Rust stopping oil

[Carbon 6]

So the bottom line is, do you want these gasses to eat steel?

I guess the question then is, what gasses are produced under pressure, and what is the depth of penetration ?

 

[cal.43]

i shot an old Mavi Flintlock Hawken ( over 30 Years old) and since years, I clean it with three to four patches soaked with my patchlube (oliveoil/water/a drop of soap/) to remove the biggest foulings, then a dry patch and after that a patch with good maintenance oil , then more oil and that´s it.
The rifle is really oily after that but this works for me and I will never mess again with hot soap water, degreaser, using aceton to remove water and oil after that.

 

[Kenneth Springs]

For my ML that are in monthly rotation, off- hand Schuetzen, Pedersoli Flintlock, and Tradition's Trapper pistol, I finish off my cleaning with a Bore Butter saturated mop. Bend the tip over so you don't scratch anything.

 

[Kenneth Springs]

I guess the question then is, what gasses are produced under pressure, and what is the depth of penetration ?

It's really a ratio of pressure/time (explosion) to atmospheric/time. Not long, but residual gas can corrode. The Bore Butter mop works for me, I have a couple of rifles (Bench, Chunk) that are only really shot 3-4 days and then stored away for close to a year, I always dry patch and they are clean.

 

[Eddie2002]

I start with a few passes with a brush and a few drops of dish washing soap to loosen any crud. Then submerge the breach end in a bucket of water and pump with patches till they come out clean. For rust protection I spray a lot of WD40 down the barrel and follow up with two or more patches to pick up any moisture displaced. For final storage I run a patch down the bore that's been soaked with either Rem oil or regular motor oil. I'll run a dry patch down the bore to clean it before the next shoot. Nipples and clean out screws get a coat of anti seize on the threads during final assembly. I also check the bore by running a clean patch down it after the gun has been sitting for about a week and then re-oil the bore.
I use the brush first because some of my rifles don't have pristine bores and the brush really helps getting them clean.

 

[sawyer04]

Done away with hot water years ago

I can't help but wonder where the hot water system developed. In my life time I have used the hot water method maybe 10 times because the weapon I was to repair was so abused and dirty; and even then I sometimes wished I had avoided it.
I have seen pristine weapons that was cleaned with water and oiled rodded before loading and signs of flash rust on the swab. I am not saying everyone but at least 80%.
I swab, swab with olive oil until satisfied, disassemble once a year and use chassis grease on works and springs. On the stock I use boiled linseed oil cut with mineral spirits.
I am by far, no expert.

 

[Walkingeagle]

I am by far, no expert.

Maybe not, but you do what works for you. That is the key.
Walk

 

[Juice Jaws]

I can't help but wonder where the hot water system developed. In my life time I have used the hot water method maybe 10 times because the weapon I was to repair was so abused and dirty; and even then I sometimes wished I had avoided it.
I have seen pristine weapons that was cleaned with water and oiled rodded before loading and signs of flash rust on the swab. I am not saying everyone but at least 80%.
I swab, swab with olive oil until satisfied, disassemble once a year and use chassis grease on works and springs. On the stock I use boiled linseed oil cut with mineral spirits.
I am by far, no expert.

I think using water has been around for ever, most of my shooting buddies use it. Its how I was taught back in the 70's, its not wrong like everything else in this sport use what works for you.

 

[Kansas Jake]

As the old saying goes, it seems there are many ways to "skin the cat."

 

[renegadehunter]

I can't help but wonder where the hot water system developed. In my life time I have used the hot water method maybe 10 times because the weapon I was to repair was so abused and dirty; and even then I sometimes wished I had avoided it.
I have seen pristine weapons that was cleaned with water and oiled rodded before loading and signs of flash rust on the swab. I am not saying everyone but at least 80%.
I swab, swab with olive oil until satisfied, disassemble once a year and use chassis grease on works and springs. On the stock I use boiled linseed oil cut with mineral spirits.
I am by far, no expert.

Pure speculation, but I wonder if boiling hot water came from the bore butter craze?
My rifle was my dad's and he used bore butter exclusively. When I got the rifle after he passed the bore was choke full of BB for storage. I used it as a patch lube and for bore protection when I first started too, and found that hot water did a much better job of getting the charred BB out during cleaning. After cleaning in a bucket of soapy water I would run a patch of Hoppes BP solvent on a patch down the bore and then a dry patch, over and over, until I got clean patches. When I used just tepid or cold water I got dirty patches for a lot longer than I did if I had used hot water. Then a week later when checking the bore I would pull more stuff out of the barrel, I assume from the oil I used for storage breaking down some more of the cooked BB.
After going away from BB completely it still took a while before I got all of the hardened BB out of the barrel, but now I can just use tepid water and straight to dry patches. Other than maybe the very first one they come out clean.
Hot water worked much better for me when I was using BB.

 

[Carbon 6]

I have seen pristine weapons that was cleaned with water and oiled rodded before loading and signs of flash rust on the swab. I am not saying everyone but at least 80%.

Water gives some people fits, others have no problem. I often wonder if it isn't the water itself that is the difference. There is obviously some variable at play.

 

[sawyer04]

Water gives some people fits, others have no problem. I often wonder if it isn't the water itself that is the difference. There is obviously some variable at play.

Carbon 6, I think you are on to something, it is not uncommon to find water without a lime or sulfur content around here; of course the metropolitan areas are treated with what I would call corrosive chemicals.

 

[Carbon 6]

Carbon 6, I think you are on to something, it is not uncommon to find water without a lime or sulfur content around here; of course the metropolitan areas are treated with what I would call corrosive chemicals.

Some water is extremely high in iron too, maybe the flash rust is just a toilt bowl ring. Municipal water can contains things like sodium chloride, potassium chloride, citric acid ,chlorine dioxide and phosphoric acid to name a few. All are corrosive to steel.

 

[Bouncer1947]

I have tried several methods as recommended by people on this board. In the end I am back to my simple regime used for near 25 years.
Quite simply I throw a squirt of dish soap into a bucket (whatever is at the sink), add lukewarm tap water. Remove barrel from stock and nipple from breech, immerse breech end in bucket to soak. Remove lock from stock, dip into the bucket and scrub fully with toothbrush. Dry with paper towel and set aside. Damp a paper towel and wipe lock area of stock from powder fouling. Take a patch and soak in bucket, place over barrel muzzle and slowly run it down barrel with ramrod and cleaning jag. Pump soapy bucket water in/out of barrel several times, replacing dirty wet patch a few times until patch is clean. Remove barrel from bucket and use toothbrush to scrub area around nipple and breech. Wipe all down with paper towel. Run dry patches down barrel until dry. Use only pure olive oil to lube inside barrel, as well as wiping over barrel externals and lock, ensuring well covered. Reassemble everything.
I never had any issues using this method for years, then started to listen to others on this board and tried “better” methods, only to start having issues. I am now back to my old tried and true, all issues gone.
Walk

Agree with you, been using this method since the late 70's..it's never failed me

 

[user 34300]

I can't help but wonder where the hot water system developed.
I am by far, no expert.

Maybe "The Muzzleloading Caplock Rifle" by Ned Roberts? It is an old foundational book from the beginning of the modern hobby. Roberts promoted the idea.

I have had no issues with hot water. I may depend on the local humidity? I live in a low humidity temperate area. I find that the hot barrel dries faster and distributes the preservative grease better. I have used LPS-3, Rig, pure lanolin, cosmoline, Baracade, Fluid Film, WD-40, and homemade concoctions over the years. All have worked great. The only one to cause problems was very old 3:1 oil. Apparently they used to include a chemical (acid?) to break up rusty parts, like a door hinge. That caused pitting rust to form or guns.

 

[stevemoede]

I shot my Hawken Tuesday and the next day I had some rust and was upset. I re applied some gun oil to the barrel. Only thing I can figure is there was some water in there yet. I have had a hard time keeping rust out of my new GM Barrel and dont know why. I actually send a patch down the next day and a few days in a row after that just to make sure. I dont know why I get rust, although most times its very little.

 

[Griz44Mag]

Sounds like the oil you are using is not doing it's job. Using compressed air and alcohol wipes\flush before oiling will help a lot also.
I have a small CH compressor under my cleaning bench for just such usage.
Use an oil that has a rust preventative in it. I like Shooters Choice FP10 but there are many others. Check the label.
Your new barrel may also still need some seasoning. It does take a few rounds to get the metal to a stable state.

 

[Howard Pippin]

Has anyone besides me, tried using kerosene for cleaning junk out of the bore? Bought a new traditions rifle not long ago, and the bore didn't have grease but was actually almost red and it appeared to be rust. I cleaned it with kerosene and it appears okay. Left it set for a few days, and tried cleaning it again and the patches came out clean. Except for the Smell, kerosene seems to be a very good cleaner. I know if you leave it set for a long time in a kerosene lamp that it evaporates and leaves a hard film and it takes Alcohol to dissolve it. Anyone else ever tried this for cleaning?
Squint

 

[mlshooter]

In case you have not seen this, here is a good review of various lubricants used with BP rifles and how well they actually prevent corrosion.

https://ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/corrosion/corrosion2.html

 

[Sunbeam]

In case you have not seen this, here is a good review of various lubricants used with BP rifles and how well they actually prevent corrosion.

https://ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/corrosion/corrosion2.html

I'm not sold on that 'test'. I cleaned and dried my barrel well and slopped it in Balistoil, rusted in days. I can't believe Balistoil held back rust for perfectly for 3 months !!!