Rehardening my frizzen

[M. De Land]

The emery cross hatching is to remove the coating of what ever is on there and provide some texture for the flint edge to grip.

 

[toot]

the PITINA should have been scraped off years ago, through use and wear. just look at the patina / wear in and on the pan. I think that the frizzen was missing at a point and period in time and replaced, other wise it would have the same wear / condition as the pan. jmho.

 

[rich pierce]

I asked before, but have you determined it is truly hard by testing it with a fine file?

“it doesn’t spark” is a starting point not a diagnosis of a soft frizzen. Test it for hardness.

 

[jerrywh]

That flint looks more like a marble. Buy a decent flint'

 

[SDSmlf]

Frizzen in photographs appears to be fresh out of some sort heat treating process with black oxide on its surface. That is not patina in my opinion. May or may not be hard. As Rich has suggested, it needs to checked for hardness. And even if hard, it’s unlikely to spark with flint shown, as others have pointed out. By chance, is the sharp flint you referred to different than the one in the photographs?

 

[M. De Land]

I think you first need to see if it will spark. The coating will have to be removed to check that effectively and the flint will need touched up or changed. You can see that on a normally sparking frizzen by adding a bit of body oil to the edge. Hardeness checked wth a file is very arbitrary, I do it routinely to get an approximation of hardness on various steels but sparks can be generated from a wide range of hardness levels. You need to find out what you have before altering anything!

 

[TBone]

You can not tell by the surface texture and feel if the frrizzen is hard enough. If you have an automatic set push, punch the frizzed face. If it sets a deep mark, it is too soft. A sharp metal scribe can be used as well. The frizzen should skip the scribe off. If the scribe bites, again, the frizzen is soft.

 

[rich pierce]

This is one of those situations where the original poster either has all the info needed or has checked out. Either way I think we’re talking to ourselves now.

 

[SDSmlf]

This is one of those situations where the original poster either has all the info needed or has checked out. Either way I think we’re talking to ourselves now.

For what it is worth, even if we are talking to ourselves, enjoy your to the point posts.

Just checked, and original poster last logged in Wednesday afternoon. With all the panic going on in the world, maybe they have other priorities right now. Or the issue has been resolved.

 

[FlinterNick]

If that’s a 3rd model Bess, you might want to consider just getting a new cast frizzen. Most today are made of 5100 or 6100 high carbon steel by various suppliers. An antique frizzen to be rehardened could crack.

 

[Erwan]

An antique frizzen to be rehardened could crack.

Can't put a sole on?

 

[FlinterNick]

Can't put a sole on?

I think you first need to see if it will spark. The coating will have to be removed to check that effectively and the flint will need touched up or changed. You can see that on a normally sparking frizzen by adding a bit of body oil to the edge. Hardeness checked wth a file is very arbitrary, I do it routinely to get an approximation of hardness on various steels but sparks can be generated from a wide range of hardness levels. You need to find out what you have before altering anything!

Its also 250 year old steel likely. Original frizzen s were made of lesser quality alloys than the ones that are casted today. I would just replace it with a copy in 6150 steel, easier to harden and maintain too.

 

[toot]

it does no harm to add information to an already existing site some timed one get a helpful li'll ever so much of some thing that is not known to a new NIMROD? just maybe. besides what else is there to do in self quarantine?

 

[FlinterNick]

Can't put a sole on?

Not really worth it on a Bess, there’s so many available casted copies that work. Why waste the cost ?

I would do that for a frizzen that is less common, like an early English Infantry Musket (1650-1700 circa), those locks were pretty large and the frizzen covers were wider and longer.

 

[rich pierce]

I just pack hardened 3 frizzens today. Wrapped in leather wired tight with mild wire. Stuffed into a steel tube with a good lid, packed with real charcoal. Made a big hardwood fire and covered it with coals for 2 hours. I kept the coals bright with (gulp, blush) a hair dryer propped up. Quenched in a 5 gallon bucket of water. Hard as glass. The (formerly) mild wire snapped when I tried to unbend it. Good diagnostic.

 

[Carbon 6]

Would this process work for doing a frizzen ?

 

[rich pierce]

Yes

 

[BEP]

The last time the fellow posted who started this thread was over three weeks ago. He must have found a solution. I always find it both interesting and beneficial how, long after this happens, some threads take on a life of their own. There's always lots to learn here.

 

[FlinterNick]

Easiest way to reharden a frizzen is with a MAPP torch, heat to cherry red, surface hardening is optional, and then quench in Oil ( i use salt water), the hard part is tempering the base of the frizzen. I only reharden my frizzens if the flint is taking off too much causing a gash. Most of the time a weaker sparking lock is due to a bad flint. A neat trick is to quench in melted / dissolved solutions of part water and part potassium nitrates, it produces some nice case hardening colors.

 

[FlinterNick]

The last time the fellow posted who started this thread was over three weeks ago. He must have found a solution. I always find it both interesting and beneficial how, long after this happens, some threads take on a life of their own. There's always lots to learn here.

There’s more than one way to harden a frizzen, I generally just hit with a propane torch and dip it in Track’s Surface Hardening Compound, their instructions says to quench in water, I’ve tried both water and oil, the water works better with a propane torch, oil works better with an acetylene torch. Getting the frizzen too hot (where it is non magnetic, 1800-2000 F, bright orange to yellow glow) could cause cracks. Propane torches tend to only get steel up to 1300-1500 hot.