It is a very good thing that I like a challenge and am not a quitter. I got a "poly patch" out using the rod and screw, but there was another "poly patch" and it wouldn't come out, so I put the rod in a cordless drill and tried to pull it. Well, the rod broke off inside the barrel. The barrel has the breech end welded shut so I think I will saw it off and pound out the obstruction then weld the end back on to the barrel. I haven't had this much fun since USMC Basic Training.
Stuck Ball Progress
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Mike Brooks
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:haha:
If you have a removable touch hole liner, take it out and screw a zerk / grease nipple into the hole. Pump the offending junk out with grease from a grease gun. Power grease guns at a garage will do this in seconds. They will probably do it for free just for the entertainment value of the story. If you don't have a removable vent liner then drill & tap the touch hole for 1/4 X28 threads and get a touch hole liner from Track of the Wolf for $1.99 and carry on with the grease. Shove the grease back out the vent hole with your cleaning jag and a patch and scrub the rest of the grease out with whatever solvent is handy. Kerosene, paint thinner, brake cleaner,etc. This will work and you won't be wrecking anything in the process.
Billnpatti
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Cody, if your breach plug is welded in, buddy, you have not one but two problems. A welded breach plug may well not be safe and it ain't right, no way. A breach plug is supposed to be screwed into the breach of the barrel. The threads give the breach plug greater strength to withstand the pressures that are generated when the gun is fired. For safety's sake, you need to have a gunsmith remove the old breach plug, thread your barrel breach and replace the present plug with one that screws in. Sure it will cost a few bucks but it sure beats having a welded breach plug come loose and go sailing back through your brain pan. That ain't a pain you will soon recover from and it will create a tough cosmetic problem for you local mortician.
Meantime, that idea about removing the touch hole liner and putting a zerk fitting into the touch hole and using a grease gun to push out the stuck ball is a wonderful and very inventive idea. Just be sure that the threads in your touch hole are compatable with available touch hole liners. It's sure be a pain to find that you had made too big of a hole or used the wrong tap to cut your threads and then have to repair your touch hole before you could replace the liner. I think he is right about tapping the hole with a 1/4-28 thread. I think most touch hole liners have that thread. Jim Chambers touch hole liners have a non-standard thread so I wouldn't order one of them even though they are wonderful liners. It would just be one more problem in matching the threads of the liner with those of a zerk fitting.
All of this assumes that you have tried the usual method of stuck ball removal by working ffffG powder into the touch hole, making sure the ball is seated and then just shooting it out. That's the usual method of removing a stuck ball if you can be sure is seated on the powder. This won't work if the ball is stuck part way down the bore. Using this method under those conditions can result in a ruptured barrel with bad consequences for you. But if the ball is seated on the powder, it is a great way to remove the ball safely.
Another bit of advice......go to your stock of gun stuff and find that bag of poly patches, carefully bundle them up so you don't drop any and run, don't walk, to your nearest trash can and throw them away. Poly patches have no place in a flintlock. They are a modern thing intended primarily to separate the unsuspecting person from their money. They are absolutely no good in a traditional muzzleloader. What you should be using is a 100% cotton fabric that you lubricate with a non-petroleum lubricant. Good old spit is one of the best lubricants so long as you are not going to leave the gun loaded for long periods of time such as when you are hunting or it is below freezing outside. I like straight Ballistol on my patches but there are a BUNCH of alternative lubricants available along with a LOT of recipes for home made lubricants. Just DO NOT use petroleum based lubricants. Petroleum based lubricants form a gummy residue in your bore that is hard to remove and will cause you to have fouling problems.
Bottom line, use the grease fitting method to remove your stuck ball (and stuff), then take your rifle to a gunsmith and have him replace the welded breach plug with a threaded one. Lastly, get rid of the Poly Patches and use only 100% cotton fabric patches with a natural non-petroleum lubricant. Your present problems will be solved and you can then turn your attention to developing the most accurate load that your gun can deliver. For this, I highly recommend getting a copy of Dutch Schultz' muzzleloading accuracy method. You can find it by Googling "Muzzleloading Accuracy". I think Dutch is now getting $15 for his pamphlet but it is going to be the best $15 you will ever spend on muzzleloading. I just looked up his web site and it is http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/tips.html It involves a good bit of work to get the most accuracy from your rifle but as we ex-Marines know, an inaccurate weapon is just an expensive club.
Semper Fi!!
Meantime, that idea about removing the touch hole liner and putting a zerk fitting into the touch hole and using a grease gun to push out the stuck ball is a wonderful and very inventive idea. Just be sure that the threads in your touch hole are compatable with available touch hole liners. It's sure be a pain to find that you had made too big of a hole or used the wrong tap to cut your threads and then have to repair your touch hole before you could replace the liner. I think he is right about tapping the hole with a 1/4-28 thread. I think most touch hole liners have that thread. Jim Chambers touch hole liners have a non-standard thread so I wouldn't order one of them even though they are wonderful liners. It would just be one more problem in matching the threads of the liner with those of a zerk fitting.
All of this assumes that you have tried the usual method of stuck ball removal by working ffffG powder into the touch hole, making sure the ball is seated and then just shooting it out. That's the usual method of removing a stuck ball if you can be sure is seated on the powder. This won't work if the ball is stuck part way down the bore. Using this method under those conditions can result in a ruptured barrel with bad consequences for you. But if the ball is seated on the powder, it is a great way to remove the ball safely.
Another bit of advice......go to your stock of gun stuff and find that bag of poly patches, carefully bundle them up so you don't drop any and run, don't walk, to your nearest trash can and throw them away. Poly patches have no place in a flintlock. They are a modern thing intended primarily to separate the unsuspecting person from their money. They are absolutely no good in a traditional muzzleloader. What you should be using is a 100% cotton fabric that you lubricate with a non-petroleum lubricant. Good old spit is one of the best lubricants so long as you are not going to leave the gun loaded for long periods of time such as when you are hunting or it is below freezing outside. I like straight Ballistol on my patches but there are a BUNCH of alternative lubricants available along with a LOT of recipes for home made lubricants. Just DO NOT use petroleum based lubricants. Petroleum based lubricants form a gummy residue in your bore that is hard to remove and will cause you to have fouling problems.
Bottom line, use the grease fitting method to remove your stuck ball (and stuff), then take your rifle to a gunsmith and have him replace the welded breach plug with a threaded one. Lastly, get rid of the Poly Patches and use only 100% cotton fabric patches with a natural non-petroleum lubricant. Your present problems will be solved and you can then turn your attention to developing the most accurate load that your gun can deliver. For this, I highly recommend getting a copy of Dutch Schultz' muzzleloading accuracy method. You can find it by Googling "Muzzleloading Accuracy". I think Dutch is now getting $15 for his pamphlet but it is going to be the best $15 you will ever spend on muzzleloading. I just looked up his web site and it is http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/tips.html It involves a good bit of work to get the most accuracy from your rifle but as we ex-Marines know, an inaccurate weapon is just an expensive club.
Semper Fi!!
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What kind of barrel are we talking about here?
I have never seen a barrel with a welded breech, though I have heard tails of such things. I have, however, seen a coupla breeches that appeared to be welded, but had a "cap" with an integral tang on the back of an otherwise standard breech plug.
As to cutting off the "welded" breech and welding a new one in place, IMHO, that is an accident waiting to happen.
God bless
I have never seen a barrel with a welded breech, though I have heard tails of such things. I have, however, seen a coupla breeches that appeared to be welded, but had a "cap" with an integral tang on the back of an otherwise standard breech plug.
As to cutting off the "welded" breech and welding a new one in place, IMHO, that is an accident waiting to happen.
God bless
If you are telling me that I can perhaps remove this breech plug by screwing it out and that it is not actually welded in that would be great. I will try to screw it out, nothing to lose at this point. A report will follow. By the way guys thanks for all your comments and opinions.
lonehunter
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The breech plug will be tight,be sure of what you are doing, may be cheaper in the long run to take it to somebody that is equipped to do the job.
Just my opinon, and worth every penny you paid for it! :v
Just my opinon, and worth every penny you paid for it! :v
I've used the grease gun method and have good results just by holding the sharp end of the grease insert against the touchhole and someone else pumping he grease gun. sometimes those breechplugs feel like theve been welded in there.
cody said:
Well, they beat a knife or a closed fist, but there are a few things a rifle does a bit better than a pistol.
Muzzleloaders and power tools don't mix. :haha:
Sorry to hear you got well and truly stuck. I've used the Zerk method on percussion rifles and shot my way out of flintlock "oopsies." You got a good one, though, and I don't know where I'd go with that. :idunno:
PS - God intended man to patch with cotton. Not "poly".
I am assuming that your stuck load contains a PRB.
I had a cleaning jag get stuck and strip the threaded brass end off my ram rod. I removed the touch hole sleeve and added 80PSI of compressed air to the breech end. That did the trick. I first pushed the jag another 1/4" down the barrel to make sure it would move easily. This solution may not work for you since your PRB is totally stuck.
If you know where in the barrel the ball is stuck, why not apply some heat with a torch?
1 of 3 things will happen:
- whatever substance is binding may melt and free the patch from the bore
- the patch may burn away
- the ball will melt
In all cases, your barrel is now empty.
I had a cleaning jag get stuck and strip the threaded brass end off my ram rod. I removed the touch hole sleeve and added 80PSI of compressed air to the breech end. That did the trick. I first pushed the jag another 1/4" down the barrel to make sure it would move easily. This solution may not work for you since your PRB is totally stuck.
If you know where in the barrel the ball is stuck, why not apply some heat with a torch?
1 of 3 things will happen:
- whatever substance is binding may melt and free the patch from the bore
- the patch may burn away
- the ball will melt
In all cases, your barrel is now empty.
cody said:
Ultra Hi... Two piece stock perhaps.
Their "Minuteman Flintlock" has a screwed in and welded breech, welded under the tang or the tang welded on, underlugs are welded too. Everything else was of similar "quality". These have TWO PIECE BARRELS and the bores in the pieces often do not align properly when they screw them together. The one the Buckskin Report sectioned years ago was .010 out of alignment.
Its not even a good jack handle. This is probably why the poly thing won't come out. If its 1/2 octagon its likely 2 pieces screwed together.
The rod you broke was worth more than the gun if this is the case.
They were made by a big name arms maker in Japan.
Dan
