shooting my fowler/smoothbore while totally ignorant

[D.Summers]

Don't look beyond the evident beauty!!

 

[D.Summers]

The lotus is the jewel!

 

[Britsmoothy]

Looks like the patch got gripped by the ball as it obturated then the patch acted as flights by the ball flipping over.
Or put some bloody powder in it and stop using mouse fart loads!

 

[Brokennock]

Sorry to be so late getting back to your response to my reply.

today was one of those days where even waking up, i did everything wrong.

That's me every single day...

wonder if your 80g ff are close to my 70g of fff ?

Yes, roughly.

That looks like a good start. And might just even be a good load. Try it again. If it repeats that performance, Try it off a bench at 50 yards. If that group stays within 4 inches or so,,,, keep it.
I have had loads that shot amazing groups at 25 yards completely fall apart at 50 yards. Worse, and this is why some of us believe there is a bit of "the dark arts," involved in smoothbore load development,,, I've had loads shoot great one day and barely form a group the next time I go to the range. Such is a smoothbore.

No ideas on the patch staying with the ball that far, I'm figuring something atmospheric and cold related,,, but, I don't shoot a lot of prb. I have found the felt wads from my round ball loads beyond the 25 yards target stands which surprised me.

If you want front and rear sights, put them on, don't let anyone tell you different if it is a gun you will hunt with. You owe it to the animal to be as accurate as possible. It doesn't need to be a big standard rifle rear sight. The brass rear sight I put on my Fusil des Chase is very small, and for enough back to be easily ignored when not using it.
If you can't practice a lot and develop the consistent cheek weld and eye to muzzle relationship needed to shoot well with no rear sight, put one on. This means being able to maintain that relationship when shooting in odd positions while hunting. This also means maintaining that eye to muzzle relationship when clothing needs change. Like someone said, you are more pointing this than aiming it, and like a shotgun, that means if the fit changes so will your point of impact. Ever watch a trap or skeet shooter who was doing really well all summer fall apart when winter comes and they are wearing extra layers,,, and shooting the same gun? Those extra layers changed the relationship of eye and gun.

I do think you have a good start on a load, and a beautiful gun built, please keep us up to date.

 

[Snooterpup]

the one on the right was first shot. i thought i needed to hold low and it put it right at poa.
the upper left is the following two shots.
i don't know thing one about shooting ball from a smooth bore. that is why i figured i was doing it wrong. that and today was one of those days where even waking up, i did everything wrong.
my patch lube is 50/50 bear fat and bees wax.
i will cut some thinner patches and try those. i was really startled finding the patch and patched ball at 75 yards. never have had rifled prb carry a patch beyond about 20 yards max.
i am impressed that it shoots so good at 25 without sights. i may just leave it bald headed. i still need to learn how to shoot it with shot.
shot, tor grouse hunting was my main idea in building it.
View attachment 187314

Beautiful work! Let’s see more photos. Is that the Kibler lock I sold you?

 

[Eterry]

If you can shoot 3 shots touching at 25 yards your not doing anything wrong in my book. How close was it to poa ?

 

[deerstalkert]

Beautiful work! Let’s see more photos. Is that the Kibler lock I sold you?

yes sir it is the kibler! looks like a meteor shower with a good flint!

 

[deerstalkert]

If you can shoot 3 shots touching at 25 yards your not doing anything wrong in my book. How close was it to poa ?

all three shots were within 2 inches of POA. i changed POA between the first one on the right and the other two.
it shows promise. i will just have to sacrifice and doo a bunch more shooting with it

 

[deerstalkert]

Looks like the patch got gripped by the ball as it obturated then the patch acted as flights by the ball flipping over.
Or put some bloody powder in it and stop using mouse fart loads!

what load would you suggest Brit? I am serious about knowing nothing about this smoothbore with ball shooting. my only other smooth bore's are a 1840's 11g and that combo whatever .36 over 20g!
remember, i am a old guy with bad muscle/flesh covering my poor old shoulder bones. not recoil shy at all but have suffered after shooting before.
gimme some Rat fart loads!

 

[hanshi]

I highly recommend a rear sight on hunting smoothbores. I have one on mine and it works for both shot and ball. The load you mention is almost the same one that I used to kill deer a few years back. No adjusting the way it's shot while wearing different clothes, light or heavy. Your gun is a beauty, mine is just a farm hand. I use a different lube, TOtW mink oil, but anything from spit to Hoppes BP Lube is worthwhile. Don't fret, you're doing it right.

 

[Britsmoothy]

what load would you suggest Brit? I am serious about knowing nothing about this smoothbore with ball shooting. my only other smooth bore's are a 1840's 11g and that combo whatever .36 over 20g!
remember, i am a old guy with bad muscle/flesh covering my poor old shoulder bones. not recoil shy at all but have suffered after shooting before.
gimme some Rat fart loads!

I'm sorry, I re-read my message and it , with hind sight, sounds quite rude!
Forgive me please.

Carry on friend but do try a bare ball on thin cards or some tow.

 

[deerstalkert]

I'm sorry, I re-read my message and it , with hind sight, sounds quite rude!
Forgive me please.

Carry on friend but do try a bare ball on thin cards or some tow.

I didn't take your post as rude my friend. i was and am sincere about any help with loads and anything else you wish to share.
i am truly clueless of smooth bore use. i needed a project and the rice barrel and the stock were offered so i just made what fit. i still need to do some shooting with shot.
this gun comes so perfect for me it has great potential. say hi to Jess
going out to do more shooting .

 

[Britsmoothy]

If you can get a leather punch about +.040" larger than your bore D.
You can then employ a grandchild to stamp you thin wads from any suitable material you wish to recycle.

Just a few thin wads between powder and shot will suffice with the occasional blob of lube to help keep fouling soft.

Equal powder to shot volume or less. Doubt you will need to go more than 1.5oz.
If you feel confident enough, load 7/8oz on 3/4volume of 4f, I think you'll be impressed.
Have fun.

 

[deerstalkert]

have punch but am short on grand kids! besides i have nothing else to do and actually enjoy punching out small round things from large square things.
i just shot 10 shots with round ball. 5 with .0075 lubed patch and 90g ff. the patches were recovered 10 ft from muzzle. pretty ragged.
then i fired 5 with just bare ball and 90g ff. i am impressed. got to where i couldn't feel my fingers any longer so had to stop.
i fired 10 times and had an equal number or more flash in the pans. need to work on that. Found it likes the prime powder banked against the vent. going to name this gun a female name. fickle Francine.
I may try some hornet nest wad but i think bare ball is what it likes.
somehow i didn't get 2 lower shots in the picture.
the 2 sets of touching holes and the one cutting the pasty were bare ball.

 

[Eterry]

I notice your using FFFg. According to Lymans Black Powder Manual a 70 grs FFFg is equivalent to over 90grs FFg.

There's plenty here that don't agree with their findings, but Lyman spent many hours using chronographs, pounds of powder and lead.

I've been using FFFg for over a decade in 58 calibers and shotguns. I've patterned several shotgun loads with good success. I've had many great loads in my rifle using FFFg.

 

[deerstalkert]

I notice your using FFFg. According to Lymans Black Powder Manual a 70 grs FFFg is equivalent to over 90grs FFg.

There's plenty here that don't agree with their findings, but Lyman spent many hours using chronographs, pounds of powder and lead.

I've been using FFFg for over a decade in 58 calibers and shotguns. I've patterned several shotgun loads with good success. I've had many great loads in my rifle using FFFg.

I should have declared a disclaimer about the powder.
while it is close in granule size to the commercial powders it is unglazed so in reality it is just ff, fff, or ffff. burn rate is slightly different also.
depending on humidity, ignition is also effected.
testing side by side with goex, my powder can be either + 100fps or -100 fps. i don't have the equipment to keep my stuff exact from batch to batch.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Are you pricking the vent my friend?
I do it after loading.

I have noticed in the past the larger granulations can block the vent.

 

[Zutt-man]

Show me more pictures of this gun!

 

[rafterob]

My theory on the patch sticking to the ball is that your lube is too stiff. When I have added bees wax to various tallows I discovered it takes very little wax to firm up the tallow. So 50% is a lot. Also, bees wax has a "sticky" quality to it. I would bet the patch you found just separated from the ball at about the point where you found it.
I don't think you need a thinner patch, a snug fit aids accuracy.

 

[deerstalkert]

Are you pricking the vent my friend?
I do it after loading.

I have noticed in the past the larger granulations can block the vent.

yes sir . i prick after loading too. i was checking things out yesterday and with a 1/16th inch brass rod inserted it shows i drilled the vent on a forward slant into the breech. don't know if that has anything to do with anything but i am going to see how it is placed in relation to the charge and ball/patch. if needs be i will install a liner.
this is what is so wonderful about muzzleloaders. keeps one busy on many fronts!
now if it would just stop snowing i could spend my plowing time on playing with guns!