Pederzoli Brown Bess?

[brno]

I`m thinking of getting a Brown Bess and kind of like the Pederzoli made one. What are your thoughts? is there a better one?

 

[mikee51848]

Depends...if you're expecting it to be an exact copy of a short land model, it's not (too much wood, wrong year on lock plate). If you're looking for a reliable shooting gun, or a well made replica, it's the best on the market. :thumbsup:

 

[Craig]

I own the carbine version called the Dixie Brown Bess Indian Musket sold by Dixie Gun Works. It shoots well and looks great. It looks like a Bess, as far as I am concerned. There are different Besses at different time periods. You should look around first, thoroughly, before you buy.

 

[Grenadier1758]

AS a reenactor for the Frech and Indian War, it is a gun of the period of the American War of Independence. It has the issues previously mentioned for reenacting. None the less, it is certainly acceptable for use.

The better guns are far more expensive and the cheaper guns have too much wood and take some tuning to get to shoot well.

I went for the India made Long Land Pattern gun offered by Loyalist Arms. I sold a Pedersoli Short Land Pattern to buy the Loyalist Arms Gun. I haven't regretted my decision. I have seen the Long Land Pattern gun offered by Middlesex Village Traders. It is certainly acceptable for use in reenacting and they will shoot. It really depends on what is available in your area and how much you want to spend.

 

[mckutzy]

where did u get that mitre cap?

 

[brno]

So the ones made in India that Loyalist Arms sell are of good quality. I was hesitant of something made in India. So they are more accurate of a reproduction?

 

[Wes/Tex]

The India built guns are more correct externally though I'd think the Pederzoli gun si probably better built. The guns from India are stocked in teak and are probably safe to shoot. There was some problems initially but these seem to have been taken care of. The biggest problem is their somewhat "clunky" appearance. The sood can definitely use a good job of thinning. They are the only versions of the Long and Short Land Pattern guns available short of custom made guns.

 

[Eric N.]

Thanks for the info.I have been looking at the Brown Bess.Are these 1st or 2nd Model? The reason I ask is I carried the 2nd model in the US Army. Company A 1st Bn 3rd Inf.(The Old Guard) Fort McNair,Washington DC. 1974-1975

 

[Grenadier1758]

My bess is a first model long land pattern generaly grouped in the 1730s for manufacture. My lock is dated 1728, Dublin Castle. Tell tale marks of the early first models are the wooden ramrod, lack if a brass nose cap and carving details around the lock and wrist. The lock is more round faced, lacks a bridle for the frizzen and the plate has more curve. The First of Foot departed from the Irish Establishment for the colonies in to participate in the taking of Louisbourg during the F&I War.

The mitre cap cam from a lot of embroidered caps plates. Most of the members of the unit have one specially embroidered for them or make the mitre themselves. The rest of the cap will have to be assembled. I used scraps of wool from my uniform to make the remainder of the cap.

 

[PvtC]

As Gren58 has pointed out the Loyalist long land is more appropriate for F&I. The Pedersoli short land is kind of a Frankenstein monster combining features of disparate models and types of land service muskets. One thing to be mindful of is that the weight of my Loyalist long land is probably in excess of 14 lbs. Gren 58's shown above looks much like mine. It can be a burden to bear over a 2 day reenactment. The ubiquitous Pedersoli is much handier at about 9 lbs. If you look closely you will often see the Pedersolis prominantly utilized in TV productions ranging from the Jacobite rebellion through the War of 1812. IMHO, I would start with a Pedersoli or Loyalist and then begin saving a few shekels every week for a Rifle Shoppe 1728 or 1742. pattern Bess.

 

[krasnayaznamya]

I shot several Bess's owned by members of my RevWar regiment (1st Virginia) before deciding on the Discriminating General Short Land Pattern. It weighs in a 9 lbs, is more historically accurate than the Pedersoli, is not as cumbersome as the Long Land (although for F&I, you're pretty much stuck there), and is a great shooter. I've had it for a year now. Plus, I saved $400 over the Pedersoli. The stock comes with a resin coating, so I stripped it to some nice wood underneath and natural stained it. Turned out simply great.

I haven't had a single problem with the musket, and would definitely recommend it. I recently shot a friend's Long Land from Loyalist, and the thing is pretty heavy!! Really surprised me when I picked it up. Add the bayonet on top of that and it's definitely something to heft around the battlefield!

If you're looking for a period piece, though, be careful. Long Land for F&I, Long and Short Land for RevWar, the India Pattern (sometimes called a 3rd Model) for post-RevWar.

Whatever you choose, you'll enjoy it!!

 

[brno]

After talking with a few different people I`ve kind of got an eye now on the 1st model Bess affered by Loyalist Arms. It seems Pederzoli has gone down in quality the last while. Not too shy about the weight issue as it will only be used for a fun gun and will likely only see range type use.

 

[ffffg]

there are clunkers, chevys, buicks cadilacs, corvetts, firarris and lamberginies, sorry bad speller... in a few words you get what you pay for.. if your looking for a starter gun i think thats wonderfull, welcome to black powder.. id try to go used if you can, then if you find by going to shoots, what you want later, you wont loose much if any money.. there must be alot of these in closets becouse you dont see many around used.. heres my favorite source but no besses there.. [url] http://www.flintlocks.com/[/url] these guns properly built are probably in the buick range, replacement parts are available,. i good gunbuilder can make them as high quality as you can get... alot of the cheaper guns dont have acceptable/fitting replacement parts,sometimes lock problems that can lead to flinching etc.. .. any gun with a good gunsmith can be made into a good shooter, but the cost is usually the same as an uper end gun in the end.. there is nothing wrong with a gun you can afford now to see how far you want to get into the game.. here is a place to look where you have a couple days to inspect the gun and return if you dont like it[url] http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(mt4a3z2ihyfyww55rfi23345))/Index.aspx[/url] go to guns then click on flintlocks :v ...good luck, dave

 

[benvenuto]

heres a good article on the various brown bess models
link

there was a good review of the indian made besses up somewhere, with lots of comparisson photos with an original, but the link I have doesn't work any more

 

[mckutzy]

y2k- well i think you were asking about the bess, i have a jap made bess 1st model longland .75cal.
i dont know about the indian made models altho i have seen the ones from driscrimanating general. They are prety nice, finish and wood is great. looks like crome but i think its just good old elbowgrease. The pedersoli ones i have seen are the india patern, they are light.....er...moreso than the longland. quite the crackshot if i say so myself with one of those. i was thinkin about trying to shoot some trap with on of those soon well we will see.
ihave actualy contributed my practice with the bess, to shooting trap with a 12ga. that i borrored at range a wile back. the guys though that i was some kind of pro, i havent spen much time on centerfire firearms because i dont have a licence for them. the bess handles wery simular in my opinion

 

[Parzifal]

:grin:
I got my transition 1st model bess from loyalist arms "specials" section..and I thinned the stock by sanding,then stained her special walnut and then lynseed oil 50/50 with varsol in 6 or so coats...I scrubbed the bore down until I was happy.
Shes not heavy, but I am a 28 y/o man.
It is a fine arm, and shoots exceedingly well ,but that long barell can be tedious to clean after a day of shooting .
But its all part of the fun!

cheers!

 

[VanZeumeren]

So the ones made in India that Loyalist Arms sell are of good quality. I was hesitant of something made in India. So they are more accurate of a reproduction?

I have an East India Company pattern Brown Bess from Loyalist and was able to visit their shop to pick it up. Blair (owner/operator) gets parts from India, but he manufactures the muskets himself.

I love the Bess that I got from Loyalist. It's a great, heavy brute, but then again so am I!

 

[Iron Jim Rackham]

The Pedersoli interpretation of the short land musket is the accepted standard. It has some historical warts (lockdate, exaggerated lock points, stock thickness, etc) but is acceptable for most Rev War, living history presentations.

Quality is typical of contemporary Italian reproductions. Pan to barrel fit is passable to poor, inletting and wood to metal fit is average.

I've had a couple of Pedersoli muskets and they were generally serviceable quality. If you are using it for living history, you'll be more satisfied than if you intend to use it for hunting. It will perform acceptably with 3 drams of powder and 1 1/4 of shot, and it with practice you ,may be able to shoot hand sized single ball groups at 50 yards.

If you want to use it as a fowler for breaking clays or bagging flying birds, there are many better choices available.

Likewise, if you are seriously authentic about living history and are portraying early Rev War British or American, a Long Land musket is a better choice. I'm not a fan of the Indian made products, simply because of the 3rd world manufacturing standards.