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wagne

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ok here goes as i have said in my introduction i now own my first ever musket its a repro harpers ferry 1816 in.69 now i have pyrodex and tophats
wads i dont know anything about, and what would be the maximum charge of powder my gun would take
oh and i have a ball mould in the post to me, i appologise for my ignorance on the matter but im keen to learn and even keener to use my new freind
 
welcome to the Forum - 85 grs 2F would be a stiff charge in your .69 - the max recommended is likely a little more but caution is advisable. use a snug fitting greased PRB over a felt wad for best accuracy.
Paul V is the man to ask about your musket he shoots them regular.
 
Welcome to the forums. You have much to learn, and this is the place to start.

Did you actually Measure the bore of your gun before ordering the ball mold??? .69 caliber can cover a range of Actual dimensions. Its important to know to the thousandths of an inch what your bore diameter is. Use a caliper to measure the bore diameter of the gun. If this is a recent purchase, you should be able to go on a website for the factory and get some decent information.


A .69 caliber is a 14 gauge shotgun size( .693" nominally). If you are going to shoot Patched round balls from this smoothbore, then you want to order a Round Ball that is about 10 to 15 thousandths of an inch SMALLER than the ACTUAL bore diameter. I checked the Track of the Wolf Website for what they are selling in ball diameters that would work for your gun, assuming it IS .690" in diameter, and found they offer both a .675", and a .678" diameter ball.
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(w...atId=2&subId=25&styleId=58&PageSize=25&Page=3

At about $10.00 for 25 each, I think it would be wise for you to order 25 of each diameter, and try them with different powder loads and Patch thicknesses to see what gives you the best accuracy. Only then would I advise you to order a ball mold.

As for wads, or patches, it depends if you are going to use the gun for RB shooting, only or for both RB and Shot loads. YOu can keep it very simple by ordering and using only Over Shot Cards( .025" thick, from track, or other suppliers. At $7.50 per 1,000, you are set up for a lot of shooting. Use 2-4 cards over the powder, then put in your shot charge, then 2 cards on top of the shot. If you poke an off center hole with an awl in each of the cards, and then load them in the barrel so that the holes DON'T line up with each other, the air passing through the hole in each card will separate the cards when they leave the muzzle, so they can fall out of the line of fire quickly, leaving the shot to form a decent pattern, that is good to 25 yards or so. I see recommended load for the 14 gauge of:

2 1/2 drams( 69 grains) with 1 oz. of shot.
2 3/4 drams( 76 grains) with 1 oz. of shot.
3 1/8 drams( 86 grains) wih 1 1/8 oz. shot.

Don't try to make this a magnum shotgun. With Black Powder( FFg)and a barrel that is NOT CHOKED- ie. is referred to as a "cylinder bore" gun-- the effective range is going to be about 25 yards. After that, the patterns get to large to insure enough pellets with enough remaining energy will strike a flying bird.

As for powder charges using BLACK POWDER( not pyrodex) you can start at about 60 grains of FFg, and work up by 5 grain increments to 80 grains and see what gives the best accuracy. Much beyond that and the recoil is going to begin to be noticed. If you are going to use Pyrodex( RS) powder in the gun, then 60 grains of BP is equal to only 48 grains of Pyrodex. 80 grains of BP is equal to only 64 grains of pyrodex. They will represent an equal VOLUME of powder when measure in a volume powder measure, but if placed on a scale, and weighed, the difference is that pyrodex weights only 80% of the weight of Black Powder. Keep that ratio in mind as you use the pyrodex. Hodgdon, the manufacturer of Pyrodex, puts out a nice manual that give you pretty good loading data for their powder. Check their on-line website to see if you can get it off the internet, or if you can order their latest information directly from them.

If I were going to try a RB load in your gun, I would start with that .675" diameter RB, and use a .015" thick cloth patch( pillow ticking or pocket drill) greased with Wonderlube. I would begin with that 60 grain charge of BP. ( or 48 grains of Pyrodex RS). I would first shoot the gun off a rest at 25 yards, in hopes of getting the shots on paper. Some guns are made intentionally with tall front sights and until the front sight is filed down, the balls strike low. I would be looking for consistency in POI at that short range. When I had a group on paper, I would move back to 50 yards, and then begin to increase the powder charges in 5 shot groups, to see how much more powder will raise the point of impact on paper, and see if the group size gets smaller. Always locate and Pick up every patch that is fired from the barrel. The condition of the patch will tell you immediately if your lube is correct, or if the patch thickness is correct, or wrong, and if you need to be using a Over Powder Wad between the powder and the PRB to protect the patch and ball from burning. In a smoothbore, there is NO place for the patch to go. When greased, or wetted, the cloth will compress about 1/3 of its thickness, but not much more. So, choosing the correct thickness of patch for a smoothbore is a lot more critical when shooting RB than for shooting RBs out of a rifle, where the cloth can squeeze into the grooves and allow you to use a thicker patch.

You will need a short starter to load your gun, and you should have a solid metal Range rod for loading and cleaning the gun.

I suggest you invest $15.00 and buy Dutch Schoultz's Black Powder Rifle Accuracy System. Its the best education you can get for that kind of money. If I had his system years ago when I first started out, I would saved many times the cost of the materials, and hundreds of hours making mistake after mistake as I learned how to get accuracy out of any MLer. While his system is written with a RIFLE in mind, the information applies to both Rifles and Smoothbores when firing RB loads.
http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

Keep asking questions. The only way you can learn is by asking. One for you: is the nipple on your gun designed to be used with Musket caps? If its a standard rifle nipple, the #11 caps( magnum caps for any BP substitute powder, including Pyrodex) would cost you less money are are perfectly adequate to fire those powder charges.

Oh, Get a nipple wrench when you are picking up other supplies. It needs to be used after every shooting session so you can clean the nipple, and the flash channel in the bolster that leads from the nipple to the back of the barrel. And buy some pipe cleaners to use in cleaning that flash channel, too.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
wagne said:
ok here goes as i have said in my introduction i now own my first ever musket its a repro harpers ferry 1816 in.69 now i have pyrodex and tophats
wads i dont know anything about, and what would be the maximum charge of powder my gun would take
oh and i have a ball mould in the post to me, i appologise for my ignorance on the matter but im keen to learn and even keener to use my new freind

I am confused, we have another UK member here that says he is not allowed to use a single roung projectile in England, only shot.

dukewellington said:
By UK law I can't fire single lead ball So I had to think of something else to use for target shooting.
 
i and others can fire a round ball or conical providing it is on our fac which i have however we can only fire them on approved ranges we cannot use them for hunting game only with shot in that instance hope that clears that up lol i certainly am not out to break any laws only to learn as much as i can so when i go to the range im not looking a right numpty
 
Welcome to the Forum

You will probably find that the Pyrodex won't work well in a flintlock. It apparently needs more pressure to work reliably. Blackpowder will give you better result.

I assume that this new gun is a smoothbore. When you go to the range take different thicknesses of patching materials. You want the patch/ball combination to be easy to push in with your thumb, but not so easy that it falls out when you cut the patching. If you have to use a ramrod to pound the ball it, then you combination will be too tight.

Be patient. It usually takes me a year of shooting to figure out each new guns quirks and to find the proper load and sight picture.

Many Klatch
 
Pyrodex has a higher flash point, than Black Powder, so it is difficult ot both ignite, and to get it to burn fast enough in the barrel for there NOT TO BE a noticeable Delay in firing, if you get it to ignite. Its sometimes used here with a "black Powder Starter Charge" of 10-20 grains of FFFg black powder. But, you have to use enough black powder to fill the breech up to where the vent hole is, and you must use Black Powder( 3Fg or 4Fg) for priming the pan of a flintlock to get good ignition. 2Fg will also work as priming powder, but its a little slower igniting, and some people claim they can " hear " the difference.

Usually the reason people Don't use Black Powder id because its not readily available. If its not available for your main charge, it won't be available for priming or starter charges either. IF you can get Black Powder( Swiss, KIK, Wano are made in Europe, Goex is here in Louisianna), then save the Pyrodex for use in Percussion guns. It was designed to be used in percussion guns. :grin: :hmm: :hatsoff:
 
thanks for that my.69 is percussion and i love it pride of place in the cabinet
 
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