Replica 1861 Springfield worth?

[Rick the Librarian]

Hello, everyone --

I have a replica 1861 Springfield musket I bought about 30 years ago. It was sold by Navy arms and has a "Made in Japan" stamp (in small letters). It is still in good condition, having almost all the brightwork, although a little tarnished in a few small places. It also has a replica bayonet (no scabbard).

I have my eye on a Trapdoor Springfirld and I would like to determine a fair price. I try to steer between taking someone and getting taken. Any opinions would be appreciated.

If any of you participate on military rifle forums, you may recognize me as "Rick the Librarian" in those places. I know a lot about 1903s, Krags, M1s, etc. but very little about BP.

Thanks in advance for any ideas. I can post some pictures, if that would help.

 

[n8dawg6]

rick, those 1861 springfields were imported from japan and sold by dixie gun works. they are good quality rifles. if the rifle is unfired or in hardly-used condition with no corrosion in the bore, you'll be able to get a pretty good price for it. im not going to say anything specific, though, because im not sure exactly what it is worth. i guarantee you that if you go over to the north/south skirmish association bulletin board,[url] n-ssa.org[/url], there will be someone there who can give you a pretty exact price. in fact, that would be a great place to sell it as well. :grin:

 

[Rick the Librarian]

Thanks for the link - you have a nice website here! Wish I was here for the "long haul" but I have more of an interest in 1900-1945 weapons.

Thanks again!

RtL

 

[wetpowder]

You didn't say if it was a 2band or a 3band. The 2band would bring a little more.

 

You didn't say if it was a 2band or a 3band. The 2band would bring a little more.

well, I am going to demonstrate my ignorance about repro Springfields, but why would the 2 band be worth more? The NSSA requires 3 band rifles for most events, so the 2 band would not be of as much use I would think--and thus not as desirable as a 3 band. I wouldn't think that the guns would be paricularly "collectable", just of value to reenactors/shooters.

 

[Okwaho]

You didn't say if it was a 2band or a 3band. The 2band would bring a little more.

well, I am going to demonstrate my ignorance about repro Springfields, but why would the 2 band be worth more? The NSSA requires 3 band rifles for most events, so the 2 band would not be of as much use I would think--and thus not as desirable as a 3 band. I wouldn't think that the guns would be paricularly "collectable", just of value to reenactors/shooters.

Mike,you're not showing any ignorance here.The so called two band artillery model 1861 Springfield musket has been the source of considerable controversy.It would be well to see Fayderman on this subject{8th Ed. P. 466}as to the authenticity of such a gun.The 1889 Bannerman catalogue offered a reworked musket described as: "U.S. Springfield Cadet M.L. Rifle ...same as the model 1862 rifle except has been lightened by having barrel shortened to 30",stock reduced in length and thickness and thin .45 caliber lock-plate substituted for the heavy .58 caliber lock-plate...metal reblued...the neatest and safest M.L.Cadet gun made."

Flayderman also comments: " Not a few traders have been known to pass off such mongrels as rare variations or Confederate alterations to thr uninformed novice or the gullible collector".

I think the writer woul do well to follow the advice given him as to the value and where to go to obtain such advice.This is an 1861 Springfield replica and probably has a fairly decent value especially to a reenactor.
Tom Patton

 

[n8dawg6]

actually, from my experience, at least half of the folks shoot two-band rifles in the n-ssa rifled musket matches. that includes me, i shoot a 2-band enfield, 1858 pattern. historically, though, infantry that used enfields or springfields used exclusively the 3-band models (the theory being that you needed the extra bayonet reach, or a longer club when out of ammo, among other things). 2-band rifles were rare and were pretty much used by cavalry (although some infantry units were armed with rifles like the 1841 mississippi and the austrian lorenz, which had shorter, rifle-length barrels).

for n-ssa competition, the 3-bands give you a little more sight radius, and are preferred by some for that reason. but for smaller folks (such as myself) they're just a little too unwieldly and have too much weight out front.

there is a difference between the two-band rifle and the two-band carbine. carbines have to be used in the separate carbine matches. carbines include, for instance, j.p. murray carbines and enfield musketoons (some breechloaders, too). barrel lengths typically run 25" and less

my two-band enfield has a 33" barrel (compared to 39" barrel on the three-band). my j.p. murray carbine has a 24" barrel.

sprinfields are similar to the enfields. a reproduction two-band springfield rifle (or "richmond" rifle) will have about a 33" barrel and the three-bander will have a 40" barrel.

whew! :grin:

 

[Zonie]

Rick: Of course you aren't offering that here because you know that posts offering to sell things on this Forum are not permitted.

That said, the Third Ed "Blue Bookof Modern Black Powder Values" says the 1861 Springfield replicas from Navy Arms (country of mfg not given) are 3 band rifles and are worth between $370 (95%) and $475 (98%).
The Dixie 1861 Springfield replica is also a 3 band rifle made by Miroku Japan and Euro Arms.
It's value is $340 (95%) and $430 (98%).

This 3rd Ed was printed in 2003, but the prices on BP guns doesn't change much so they are probably still fair prices today.

BTW, speaking as someone who owns a modern replica and an original 1884 Trap Door I can honestly say they aren't as much fun to shoot as a real muzzleloader. Maybe instead of selling your 1861, you ought to buy some .570 dia balls, some .015-,018 patching a little BP and go poke some big holes in things? It's a hell of a lot more fun. :grin:

zonie

 

[wetpowder]

N-SSA requires no such thing. :hmm: Where did you hear that. :shocked2: I was a member of the Old Dominion Drgoons for 8 years. Never heard that. They shoot 3 banders because they like them. :thumbsup:

 

[wetpowder]

I have an original 1873 Trap Door. It's a blast to shoot. :grin: :grin:

 

[wetpowder]

Some of the Jap ones had a 2-piece stock, a lot of shooters didn't like. And didn't want to shell out another $150 for another stock.