pydodex vs 777 vs blackpowder

[paulvallandigham]

As an Illinois, Lawyer, I can advise you that you can attend a shoot in Illinois, without an Illinois FOID Card, which would not be issued to an out -of-stater, anyway! Your Missouri Driver's License will confirm that you are a non resident, and you can attend Illinois shoots, as long as you can legally possess firearms, and black powder in your state of origin. In fact, we give non-residents 60 days to acquire a FOID card when they move their residency to Illinois. For that 60 day period, you are still legal to own and possess firearms that were legal in your home state. I always advise people to apply for the the FOIL card before obtaining a New, Ilinois Driver's License, just so they have that proof that they are new to the state. They can have an Illinois bank account, with checks showing the correct address, and credit cards addressed to the new address. Just hang on to that out of state DL until you have your ILL. FOID card.

As to selling powder. If you go together with others and combine money to buy the powder, and then split the case, you are violating no laws. I would not give or sell a can of black powder to anyone in Illinois who did not have an FOID card, either. And, I would have to know them. The powder I loan them is to be replaced when they get their order of powder. My " payment " for the new powder is to loan them some of my old powder. They can either give me back the loaned powder, or give me new powder in exchange. I don't expect to see Homeland Security officers swarming my black powder club, and if they did, I have enough confidence in the good sane citizens of Illinois to render a not guilty verdict if charges were filed, and we were taken to trial.

 

[Runner]

Lots of Mo residents have Illinois firearms cards. It is quite common because you can't even go rabbit hunting over there without one. I don't care if you are a lawyer. The law says in very plain lanquage that it is illegal for anyone that does not have a firearms owners card to possess black powder in Illinios, and that it is also illegal for anyone to even give them powder while they are there. The law does not leave any gray areas. It is quite plain. The NRA lawyers are who provided that information along with a copy of the law in one of the magazines and online. Since I used to attend two shoots over there, I checked with the state. The state says that if they catch you in the state with your muzzleloader and you don't have a firearms owners card, that they will arrest you, confiscate the gun, tow your car, and let the judge sort it out. That is directly from the Illinois State Patrol. Now, Lawyer that.
Also you need to read the new BP regulation issued last year by the Department of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives. It clearly says that to distribute BP without a liscense is a crime. It also says that legal sellers have to ask what the purchaser is going to use it for and has to make an attempt to make sure it is for a legal purpose before selling it. That is what killed my local supply because they are sure that if someone ever does use it in a bomb, that the seller could be held responsible for the damages in civil court.
You may be a lawyer, but you better call the Illinois State patrol before you tell people it is legal. The Illinois law enforcement says it isn't.

 

Before you tell people to order a lot and split it, you need to consider the laws involved.

By all means, check the laws in your area before doing anything someone suggests.

Since it's impossible to know what everyone else's laws are, perhaps it should be up to the person taking the advise to know if they are breaking the law? I just assumed that everyone would take personal responsibility for their own actions?

 

[paulvallandigham]

I didn't say you would not be the victim of a false arrest and false imprsonment. The boys here with the badges have inflated senses of their importance. Don't get your law from cops. They don't know it, and they refuse to listen to the lawyers who teach them in the academy. They also are always fighting with the local prosecutors about what the law is.

 

[Runner]

I am not a lawyer, so the lanquage is difficult for me to remember. It says it is unlawfull to convey unto any person who does not have an Ilinois gun owners card any amount of black powder for any purpose, even as a gift. I forget what it said about out of state people, but they were definately included in the law. I really did read the law, had this discussion with an Illinois resident at a gathering, and then called the Illinois State patrol to find out just what they thought the law ment. That was just before the last gathering at Dupo, so two years or so ago. A person that argued with me about it called and they told him the same thing. Believe me, I wish it wasn't so. I can be on the bridge headed into Illinois in less than 30 minutes.

 

[paulvallandigham]

The reason the law is so difficult to understand is because there is more than one section of the statutes that have to be read, and applied together to understand what is allowed. We Illinois Gun owners have complained about this for years, but the Legislators like it the way it is. This allows the police to terrorize " Those people " who they don't want having guns or BP, while leaving us people pretty much alone. I can't see any Southern Illinois States Attorney prosecuting one of these complaints if he wants to be re-elected. People down there take their guns seriously. And, most folks don't even know its illegal to carry a loaded gun concealed under Illinois law. Its done in some of the counties all the time.

Please, contact a lawyer about the LAW, and not police officers. As they say, some of my best friends are cops, but one of the reason we are such good friends is that they know they can ask me about the laws and get straight answers. I am also one of the few lawyers they know who shoot well, hunt, and teach both hunter safety, and personal self defense. If you knew some of the dept. regulations that officers have to obey about using deadly force, you would wonder why any officer would ever respond to a ' shots fired " , or " armed robbery call ".

 

[pmwest]

Pardon the reversion to the original question but I did some simple testing about a year ago comparing granular Pyrodex RS, Pyrodex pellets and Goex 2Fg. I did not include 777 simply because it was not a logical option for the gun I was running the test with (but then neither was the Pyrodex, the gun used was a T/C Firestorm flintlock). Loads were 100 gr measured by volume or two pellets. Projectile was a Hornady GP bullet. The results of 5 shot averages over a chronograph showed the pellets gave a higher velocity but greater deviation. Goex gave the lowest velocity but very little deviation. My unqualified conclusion is that Goex will give the best shot to shot consistency when compared to Pyrodex. Less deviation in velocity generally equals better accuracy.

 

Are you sure you still live in the "free" United States of America?

A lot of times I think there was some glitch in name-giving. It should read "Divided States of America".

Last development I saw in the MidwayUSA catalog #30 is that Las Vegas is on the list where they will NOT send any front-stuffer or blackpowder arms. Makes Las Vegans the same like Washington, DC, Chicago, Ill., New York, NY,... :youcrazy:

Albeit, prostitution is NOT legal in LV but... you know... :rotf:

 

[roundball454]

I find this discussion on law enlightening(sp), the "lawyers" view things seperatly from the "cops" who see things differently from the "prosecuters" all of whom have it wrong according to the Judges, AND as one of you pointed out the swarmy polititions LIKE to write the laws that-a-way.
How on GOD'S green earth are the "little" people (myself included) to negotiate through the blackened maze of "requirements" and then render accurate decisions while on jury duty? (? 1)
And how are we to provide a proper defense when the prosecuters use strong arm tactics(county lockups,mental institutions, ect), to EXTRACT plea bargains, for rules that nobody agrees on?(?2)
Some times I think that we have grown "to smart" for our own good. By so dooing we have boxed ourselves into a legal corner from which only tyrany will result.
my two "sense"
thanks for the discussion

 

[paulvallandigham]

The straight answer to your question is that the judge instructs the jury, orally, and in writing on the law that is to be applied by the jury to the facts and other evidence presented to them by the parties to the case. That is how they learn what to do. However, one of the instructions is to give the Defendant the benefit of the doubt, until and unless you are convinced that each of the elements of the offense have been proven beyond a reasonable doubt. In some states, the phrase " to a moral certainty " is added after " proven" and before " beyond ".

What that means is that if you have any doubt about the case , you should vote to acquit. When the prosecutors can't convict people any more, the will get the legislators to change the rules. Whether those changes will be good or bad is up to the boters. ( YOU!)