Rice barrel breaches.

[Professor flintlock]

Anybody had any erosion problems just forward of the breach? Talked to three other shooters and they all have had problems.

 

[Flintandsteel]

I’ve used at least a dozen Rice barrels. They are smooth, and ready to go from the start. Never seen an erosion problem. Maybe better cleaning?

 

[SDSmlf]

Anybody had any erosion problems just forward of the breach? Talked to three other shooters and they all have had problems.

Was the breech plug properly seated on two surfaces, the bottom of the threads on the plug, and the end of the barrel, before you began using the barrel?

 

[Professor flintlock]

Was the breech plug properly seated on two surfaces, the bottom of the threads on the plug, and the end of the barrel, before you began using the barrel?

The problem is an erosion ring forms in front of the powder. These guys aren't beginners . They know how to clean a rifle. We believe it's the steel the barrel is made from. It's an erosion problem. These barrels have seen many rounds put through them. Still the barrel should not be eroding.All three had contacted rice and we're basically told to pound sand.

 

[SDSmlf]

The problem is an erosion ring forms in front of the powder. These guys aren't beginners . They know how to clean a rifle. We believe it's the steel the barrel is made from. It's an erosion problem. These barrels have seen many rounds put through them. Still the barrel should not be eroding.All three had contacted rice and we're basically told to pound sand.

As an esteemed Professor, I know you have photographic evidence showing this erosion condition. For some reason I can not see any of your photographs. Please repost photographs showing erosion rings in front of the powder for all to see.

And again, was the breech plug properly seated on two surfaces, the bottom of the threads on the plug, and the end of the barrel, before you began using the barrel?

 

[rich pierce]

Rice uses the same steel as many other muzzleloaders barrel makers, past and present. Such barrels are good for 20,000 rounds or so in the hands of target shooters before any loss of accuracy occurs.

 

[Robby]

Never heard of that in any muzzleloader barrel. Me thinks something else is going on.
Robby
Oh yeah, out of the many many Rice barrels I have used, I have had only one issue and that was I suspect in the steel itself. They made it right without any problem.
R

 

[Don Steele]

In an honest effort to respond to the inquiry I have to ask for more information. If the issue is forward of the powder, it’s hard to imagine that the breech has anything to do with it. Additionally, I would ask for more specifics about this “ erosion “. The only issue I’ve ever had in that same area of a muzzleloader barrel wasn’t erosion, but rather the accumulation of what I can only describe as a “ crud ring” that was being caused ( at least in part) by my choosing to experiment with 100% Neatsfoot Oil as a patch lube. Jason Schneider ( Rice Barrels) has an excellent reputation for producing outstanding products. I have to wonder how or why it is that Professor Flintlock happens to know three experienced shooters who have ALL found erosion in their Rice barrels, presumably bought at different times over a span of time, or are these eroded barrels from a single run , produced at the same time and subjected to similar conditions of use ?
Bottom line here is that to answer the initial question, “ erosion “ in Rice barrels doesn’t appear to be an historical problem. To dig into what might be going on with the barrels of all those experienced shooters, we’re gonna need a lot more information.
Just my 2cents and worth what y’all paid for it.

 

[Eric Krewson]

I had some erosion in the breech of a Rice barrel but it was caused entirely by operator error and trusting Rem-oil to protect the bore during the off season.

The barrel does have a tight spot about midway down the bore but I bought it at a steal off eBay so that may be why it went so cheap.

When I ran a patch down the bore after 6 months in the closet and discovered a red potato patch, I went to work on the mess with a green scotch bright pad soaked in soft scrub kitchen cleaner. My thought was clean out the crud or ruin the bore, which ever came first, I could see metal come out on my scrubbing pad.

The barrel never was a good shooter, I was sure I had ruined it until I shot that first group with it. Before the scrubbing it was a 3" group shooter at best with lots of fliers. After the scrubbing it became a 1" shooter at 50 yards and no fliers, the tight spot was almost gone as well.

Here is what is left of the pitting from my crud ring, visible but almost gone. The dark ring is a reflection from the breech plug.

 

[bud in pa]

If I had a problem near the breech plug I would remove the barrel and the breech plug. Looking down from the muzzle at something 3 or more feet away might not reveal the problem. Looking at it from a couple of inches away might reveal a lot more to the eye.

 

[flntlokr]

In my humble experience, the only times I hve encountered a nasty 'ring' just above the load was the very short period when I experimented with various greasy or oil lubes; they all left a ring of rock-hard fouling baked into the barrel just above the load. it took a lot of scrubbing to remove them. I now use water/detergent lube only for general range/match shooting. If your patches are wet, the bore gets wiped for every shot, so you never get much left-0ver. If you notice a bit of stickiness near the bottom when you load, make an extra-wet patch for the next load, and push it slowly through the sticky area, to give the wet time to soften and remove the bit of foul
ing before it builds up. Once the ball is down, you can also swab the barrel above it with no danger of wetting the chamber area.

 

[cannonball1]

The last gun I made was a Hawken with Match Grade Rice barrel. I like to rough my guns in and shoot them before finishing, To many hours go into a gun to have the wood or something else fail. I got to that point, went out to the range and shot it. Very disappointed in the accuracy, so I gave it up. Putting it in the back seat of the truck the FRONT SIGHT FELL OFF. Still don't know how the gun shoots, but the moral of the story is to look at everything you've done first and completely. Rice has a stellar reputation so make sure you have complete proof. Bore sights and camera shots can be had at a reasonable price or even free with the right gunsmith.
Waiting anxiously for that barrel photo of the bore.

 

[Cpt Flint]

I have used about ten of his barrels without one single problem. They are the best out there right now. I use a borescope and have never seen a problem. I bought one at Friendship this month and shall buy another one at Friendship in September.

 

[Cpt Flint]

Methinks someone should learn how to clean his rifle. Cheap powder and not swabbing between shots will put that ring of fouling in the breech. No doubt that it gets worse the more that you neglect it.

 

[Professor flintlock]

In an honest effort to respond to the inquiry I have to ask for more information. If the issue is forward of the powder, it’s hard to imagine that the breech has anything to do with it. Additionally, I would ask for more specifics about this “ erosion “. The only issue I’ve ever had in that same area of a muzzleloader barrel wasn’t erosion, but rather the accumulation of what I can only describe as a “ crud ring” that was being caused ( at least in part) by my choosing to experiment with 100% Neatsfoot Oil as a patch lube. Jason Schneider ( Rice Barrels) has an excellent reputation for producing outstanding products. I have to wonder how or why it is that Professor Flintlock happens to know three experienced shooters who have ALL found erosion in their Rice barrels, presumably bought at different times over a span of time, or are these eroded barrels from a single run , produced at the same time and subjected to similar conditions of use ?
Bottom line here is that to answer the initial question, “ erosion “ in Rice barrels doesn’t appear to be an historical problem. To dig into what might be going on with the barrels of all those experienced shooters, we’re gonna need a lot more information.
Just my 2cents and worth what y’all paid for it.

I'm concerned that I put out alot of money on a project gun.Against better judgement bought a rice(available) barrel rather than waiting on a GM barrel shot them for eons no problem. Have well over 5000 rounds through my.32 probably approaching 10000. Did recrown once. Now back to the issue when running a patch it becomes loose just past where the ball seats. I didn't get to debreach to look from that end of the rifle but you could see a ring at the bottom. The owner of this rifle is a shooter Ben tough competition for years. But If you care to talk to the other individuals we will all be competing this week end at the Ohio State shoot. Canal Fulton clubs been shooting since 1812. If you care to I invite you to come shoot. We have a we b site for directions. Tell Jason Schneider he is invited too. Couple of guys would probably like to talk to him in person. Maybe if you are just a once a month shooter you would never see a problem, but none of us are. When you buy a barrel you expect it to perform and last. This is my two hundred dollars worth, and I paid for it!

 

[rich pierce]

Caliber and load?

 

[NorthFork]

Against my better judgement I'll wade into the alligator pool here. There is nothing wrong with a Rice barrel. If yah all are getting an 'erosion' ring then I suggest it's a cleaning problem, not an erosion problem. For all of 12L14 steel faults (and there are quite a few) erosion from detonation/burning of powder in a typical percussion/flint rifle is not one of them.

 

[Professor flintlock]

As an esteemed Professor, I know you have photographic evidence showing this erosion condition. For some reason I can not see any of your photographs. Please repost photographs showing erosion rings in front of the powder for all to see.

And again, was the breech plug properly seated on two surfaces, the bottom of the threads on the plug, and the end of the barrel, before you began using the barrel?

Hey bub it's not my barrel I have a new rice barrel and just want to know if that's a common problem . If I was rice barrels I think I would have wanted to see these other barrels. Don 't need cleaning advice . Between us we have well over 100 years experience. Poor service seems to get around.

 

[Cpt Flint]

Some years back the NRA had a well known slogan involving gun control. “ IT AIN’T THE GUN STUPID “.

 

[SDSmlf]

Hey bub it's not my barrel I have a new rice barrel and just want to know if that's a common problem . If I was rice barrels I think I would have wanted to see these other barrels. Don 't need cleaning advice . Between us we have well over 100 years experience. Poor service seems to get around.

So you have no photographs to show what you are referring to? Plus what unsolicited cleaning advice are you referring to?

For what it is worth, have a number of Rice barrels that I regularly shoot. Service and responses have been quick and professional when requested. My barrels. No observed or noted erosion. Now I have seen crud rings in multiple manufacturers’ barrels, but erosion has not been a problem in any of them. I don’t shoot as much as some. Probably burn only 30 pounds or so of blackpowder each of the past few years. With my limited number of shots, have found crud ring to be result of load combinations (projectile, powder, charge, lubricants and bore finish for example). Yet to see bore erosion in a blackpowder muzzleloader. Now with my smokeless Milsurp guns I have bore gauges and use a borescope. Bore erosion in those guns is obvious. But not a topic for this forum.