point 'n' shoot

[scott adair]

Gentlemen,

How do most of you shoot your c&b revolvers? Do you take take careful aim or use the point shootin technique? I have been experimenting with both techniques using my ruger single six .22 for a few years now and am becomming a big fan of point shooting. I can definitely see some benefit to being familiar with both techniques. Anyone else had similar experiences?

Scott

 

[Old Ironsights]

Both are good, but you will never shoot 80+ at 50 by point shooting... :hmm:

 

[biliff]

Depends on which C&B you're talking about. The '51 Navy (and '61) are about the sweetest thing going for point shooting. Do it all the time shooting cowboy matches. It's like shooting a shotgun. The '60 Army, Remingtons, etc, just don't point real well for me and I have to find the sights for any consistent accurracy.
I can also point shoot my 1911 real well, too but that's another forum.

 

[mewing6003]

I use the sights on my cap & balls. Oddly enough, I point shoot with my Berreta when I do bowling pin shoots and I do very well with it.

 

[scott adair]

I agree that when you want best accuracy that using the sights is the way to go. Point shooting has a certain flow to it though. I had been looking at the '51 navy and thought it might be a nice one for occasional point shooting. Glad my suspicion was correct.


Scott

 

[mikelange]

The grip frame of the Colt and Colt-style revolvers that originated with the '51 Navy, if not the Dragoons or Walker, and continued through the Single-action Army (and the Ruger Blackhawks and Single Sixes), is, IMHO and that of numerous other shooters through the years, the finest ever devised for "point" shooting. You won't score high "points" on targets :haha:, as compared to using the sights on a gun you're familiar with, but with practice you can quickly and consistently hit any object larger than a soup can at close range. I will concede that, in the world of formal target shooting, this has little if any real value, but it's sure a ton of fun. In a bygone era it could also have meant the difference between living and dying.

 

[Zonie]

My father was a pistol man and a "point and shoot" or "instinct shooter".

I don't know how he would have done on a formal target because, I never saw him shoot at one in my life, but for practical shooting he could get the job done.

Anything he wanted to hit that was larger than a Walnut within 35 yards of him would be hit on the first shot, without aiming with the sights.
He would look, point, and shoot.

Although it happened long before I was born, that accuracy included a 50 cent piece.
One of his friends had one and said "Frank, I bet you can't hit this!" amd threw it up in the air.
My dad drew and fired once.
They never did find the coin. :rotf:

 

[mikelange]

Zonie --

My reference to a soup can was a roundabout way of describing what I can consistently hit :redface:. Long ago and far away, in the wild west (well, modern-day, smallish-town Arizona), before I married and my wife decreed that there were better things to spend one's money on (as a bachelor my only vehicle was a motorcycle, and I never had a phone or TV), I burned between 500 and 1000 rounds of .22 and .357 per week through a pair of Ruger single-actions. I only got good enough to realize I wasn't that good.

Sounds like your dad was :thumbsup:.

 

[SAJones]

I spent years in NRA Bullseye shooting, so I have a "gotta use the sights" syndrome. Worked against me in the Duel event at rendezvous: had to align the sights and was always a casualty 'cause the other guy shot first. I've practiced point & shoot, but any target smaller than an elephant is safe.

 

[Zonie]

I used to be fair at it when using a Colt Frontier Scout (.22) but I had put thousands of rounds thru it and developed an instinctive feeling for where it would hit.

Even with the knowledge of where it will shoot, there is more to it than just eye/hand coordination.
There is a mind frame thing that's very hard to describe but if it only envolved seeing, some might call tunnel vision.

It envolves more than seeing though. It is a concentration which only lasts long enough to get the shot off but just proceeding the shot all thoughts are directed at the object.
As I say, it's hard to describe and after all of these years I don't know if I could develop it again or not.

I last used this "concentration" 20+ years ago when I shot .22 pistol competition (and I found that I couldn't always do it).
I think if you talk to the folks who really score high consistantly most will tell you (if they are being totally honest) that when their shooting, their entire mental focus is on the bulls eye/sights/trigger not individually, but as a singular thing of its own.
They see the sights and hold them aligned with one another and watch as the sights swing thru the X ring and they "feel" when to squeeze the trigger.
They don't hear the other guns, they don't even hear their own gun fire. They know it did but it doesn't enter into their thoughts while it's happening.

As I say, it is hard to describe. :hmm:

 

Hey Zonnie, what you are discribing is a little used art in these modern times called CONCENTRATION!!!

:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Really, verry few people know how to do this any more and us old timers, that were taught how, guard the secret as a match winning strategy.

When I shoot speed matches, with any pistol I own, SS, revolver or automatic, I only know that two things exist in the world: the target and the front sight. I hear nothing and see nothing outside the "tunnel". I never know I have touched the trigger or that the gun is in recoil. I am on autopilot and the gun just goes off as the front sight touches the target.

'course that developed after shooting 1000 rounds a week for over ten years. I wore out a half dozen .45 autos, and almost as many S&W 38 revolvers. One year I cast and shot up an entire 55 gallon barrel of wheel weights.

Only fear of falling, fear of loud noises and sucking are instinctive to humans, everything else is learned behavior. A specific gun may "feel right" or shoot better than another for you, but it is all learned behavior.

I have taught "point shooting" to several people over the years. Some take to it better than others, but it is still something that one can learn if they have the proper instruction. It is sort of odd, but I have found that the "laid back" personality types take to speed shooting best.

 

My father too was a point and shoot man. He was good. This skill helped him alot, as he was an FBI Agent. I aim. If you are shooting at targets, I think aiming (using your sights) is best. In combat there is a real advantage to point shooting, if you can do it. I have made some pretty good point shots "by accident"--I wasn't thinking about it and instinct took over--but usually aiming is what is "natural" for me.

 

[mikelange]

Not so odd, really, Ghost. Most of us who grew up shooting were taught to aim. My dad was and is a fanatic on the subject; a shot fired without the guidance of careful aim was, IHHO, wasted, and a hit scored under those circumstances was blind luck. Being, as you put it, fairly laid back (or having a problem with most forms of authority, would be another way to put it :haha, I found it easy to commence "wasting" ammo and teaching myself to (usually but far from always) hit various objects by pointing rather than aiming.

I agree about the concentration, though. Even if only for the split-second (or several seconds) it might take to locate, focus on, and fire at a target, the odds of a hit are far better if for that bit of time the target and (unless hip shooting) front sight are all that exist.

 

[Zonie]

ghost: Thanks.
For a moment, while I was writing that, I had a feeling that folks were going to say "Ole' Zonie has flipped outta his frinkled mind!" :grin:

Concentration is a good word and comes close to what I was talking about but it doesn't go far enough.
One should concentrate on the sight alignment making absolutly certain there is a equal gap on both sides of the front sight and the tops are flush, and one should concentrate on the target, and one should concentrate on the trigger pull but even doing all three of these simultaneously still isn't going to the extreme I am trying to describe.
Although what I was talking about is related more to target shooting than point and shoot the basic mindframe for both of these is very similar.

I guess the best phrase I can think of for point shooting is to Think THRU the target. :hmm:

 

[Old Ironsights]

I guess the best phrase I can think of for point shooting is to Think THRU the target. :hmm:

Zen is... :rotf:

But it works for all the Oriental Arts. :hmm:

 

[Charley Hart]

I aim but it usually is just as effective to point and shoot...for me anyway...