Smith Carbines?

[Smokey Plainsman]

Thoughts on the Smith carbines?

I just bought one and am looking for input from guys that have shot or handled them. Thanks!

 

[kh54]

Howdy Smokey! I’m curious to know more about your gun - make, age, type of bullet and load you use (if you’ve been shooting yet), etc.

I picked up a circa 1990 Pietta in a trade and shot it a few times last summer. It’s fun to shoot but has a couple of problems.

The adjustable rear sight is junk. The sliding piece (technical name?) is too loose so I’ll have to do something to make it tighter or give it more friction. There are also no graduated markings of any kind. I think Pietta really missed on that sight.

Worse, this gun shoots very high, maybe 18-24 inches at just 50 yards. The front sight consists of a dovetailed steel piece that holds a brass blade that can be removed and replaced. (It looks like yours is similar if not identical.) I bought a piece of brass to make a taller front sight but I got sidetracked by other projects and just haven’t done that yet. I noticed in at least one photo of an original that its front sight was also very tall, so maybe someone can tell us if this is a ‘thing’.

I do like how lightweight it is and I also like the history and design of this gun when there were so many innovations being made in breechloading firearms. I’ve never seen an original rubber cartridge so I wonder if the nylon cartridges that I use are a good approximation to the originals. Again, maybe someone in the forum would know?

I only have two breechloaders, my Smith and an 1859 Sharps reproduction. I think in terms of practicality the Sharps is a better design but the Smith is nicer to handle, mostly due to weight. I am looking forward to shooting it a lot more just as soon as the weather improves.

Sorry to be so long in replying, but you did ask for thoughts…

 

[Archer 756]

Wrong Forum NOT A MUZZLE LOADER

 

[kh54]

Archer, I replied to your post like this on another recent thread, about Sharps rifles, as I recall. Forum Rule No. 7 does allow this discussion:

“Early historic breech loading guns that do not use primed metallic or semi-metallic cartridges and meet the requirements of rule #1 are permitted for discussion.”

Rules are here: FORUM RULES.

 

[nkbj]

I've almost been getting a Smith for over forty years. Would love to hear everybody's experiences.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

“Early historic breech loading guns that do not use primed metallic or semi-metallic cartridges and meet the requirements of rule #1 are permitted for discussion.”

Further clarification is also found at the end of the enumerated rules


POSTS FOR BREECH LOADING GUNS:

Ӣ The firearm must have been made prior to 1865. Replicas of these guns are also acceptable.

Ӣ The firearm must utilize an ignition system which is separate from any form or type of cartridge that may have been used to seal the breech or load the powder or the projectile.
The "cartridge" may incorporate a pan or similar device to hold priming powder.

Ӣ Vent ignited guns, Matchlocks, Wheel-locks, any form of Flintlock and its predecessors, Percussion cap and its predecessors are all acceptable for discussion.

Ӣ Discussion of needle guns, pinfire, rim fire, center fire and any similar cartridges containing priming devices or the firearms that use them is not permitted.

Ӣ Posts may be made in a suitable section such as, smoothbore, cannon, handgun, flintlock rifle or percussion rifle, based on the type of gun.
Posts in the General Muzzleloading section is recommended.

LD

 

[Old Hawkeye]

Wrong Forum NOT A MUZZLE LOADER

If you read the rules about what is permissible for discussion you will find that the Smith & 1859 Sharps carbines are two of just a handful of "breechloaders" that can be talked about here. I think that's a good thing because I don't see them mentioned hardly anywhere & they are pretty cool guns that deserve to be remembered & shot!

 

[ADK Bigfoot]

I shot a Smith in competition (N=SSA) for years and loved it. It was an original. Still wish I had it. I keep looking for a replacement, but they have gotten very expensive. My understanding from competition shooters is that the replicas are not as good without some work.

The military guns of this period all shot high: hold on the horse, hit the man. Most competition shooters replace the front sight with a higher blade to bring POI to POA.

ADK Bigfoot

 

[dave951]

I have 2 Smiths, both repops. One is a Navy Arms, the other a Pietta. Of the two, the Pietta is more accurate, at this time. Early Navy Arms repops had issues with the rifling being cut incorrectly and the only fix is a reline, which I've had done. IIRC, serial numbers under 1600 are the suspect ones.

Original Smiths can be very accurate but as with any arm of this era, load development must be done. From your posted pic, there are brass cases and the black plastic ones. It really depends on your gun as to which is more accurate.

Handling, first off, don't let the gun "flop" open. That accelerates hinge wear. Second, do NOT remove the "clean out" screw. That is only there as a work around in the manufacturing process in drilling the fire channel. Repop Smiths are also prone to wear in the fire channel at the base of the cartridge. There is a smith in the N-SSA who has a great fix for that. For reliable ignition, use only good caps from either RWS or Schuetzen. The Smith has a convoluted fire channel just like the Sharps and needs all the help it can get in that regard.

Don't get caught up in chasing more power. The locking mechanism on these isn't the strongest and about anything you'd want to do with this gun can be done with up to 35g 3f. I know of several N-SSA members who hunt with their Smiths using only their 30g 3f target load and they are quite successful.

Cartridges- the plastic ones do wear out over time and must be replaced. To load the plastic ones, the best method I've found is to use a small disc of wax paper in the bottom of the case. The disc can easily by cut by a standard paper hole punch. Then put in the powder charge. Some guns respond well to having filler, others not so much. Press a prelubed bullet down onto the powder. Done. The reason for the filler is to adjust the distance of the bullet to the rifling, a major component in accuracy.

Enjoy your Smith. They're easy to clean and fun to shoot.

 

[desi23]

I enjoy mine, it's an original. A friend has one of the reproduction ones, it had ignition problems at first. After a trip back to the importer it was much better. Good caps are a must, I am using the RWS in mine. I have tried both the brass and nylon cartridges. I seem to get better results with the nylon ones in mine. They are easier to load and I like that as well as being closer in style to original rounds I have examined.

 

[Columbus]

I have a Pietta Smith and the only thing I've done to it is replace the trigger spring. The gun is new and I found the trigger pull just way too hard. Found a drop in replacement that made a huge difference. The gun shoots well and other than the trigger spring and an action so tight I have to use thumb pressure to break it open I've had no issues. Here's a pic of the stock trigger spring and the replacement.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Wrong Forum NOT A MUZZLE LOADER

Right Forum READ THE RULES

 

[Archer 756]

I stand corrected

 

[simonbeans]

Back in the 1970s I had a Mike Yeck Smith carbine in the N-SSA. Loved it. Shot much better than me and was very well made. Sold it to buy a horse. Horse died. Stupid me.

 

[kh54]

@Columbus, where did you get the replacement spring?

 

[Columbus]

@Columbus, where did you get the replacement spring?

A member on the N-SSA forum had a number of them made. It's been about a year and I'm not on the site often but might be able to find him again. $5 fix. (edit) found it - from last August

Guys, my computer and I are not getting along as far as private messages, undoubtedly my fault. Springs are$5 each + $1 for shipping
Paul Gritmacker
10815 St. Rt. 47
Hebron,IL 60034

815-482-9757

 

[kh54]

Thanks!

 

[toot]

THANK'S ALSO.

 

[Dave Fox]

20 shots at 50 yards. Aiming point was bottom of the bull.

 

[Poguetx]

Originals Smiths in very good shape cost only about 50% more than a repro, at least when I got mine about 5 years ago. I got some of the brass cases from Buffalo Arms, but haven't tried it yet. Plastic cases are a lot cheaper, but may not last. The brass ones should last forever.