Ram Rod hole

[JIMHAY97]

I'm at the point where I have to think about drilling the ram rod hole. There was a post awhile back asking if anyone had any experience with TOTW's drill. I can't find any responses so I'll ask again. The drill is 48" long and has a special point ground on it. Looks to me like it ought to work just fine but with the cost of the drill and shipping I'd like to hear a report first.

I've had this project since 1979. I've got the lock, barrel and triggers installed. Could'nt wait any longer so I took it out and shot it this past weekend. Believe it or not but it fired the first time. Of course I then had a bunch of fizzles. Oh well, it was fun. Even with no sights and a stock that is still basically a 2X4 with a barrel. Kind of looks like a Flintstone Flintlock.

 

[zampilot]

Been thinking about bringing my TOtW Edward Marshall kit build up to them to have the ramrod hole drilled to the correct depth, it's about a half-inch short! I have all the metal on, only have to shape the wood, but that short RR hole bugs me!

 

[necchi]

Zampilot,,They don't do any work there in Elk River, They send their stuff to William in Wakon Bay, then he sends it back then they send it to you,,
Maybe they have changed but I don't think they do any stock work at the home shop.

 

[Birddog6]

William just does the specialty work on barrels, breeches, dovetails, etc. for them. He doesn't do stock work. Last I heard, Bob Lepley was cutting all their stocks.

Just buy a standard metal drill bit and a piece of solid rod or all thread,(Lowes), weld or braze them together, drill the hole yourself using the RR pipes as a build.
I drill out all precarves 1/32" larger before I build them, there's nothing to it.
Just lay the bit up over the rifle & to the depth you want, insure it is not going to hit the triggerguard lug & etc. & that you can go 1/2" deeper or whatever.
Put the long drill bit in the rifle til it stops, take some electrical tape & go around the drill bit 1/2" or what you desire to drill, past the nosecap, drill til the tape hits the nosecap.
Normally you can get 1/2 to 3/4" more in one, just depends on the rifle.

 

[Onojutta]

Just buy a standard metal drill bit and a piece of solid rod or all thread,(Lowes), weld or braze them together, drill the hole yourself using the RR pipes as a build.

That sounds a lot easier said than done.

Jim Hay, I just ordered one of those drills from TOTW and if it wasn't for this blizzard it would have been here already. I'm 99% done with my ramrod channel so it won't be long before I'm ready to use it. I'll post a report when I'm done. I look at it this way... The drilling the ramrod hole seems to be the single most critical step in the building process that causes the most worry and trouble. After spending countless hours inletting a swamped barrel and gouging the ramrod channel all by hand, I know the anxiety of drilling the hole better than anyone. For a little less than $40 shipped, the drill is a no-brainer to me if it allows me to do the job properly. Just imagine screwing up the hole and then wishing you could do it over again for $40. I bet you'd spend that money in a heart beat. That's a small price to pay for a little confidence after all the hours of my life I have invested into this build. I know a lot of guys make their own drill like Bird Dog explained and if you feel that you could do that, go for it. Heck I wish I could have done that. But I don't know the first thing about brazing and don't have any welding equipment in my shop. Also, I think there is something to be said as to the type of bit that is used. It's really hard to find quality drill bits at any hardware store anymore, so I don't know that I trust any old bit that I brazed to the end of a metal rod. I'm hoping that this bit design from Track is proven and on purpose, and that it will do the job properly. Stay tuned.

 

There is noting to welding a drill bit to a rod to make it the length you need.
Lay the rod in a section of angle iron longer than the bit and rod to be attched to is in lenght.
This will keep it aligned in straightness when you weld it to the rod.
As with drilling any hole in the required depth required, drill slow and back it out to rid the drilled wood from cloging and sticking the bit in the wood. Take you time and drill slow and steady keeping it plumb and level to the hole you want to drill.
I am no professional gun builder but can make a $25 drill for under $8
If you know someone who can weld it for you all the better if you aren't a welder. Most will do it for a beer next time you see them. :wink:

 

[zampilot]

I realize that Necchi, but I don't think I'll jump through hoops to get what should have been QC'd before I paid for it. Nor will I spend more money on a bit, rod and welding. I'll buy elsewhere next time. I wonder how many others have gone out the door in this condition?

 

[Birddog6]

Was it not a precarve ? for YOU to build from ? Or is this a finished rifle ?

Receiving a stock with the RR hole 1/2" short sounds perfectly normal to me & something I wouldn't even think twice about. After you have built allot of rifles, you just drill it & don't give it a second thought. :idunno:

It is the Second thing I do when I get a precarved stock, drill out the RR hole 1/32" over the std size, and usually 1/2 to 1" deeper.
Why they don't auto. drill them all 1/32" oversize, I have no idea.......... :idunno: How may RR's do you make that are Straight & True ? I think of the last ? 25 I made I had one perfectly straight RR, and I had to bow the dang thing to make it stay in place !

 

[paulvallandigham]

YOu might give Pecatonica River a phone call ( get that information from the LINKS section at the top of the Index page to this forum) and talk to Dick Greensides about that drill bit. Ask him what his men use. He does a lot of the pre-carves that are sold by TOTW, so he is the guy to ask about the bit. You might also ask him what it would cost to have his people drill that RR hole for you. It might be the cheapest way for you to go.

 

[Vaino]

When I made my first RR drill, I brazed the 3/8" dia. drill to a length of 3/8" dia. drill rod and then thought of the "drill point" that would wander the least. Finally settled on a flat bottom sharpened drill and proceded to drill the hole and it came out as perfect as one could hope for. Minimum deflection because the flat bottom isn't skewed by hard and soft areas and cuts quite independenly...something akin to an endmill. A couple of years later I visited Fred Miller and looked at his RR drills and they all had a flat bottom and I've drilled a few more RR holes {3/8" & 5/16"} using FB drills and they all came out quite satisfactory. When enlarging an existing RR hole, I'd use an angled drill point so the drill follows the existing hole. These drills are necessary for pre-drilled RR holes to achieve maximum RR length....Good luck.....Fred

 

[rkmeyer]

I think they use a brad point bit which should not follow the grain.
At least that is the claim. And sloooow is the only way to go, otherwise you might be putting a nice brass plate under the forend. :cursing: :cursing:
Dusty :wink:

 

[Herb]

You can go to Ace Hardware or Lowes and get a 3/8" x 48" steel rod. I use a drill 1/32" oversize also, 13/32" for a 3/8" hole. I used just a regular steel drill, maybe a brad point would be better, I don't know. Since I can't weld, I cut about 2" off the drill shank (it is not hardened) to a center flat, that is by cutting about 1/3 off the drill sides to the center. Then with a hacksaw I cut a matching groove in the end of the rod. Put the drill tenon in the end of the rod. You can align them by laying them in a piece of angle iron. I solder them together. Next I drill two holes through the rod and drill tenon and pin them together. This works even for drilling holes in blanks. When I do halfstock Hawkens, I use a 36" 7/16" rod and a 15/32" bit. I open up the rod pipes with a round chain saw file or rattail file so that the 3/8" rod tip, or a 7/16" one, will go through the pipes and entry pipe. I use beeswax for a drill lube.

 

[zampilot]

Herb,
Silver solder or 1200 degree hi-temp solder?

 

[Twoholes]

Last gun I built I bought a steel rod at a farm supply, heated it then beat the end to a teardrop shape, ground the edges sharp. Used wood blocks to clamp it in the ramrod grove, used a brace, went slow, and it drilled the hole perfectly.

 

[LRB]

To go just a half an inch, you can put a shallow point on a steel rod of the proper size, then file the diameter half way down for the width of the file. Cheap, relatively easy. Cuts very well. This is the type of drill Brownells sells for drilling sling swivel holes.

 

[Dphar]

I'm at the point where I have to think about drilling the ram rod hole. There was a post awhile back asking if anyone had any experience with TOTW's drill. I can't find any responses so I'll ask again. The drill is 48" long and has a special point ground on it. Looks to me like it ought to work just fine but with the cost of the drill and shipping I'd like to hear a report first.

I've had this project since 1979. I've got the lock, barrel and triggers installed. Could'nt wait any longer so I took it out and shot it this past weekend. Believe it or not but it fired the first time. Of course I then had a bunch of fizzles. Oh well, it was fun. Even with no sights and a stock that is still basically a 2X4 with a barrel. Kind of looks like a Flintstone Flintlock.

I have yet to use anything that would run as straight as the gun drill type does. If AIMED right they will run within 1/32 or less of center.
Nothing else I ever used will reliably do this.

I make my own and won't use anything else.

I have never seen a twist bit of any kind that ran straight everytime.

Dan

 

[JIMHAY97]

Thanks Dan. That looks similar to what TOTW sells. Before I retired from Boeing we had a gun drill in the machine shop I worked in. The drills looked like what you have there except they had a oil hole going the entire length that fed high pressure oil to the point to cool and also force the chips out.

Jim

 

[Dphar]

Thanks Dan. That looks similar to what TOTW sells. Before I retired from Boeing we had a gun drill in the machine shop I worked in. The drills looked like what you have there except they had a oil hole going the entire length that fed high pressure oil to the point to cool and also force the chips out.

Jim

Yes this is the gun drill type. If I put a longer flute in it I could probably drill more than 1/2" at a time.
The typical gun drill for barrels has a full length groove pressed in a tube with the grooved and oil holed carbide bit brazed to one end and whatever is needed for the gun drill on the other.

Dan

 

[Capt. Fred]

Dan, if you've got another pic or two of that bit would you mind posting them? I can't quite figure out the tip on that thing. Thanks.

 

[Herb]

Brownells silver solder, low temp.