when I am done. It shoot great though

 

[DuncNZ]

I have a Pedersoli trade gun. I could not stand the factory stock finish. I stripped it off, and applied many coats of TruOil. Happily there was a real nice piece of walnut underneath.

As far as wood is concerned , remember these were cheap guns in the first place and wouldn't have been stocked with highly figured wood. just plain walnut .

 

[NorthFork]

I just took possession of this gun I bought from Dixie.
The description said it came with a brass front sight, but it appears to be an iron sight and is painted brown like the rest of the barrel. Which was a pretty shoddy job. No big deal as I planned to strip it anyway. But could there be brass under that sight's paint?

Is have the wrong sight or is this how they come now and Dixie's description is wrong? I'm guessing there are more than a few of these in member's hands as I ran into some posts talking about modifying and inletting the serpent side plate thing.

Also, I've never seen a hex to round barrel done quite like this one. It almost looks like it has a twist in it and has two wedding bands/rings... is that normal?

Just want to clear up a few things before doing any work to it. Dixie's smith is out til next week.

I think it will make a great gun. I can't believe how perfect it fits me. The sight picture is spot on.

View attachment 202797

Here is the weird way it goes from hex to round. Not like my other fowler, that's for sure. You can also see the paint job. My BB carbine was done much better.
View attachment 202798

Seems like decent wood. Supposedly American walnut. But I want to darken it. Right now it looks like every other Pedersoli I have.
View attachment 202799

The browning is fake. Similar to Ceracoat. The older Peds looked very much like actual browning (mine included). The newer ones look like brown paint. The flats on yours look terrible. Nothing like mine. I'd return the gun for that alone. The Lott lock is slow. Nothing can be done about that. It is darn reliable though. Drill the flash hole out to at least 1/16" or greater. A Treso liner or a Ped beryllium bronze liner is best. The trigger pull weight is terrible. Mine is around 8#. Very little can be done about this. Lightening the sear spring can help, but not dramatically. The front sight is brass. Sorry Ped decided to paint over it. You will likely need to file it down some to make POA = POI. That is a good thing.

Sorry if I sound negative about this musket. There are a lot of bad points. That said, my Ped Indian Trade Musket will be buried with me. I've learned to love it that much.

 

[TDM]

Never thought that Pedersoli's quality would vary so much but in this day and age I guess it's really not that surprising.

 

[pacanis]

Never thought that Pedersoli's quality would vary so much but in this day and age I guess it's really not that surprising.

Yeah. Like I said, my BB's paint goes at least below the stock, if not completely around the barrel. I'll know more when I remove the paint from that barrel as well.
This is almost like they put the final coat of brown on while the barrel was in the stock. Pretty poor job for sure.

Does anymore know if Pedersoli has a serial# look up? Or customer service that will tell you when your gun was made? I can't find anything on their site. I'm curious how far apart my BB and this trade gun were...

 

[user 48702]

I bought the Pedersoli Trade Gun Kit a year ago last August, finished out really better than I expected, I browned the barrel on mine and it turned out pretty good. Their photos showed a steel butt plate, but I was pleasantly surprised to find the one in the kit was brass. Here is a photo album of the kit out of the box to finish.

Pedersoli Indian Trade Musket Kit

 

[barracudadave67]

The serial # on your Pedersoli should be on the left rear side of the barrel, along with a build date code. They have also started putting the regular date in boxes.

Dave

 

[pacanis]

Thanks Dave.
I'm guessing this is the date code?
"Italy/22"

Because my BB says Italy /21.

Pedersoli must have changed painters from 2021-22.
That could explain it.

 

[jimhallam]

I just took possession of this gun I bought from Dixie.
The description said it came with a brass front sight, but it appears to be an iron sight and is painted brown like the rest of the barrel. Which was a pretty shoddy job. No big deal as I planned to strip it anyway. But could there be brass under that sight's paint?

Is have the wrong sight or is this how they come now and Dixie's description is wrong? I'm guessing there are more than a few of these in member's hands as I ran into some posts talking about modifying and inletting the serpent side plate thing.

Also, I've never seen a hex to round barrel done quite like this one. It almost looks like it has a twist in it and has two wedding bands/rings... is that normal?

Just want to clear up a few things before doing any work to it. Dixie's smith is out til next week.

I think it will make a great gun. I can't believe how perfect it fits me. The sight picture is spot on.

View attachment 202797

Here is the weird way it goes from hex to round. Not like my other fowler, that's for sure. You can also see the paint job. My BB carbine was done much better.
View attachment 202798

Seems like decent wood. Supposedly American walnut. But I want to darken it. Right now it looks like every other Pedersoli I have.
View attachment 202799

This is not a NEW idea --- many "trade guns" were painted --- obviousy made down to a price. In some cases they even painted fake (now called "faux" by the trendies!) "stub twist" on the barrels and as for the butts - YUK!!!!! This was continued well into the 20th Century -- and many of the guns which appeared for sale in the 1960's Centenary sufferred the same fate.

 

[rusticbob]

As far as wood is concerned , remember these were cheap guns in the first place and wouldn't have been stocked with highly figured wood. just plain walnut .

Cheap guns!
Only on this forum would somebody describe a $800.+ gun “cheap”
Love my “cheap guns”, mine are tools, dependable, durable, and pretty enough that I hang them on the wall.

 

[NorthFork]

Cheap guns!
Only on this forum would somebody describe a $800.+ gun “cheap”
Love my “cheap guns”, mine are tools, dependable, durable, and pretty enough that I hang them on the wall.

He was referring to original trade guns as being made cheaply. And they were! He was not referring to modern day replicas.

 

[pacanis]

This is not a NEW idea --- many "trade guns" were painted --- obviousy made down to a price. In some cases they even painted fake (now called "faux" by the trendies!) "stub twist" on the barrels and as for the butts - YUK!!!!! This was continued well into the 20th Century -- and many of the guns which appeared for sale in the 1960's Centenary sufferred the same fate.

I was not speaking historically.
If you read further on you will see a few members saying their trade guns actually had a "browned" barrel and not the painted one that mine came with. (As well as my Brown Bess carbine.) Others have the painted barrel. And one member even suggested his barrel was powder coated.

 

[user 48702]

I was not speaking historically.
If you read further on you will see a few members saying their trade guns actually had a "browned" barrel and not the painted one that mine came with. (As well as my Brown Bess carbine.) Others have the painted barrel. And one member even suggested his barrel was powder coated.

If they bought a Pedersoli Trade Gun with a true rust browned barrel, it would have to have been made prior to about 2005, as that is about the time frame they began using the Cerakote ceramic finish on just about everything except guns that were blued. I don't even know if they had the Trade Gun in their catalog prior to coming out with the Cerakote finish. They even have a French Gray finish that is Cerakote, as well as a Cerakote chrome finish. They even use it on many models in the $2,500 to $3,000 range. I first noticed the finish at the 2007 SHOT Show in Vegas. I had been attending the show since 1999, and 2007 was the first I had seen or heard of it.

If you notice in their advertising, they don't say "Rust Brown Finish" the ads read "Rust Brown Color Finish" I don't care for the finish and try to find a kit which has an unfinished barrel when ones are available. The finish is so tough, acetone will not cut it. Easiest way to remove it is bead blasting, with sanding being the most time consuming.

 

[pacanis]

If they bought a Pedersoli Trade Gun with a true rust browned barrel, it would have to have been made prior to about 2005, as that is about the time frame they began using the Cerakote ceramic finish on just about everything except guns that were blued. I don't even know if they had the Trade Gun in their catalog prior to coming out with the Cerakote finish. They even have a French Gray finish that is Cerakote, as well as a Cerakote chrome finish. They even use it on many models in the $2,500 to $3,000 range. I first noticed the finish at the 2007 SHOT Show in Vegas. I had been attending the show since 1999, and 2007 was the first I had seen or heard of it.

If you notice in their advertising, they don't say "Rust Brown Finish" the ads read "Rust Brown Color Finish" I don't care for the finish and try to find a kit which has an unfinished barrel when ones are available. The finish is so tough, acetone will not cut it. Easiest way to remove it is bead blasting, with sanding being the most time consuming.

Maybe the date will interest those that have rust browned barrels.
Good info to have for any buyers purchasing from sellers describing their gun as "new old stock" if they don't have a good picture and they know the date it was made.

As I've said, the description clearly reads browned barrel. I knew what I was buying and the finish the barrel was going to have on it going in. Having learned from the purchase of my BB carbine. But that wasn't the crux of my first post anyway. I was more concerned it might not have the brass front sight and the odd look to the transition from octagonal to round.

The picture of the poor paint job was just to show those interested.
But talking 'bout paint is keeping a few of you busy

If you consider spray on stripper, a sanding pad and an hour's time, time consuming, you are even more impatient than I am
I'm glad I didn't go through the trouble of bead blasting it for as easy as it was to remove the paint in my slop sink.


So anyway...
It's back together.

The wood is a shade or two darker... not as much as I was hoping for when the stain was wet, but when you're applying stain over an oil finish or previously stained piece of wood you can't expect much.
And I decided to French Gray the barrel. It was too "in the white" looking for a gun that was most likely blued way back when.

But the lock definitely needs more work done to it. I think I'll shoot it some before I work on anything else.

 

[pacanis]

First time at the range here if anyone is interested.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...ersoli-indian-trade-musket-smoothbore.160552/

 

[edw.marshall]

I’ve seen a couple of these guns.

The one flaw that pedersoli needs to get right on this gun and it’s brown bess is the thimbles are inlet way too shallow and pinned to low. Too much pressure in the wrong direction and those thimbles will break the stock.

The finish on the barrel is a chemical coloring finish, not easy to put on and not easy to remove.

Some octagon to round barrels without wedding bands have flats that fade into the round section.

A lot of Dutch and french muskets were made that way.

According to an email from Pedersoli cust. service, they use a hot chemical bath not unlike a hot bluing bath to brown their barrels. It’s not paint or epoxy.

 

[rusticbob]

I love mine, I stripped the ugly factory finish and there was a beautiful piece of walnut underneath.