Rolling papers for combustible cartridges?

[Blackpowderart]

I am new to making envelope cartridges
but so far I have been using nitrated coffee filters and stick glue with good results. Recently I was introduced to arabic gum glue which I read some info indicates that colt cartritges were using this type of glue for their operation. Same
Glue used in cigar rolling and some mailing envelopes. Edible and safe.

This is for nitrating basically 100% potassium nitrate. Found at lowes hardware for $9.99....I also got this idea from Eras Gone

These are some cartridges I made with the gum glue

The clamp is for folding the filters over and tracing the outline with a knife. Different "dies" if you will for different grains and bullet shapes

I prefer making cartritges at home in my down time, I find it enjoyable and makes the shooting experience more enjoyable as well as I don't feel I'm loosing any time measuring and pouring. I like the satisfaction I get when I have a couple altoid cans full. That's 40 rounds of .36 in one tin.

 

[andy52]

Anyone who says their Zig-Zag wrappers are for cigarettes is lying...

you're incorrect sir I do in fact roll my own cigarettes.

 

[ab44]

I've seen it suggested to use ol' Zig Zags or other brands of roll-yer-own cigarette (or, uh, other plants) paper to make combustible cartridges for revolvers. Anyone tried this?

Remington .454 balls . Tubes on right are glued to balls the middle ones have powder 28grains and the ones at back are twisted with a dad of glue . A slow bit finicky work but same as weighing and polishing and reloading that others do. i cut end off at range this leaves a bit of raw powder in chamber for percussion cap to ignite. I think they bit the end off in civil war as they kept losing the scissors.

 

[TarponStalker]

Somewhere, I read that cigarette rolling papers were designed to burn, but not burn up too fast. I had to wonder if that would cause them not to be the best paper for cartridges.
I’ve been using coffee filters. I mix up some stump remover with warm water until it is dissolved. I’ll leave the paper filters in the solution for about an hour. Then I’ll lay them out in the sun flat to dry.
I’ve only been doing this for about a year, but so far I have not had any hang fires. However, I have had some situations where the paper jammed at the front end near the forcing cone. But, I think that was due to not trimming the paper to the proper size.
I haven’t mastered cutting the paper to the proper shape and size yet. I need to figure out how to make a template.
But overall, I’m happy with coffee filter papers. They seem to be pretty tough.

 

[ernbar]

Somewhere, I read that cigarette rolling papers were designed to burn, but not burn up too fast. I had to wonder if that would cause them not to be the best paper for cartridges.
I’ve been using coffee filters. I mix up some stump remover with warm water until it is dissolved. I’ll leave the paper filters in the solution for about an hour. Then I’ll lay them out in the sun flat to dry.
I’ve only been doing this for about a year, but so far I have not had any hang fires. However, I have had some situations where the paper jammed at the front end near the forcing cone. But, I think that was due to not trimming the paper to the proper size.
I haven’t mastered cutting the paper to the proper shape and size yet. I need to figure out how to make a template.
But overall, I’m happy with coffee filter papers. They seem to be pretty tough.

I have experienced paper jams only when using the curling and cigarette papers, none with the nitrated coffee filters. Was thinking about the cig paper burn rate which has to be slow to make your smoke last otherwise a cigarette would flash out within a couple of seconds making a paper cartridge burn slower imo.
I soak my filters several at a time (6-8) for a couple of minutes then hung out to dry. The first time I soaked about 30 filters and was difficult getting them apart so I cut down on the number to make it easier to retrieve from the solution.

 

[Old Hawkeye]

Somewhere, I read that cigarette rolling papers were designed to burn, but not burn up too fast. I had to wonder if that would cause them not to be the best paper for cartridges.
I’ve been using coffee filters. I mix up some stump remover with warm water until it is dissolved. I’ll leave the paper filters in the solution for about an hour. Then I’ll lay them out in the sun flat to dry.
I’ve only been doing this for about a year, but so far I have not had any hang fires. However, I have had some situations where the paper jammed at the front end near the forcing cone. But, I think that was due to not trimming the paper to the proper size.
I haven’t mastered cutting the paper to the proper shape and size yet. I need to figure out how to make a template.
But overall, I’m happy with coffee filter papers. They seem to be pretty tough.

I haven't had any combustion issues with the cig papers as long as I use the rice based type, but occasionally some bits of paper are left in the cylinder. The nitrated coffee filter papers are more durable, which I like, but I don't feel the extra step of nitrating them is worth it for just plinking. However, the cig paper ones need to be in a good box to keep them from jostling around as they are more fragile, but the pre-glued edge on the cig papers makes it easier & quicker to roll them. So it's whatever one prefers on how to do it rather than one way being better than the other. They both work! I wonder if brushing some potassium nitrate solution on the cig papers, rather than soaking ( to preserve the glued edge), would be of any benefit as far as eliminating any residual paper left behind. Anybody tried that?

 

[ab44]

I've used RAW brand papers with good results. I have made several dozen paper cartridges so far and I have never had an issue in my 1862 Pocket Police. I have never found that they need to be nitrated.

I use raw brown papers the double size pacvks and I take the whole bunch out at one time fold em and cut them in half ,perfect size for a 454 ball with 28 grains and a twist end. I put a dad of glue on the twist (from a glue stick just rubbed a touch ) this keeps a tight roll before shooting and in my box at range.(they don't spill) I cut the end to open it before I put in cylinder allowing a bit of open black for cap to ignite and boom, BOOM that is. I watch Magnificent Seven on tv and roll and fill, roll and fill and twist lololol in an afternoon taking my time and breaks and before long 200 cartridges. I do nitrate my cartridge after I roll and twist em I very quickly dip them in a potassium nitrate solution really quick two at a time does not take long I let them dry them I dip the ball end in a solution I have for lube (only cover ball) it is a diluted beeswax and lube mix thick (A mix I made with a couple off items )and it coats ball nicely. I just do all this to kill time and have a pleasant afternoon. I let them dry overnight it gets done. The nitrate burns all the paper and no residue as well as adding a nice blast from business end of my Remington.

 

[ab44]

I use raw brown papers the double size pacvks and I take the whole bunch out at one time fold em and cut them in half ,perfect size for a 454 ball with 28 grains and a twist end. I put a dad of glue on the twist (from a glue stick just rubbed a touch ) this keeps a tight roll before shooting and in my box at range.(they don't spill) I cut the end to open it before I put in cylinder allowing a bit of open black for cap to ignite and boom, BOOM that is. I watch Magnificent Seven on tv and roll and fill, roll and fill and twist lololol in an afternoon taking my time and breaks and before long 200 cartridges. I do nitrate my cartridge after I roll and twist em I very quickly dip them in a potassium nitrate solution really quick two at a time does not take long I let them dry them I dip the ball end in a solution I have for lube (only cover ball) it is a diluted beeswax and lube mix thick (A mix I made with a couple off items )and it coats ball nicely. I just do all this to kill time and have a pleasant afternoon. I let them dry overnight it gets done. The nitrate burns all the paper and no residue as well as adding a nice blast from business end of my Remington. Conical is .454 with paper and nitrated balls are on the box with an original .44Rem (shoots ok for 160 years)

 

[rhart]

I've made quite a few paper cartridges using the RAW Classic rolling papers.

View attachment 204350

Not going to lie, its very time consuming but vastly speeds up time at the range. Last weekend while it was pouring rain I made up a box of 50 and then dipped the ball end in a mix of tallow & bees wax, then shot them the next weekend. They worked great! I only had one hang fire, and it was right near the end of the box. I had some occasional trouble with cylinder binding on paper fragments.

Something to note: I shot about ~100 rounds on that range trip with no cleaning. The first 50 were paper, the second ~50 were hand loaded with loose powder, round ball, and topped with bore butter. When cleaning later, I discovered there was still some paper left in a couple of the cylinders, even after the second 50 rounds! It caused no issues, but I was very surprised it survived.



This matches my experience as well. I'd like to give the nitrated coffee filter paper a try, I was curious what process you used? I found this video, this process looks fairly straightforward.



Always looking to improve my processes!

I wonder if using 90% rubbing alcohol would speed absorption/drying?

 

[jefair1]

I used Zigzag papers for my 63 Sharps. Back in the day when I was skirmishing, we stopped at a gas station and bought about 20 packs of paper. The kid working the counter asked where the party was.

 

[ab44]

I use raw brown papers the double size pacvks and I take the whole bunch out at one time fold em and cut them in half ,perfect size for a 454 ball with 28 grains and a twist end. I put a dad of glue on the twist (from a glue stick just rubbed a touch ) this keeps a tight roll before shooting and in my box at range.(they don't spill) I cut the end to open it before I put in cylinder allowing a bit of open black for cap to ignite and boom, BOOM that is. I watch Magnificent Seven on tv and roll and fill, roll and fill and twist lololol in an afternoon taking my time and breaks and before long 200 cartridges. I do nitrate my cartridge after I roll and twist em I very quickly dip them in a potassium nitrate solution really quick two at a time does not take long I let them dry them I dip the ball end in a solution I have for lube (only cover ball) it is a diluted beeswax and lube mix thick (A mix I made with a couple off items )and it coats ball nicely. I just do all this to kill time and have a pleasant afternoon. I let them dry overnight it gets done. The nitrate burns all the paper and no residue as well as adding a nice blast from business end of my Remington. Conical is .454 with paper and nitrated balls are on the box with an original .44Rem (shoots ok for 160 years)

Here are shots of me dipping a twisted cartridge in my bottle of potassium nitrate .( Use a super saturated solution for best results) I use RAW cig papers double size which I cut in half perfect for cartridge. Last shot is it left to dry. I think I explained my way of doing it and they work really well on range. I can hold two at a time when I do it and watch Magnificent Seven on tv, Just take your time look at all the steps a reloader goes through same thing. I look at you other guys shots of cartridges boy!!! some of you are really NEAT lolol. My work station is just a styrofoam box with dents for the balls and a cup of coffee and you are good to go.

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Ive not seen any reason to nitrate the RAW papers, they burn up good.
I bought Dustin's Kit also.
The RAW papers are 7 bucks for 6 packs on Amazon. I have a few years worth.

 

[rhart]

I made my first paper cartridges using coffee filters (non-nitrated) and had issues with paper clogging up around the forcing cone. Next I tried cig rolling papers (much faster since they are already glued and I twisted the ends instead of making separate bases to glue on) and same issue with clogging around forcing cone. Also, both methods left paper in the cylinders when cleaning later. No issues with ignition with either method, but cig paper is definitely more fragile. I may try nitrating some coffee filter paper since I already have the stump remover, coffee filters, water, and clothes line to see if it cuts down on jamming the works since the cartridges sure speed things up at the range.

 

[ab44]

use thin cig papers they burn up and I nitrate them

 

[vlntn]

I've seen it suggested to use ol' Zig Zags or other brands of roll-yer-own cigarette (or, uh, other plants) paper to make combustible cartridges for revolvers. Anyone tried this?

I haven't yet, but
dualist1954 has some videos on YouTube for that but I think he treats them with something... He has a lot of good videos about black powder shooting,

 

[ab44]

Nitrating cartridges other shot finishing are being loaded with 44 Rem.

 

[Some_Mook]

I need to figure out how to make a template.

If you don't mind waiting a bit for the items, Mesa Winds sells 3D printed templates for .36 and .44 (and others). Not real expensive but be willing to wait.
Forth Armory sells some nice heavy stainless steel templates for a number of different cartridges, don't know if he sells cap and ball templates. Good stuff but pricy.

Or, if you do an internet search you can find template dimensions and make your own. It's not hard.

 

[russellshaffer]

Be careful with the Spectricide stump remover. I believe that the formula has changed to a chemical mix. I made some powder with a new Spectricide can and it wouldn't burn at all. I test each batch in a small pile and light it with a butane lighter. That batch wouldn't light with a propane torch and I heated it untill the sulfur melted out in little balls. Potassium nitrate can be had from ebay and amazon for a good price and works great.

 

[Billywfe]

I've been using cigarette papers for a couple of years with no problems of residue. Living in Florida I've started spraying my paper cartridge with clear nitrocellulose lacquer. I form the cartridges, put them on a rack I made with screws, spray them twice letting dry between coats. Then load my powder and bullet. MKes them tougher and moisture resistant, burn completely.

 

[Drain_Bamage]

Interesting! I've heard of folks using thinned out nitrocellulose glue, like Duco Cement, to seal up combustible cartridges but it sounded fiddly enough that I hadn't tried it. Any specific nitrocellulose lacquer you'd recommend? Maybe I'll give that go with my RAW papers. Thanks for sharing that tip @Billywfe !