Spiller and Burr

[Muskatoon61]

I just bought a brand new Pietta Spiller and Burr, took the cylinder out and cannot reinstall it. And sadly I've already marred the cylinder trying. I put it on half cock but a bit of the hand sticks out. This must be what is keeping it from seating back in. I've owned Remington revolvers and other single actions and never had this problem. Plus,the cylinder is an extremely tight fit to the frame.
And advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Sarsaparilla Kid]

I just bought a brand new Pietta Spiller and Burr, took the cylinder out and cannot reinstall it. And sadly I've already marred the cylinder trying. I put it on half cock but a bit of the hand sticks out. This must be what is keeping it from seating back in. I've owned Remington revolvers and other single actions and never had this problem. Plus,the cylinder is an extremely tight fit to the frame.
And advice would be greatly appreciated.

I read elsewhere that there is a trick to rolling the cylinder back into place...let me see if I can find the thread...

 

[hawkeye2]

It goes in just like a Remington. Roll it clockwise looking from the rear as you insert it into the frame. That pushes the hand up out of the way.

 

[Eutycus]

Howdy and Welcome from Texas!

 

[Sarsaparilla Kid]

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/spiller-burr-cleaning-and-reassemble.179964/

Some discussion here

 

[Black_Feather]

Welcome from Oregon!

 

[toot]

Welcome.

 

[Muskatoon61]

It goes in just like a Remington. Roll it clockwise looking from the rear as you insert it into the frame. That pushes the hand up out of the way.

I discovered that the hand was protruding too far out of it's slot.
I disassembled the gun and filed down the hand and now the cylinder fits fine. I did a trigger job on it as well because it was way too heavy, and polished the internal parts. Now the action feels better and even sounds better.
Next, range time.

 

[Smokerr]

Not trying to make you feel bad but that is not what you want to do with a timing problem (bolt not in the right place at the right part of the half/full cock.

You now have less hold on your cylinder. It maybe ok but they are overbuilt a bit for a reason.

A temporary fix is to pull back the hammer past half cock and see if the bolt recesses into the frame. If so you can do that and or put a wood dowel behind the hammer to hold it back when you work the cylinder in or out.

The bolt indexes off the two arms at the other end which in turn works off the pin in the side of the hammer. That would be where the problem is.

No I can't tell you how, I understand the concept of how it works, I don't know what you work on to correct your particular timing problem. Someone like 45D could answer that far better.

I have looked and while I have seen discussions, I have not seen a step by step symptom based approach.

 

[Muskatoon61]

Not trying to make you feel bad but that is not what you want to do with a timing problem (bolt not in the right place at the right part of the half/full cock.

You now have less hold on your cylinder. It maybe ok but they are overbuilt a bit for a reason.

A temporary fix is to pull back the hammer past half cock and see if the bolt recesses into the frame. If so you can do that and or put a wood dowel behind the hammer to hold it back when you work the cylinder in or out.

The bolt indexes off the two arms at the other end which in turn works off the pin in the side of the hammer. That would be where the problem is.

No I can't tell you how, I understand the concept of how it works, I don't know what you work on to correct your particular timing problem. Someone like 45D could answer that far better.

I have looked and while I have seen discussions, I have not seen a step by step symptom based approach.

I appreciate the comments. I didn't have a timing issue, I couldn't put the cylinder back in the frame because the hand was protruding too far out. The timing is good and the action is a lot better since I did the trigger job.
I'm thinking it's possible that when they were assembling the gun at Pietta, the cylinder may have been installed first and then the internals.

 

[Trot]

Mine is the same way, i use a very thin bladed knife to hold the hand in while I insert the cylinder.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

The Spillers are neat guns and provide quite the pop on target.

 

[Jappo]

I just bought two of them NIB. Just opened the box and looked at em. Haven't checked them out yet.

 

[ZUG]

I think ALL of the Spiller & Burr revolvers have this issue. The cylinders are a VERY tight fit and yes the hand does protrude into the frame and yes the hand does need to be pressed back a bit to get the cylinder into position so that the cylinder pin can be installed.
The cylinder has to be rolled into position squarely between the barrel and the recoil shield of the frame. If the cylinder is not square with the frame's opening, then you will have a hard time getting the cylinder in. The handspring is a bit stiff and needs some help moving back to allow the cylinder to enter the frame. This can be done with some extra help from a wood flat stick or just keeping the cylinder squarely in the frame's window and carefully rolling the cylinder into position. I do not recommend that the hands nose be filed down although this will allow for easy of cylinder installation but will eventually lead to indexing and lock-up issues. My two cents worth -- good luck in your adventure.

 

[Smokerr]

I appreciate the comments. I didn't have a timing issue, I couldn't put the cylinder back in the frame because the hand was protruding too far out. The timing is good and the action is a lot better since I did the trigger job.

Complete brain zark on my part, no idea why I saw bolt instead of hand.

My apologies

 

[B P Arn]

On mine, the cylinder was somewhat difficult to replace into the frame at first. It either loosened up after shooting it some, or I learned better how to do it, or a combination of both. I didn't do any filing.

 

[Muskatoon61]

I think ALL of the Spiller & Burr revolvers have this issue. The cylinders are a VERY tight fit and yes the hand does protrude into the frame and yes the hand does need to be pressed back a bit to get the cylinder into position so that the cylinder pin can be installed.
The cylinder has to be rolled into position squarely between the barrel and the recoil shield of the frame. If the cylinder is not square with the frame's opening, then you will have a hard time getting the cylinder in. The handspring is a bit stiff and needs some help moving back to allow the cylinder to enter the frame. This can be done with some extra help from a wood flat stick or just keeping the cylinder squarely in the frame's window and carefully rolling the cylinder into position. I do not recommend that the hands nose be filed down although this will allow for easy of cylinder installation but will eventually lead to indexing and lock-up issues. My two cents worth -- good luck in your adventure.

 

[Muskatoon61]

Yesterday was the first time that I shot the Spiller and Burr. I was surprised how quickly it fouled. After 2 or three shots in some cases. I've seen several videos of guys shooting a full cylinder with struggling to cock the hammer. I've owned several cap and ball revolvers over the years, including Remington and Colt repros, but I've never seen one foul this bad so quickly. Obviously the tight tolerances of this full frame design are a big part of the issue.
I made sure there was lube on the cylinder pin, inside front of frame and inside rear frame. But wow, foul city. Would appreciate any input from those who own and shoot one of these.

 

[Jappo]

I shot mine with 20gr 3f .375 ball. Didn't have any issues. Shot a mile high though
But they do that according to what I've read.
Had a Remington and a Walker get tight after a few rounds. I removed the cylinder and spit in it. Got the rest of the rounds without issue. I think if a good dab of grease on the pin and cylinder might work. Haven't tried it on the Remington but it works pretty good for the Walker.
I've also read where some cut some grooves on the pin to hold the grease better.

 

[Maven]

Three suggestions about managing fouling: (1) Damp swab the bbl. after each cylinder full to control fouling there. (2) Use lubed felt wads over the powder charge to control, but not eliminate bore fouling, (You can buy these or make them yourself. If the latter, Google Duro Felt.) (3) A heavy coat of grease, e.g., white lithium grease, on the cylinder pin and bearing surfaces on the front and rear of the cylinder helps a lot, but you may need to clean and re-grease the cylinder pin when cocking gets difficult.