T/C Renegade Range Report

[huntswnm]

Hey guys.
Well after finally getting my Renegade cleaned out REAL good I was able to take it out to the Forest today for some shooting. Was able to get my shots all touching at 50 yards off the bench, and the last two shots were free hand standing at 50 yards, hitting about 2" apart. Would have kept going, but I ended up loading a PRB ball without putting the powder in first :youcrazy: . Well, come to find out my ball puller was not in my bag, so packed things up and came home.
I am really pleased at how the gun is shooting at 50 yards. Real anxious to get back out there and go a little farther. Had just set up at 75 yards when I had my little loading mishap.
So I picked up a few of the wads today to get your guys opinions on them. Before a couple of days ago I didn't know I should be looking at them. So here are two pictures, one of either side. What do you see, and what do you think?

 

[nw_hunter]

Looks like your doing it right :thumbsup:
I wish I could get all mine to touch at 50 yds.

Patches look like you could use them again.
Nice day in the woods!

 

[buttonbuck]

pillow ticking is very durable stuff good patch material I perfer a 530 ball with an .018 than a 535 and a .010 or .015 patch.

 

[huntswnm]

One more question. I have never taken off the hammer of the gun before. Someone told me a few weeks ago on this forum that is something I should be doing when cleaning the gun. So how do I do this? I noticed the flathead screw on the opposite side of the gun from the hammer so if I remove that, will that free up the mechanism?
Thanks for info, just don't want to pull things apart and not be able to get them back together.

Jeff

 

[RADeO]

Sure looks like you are on the right track, as long as there are no cuts or tears in your fired patches - even small ones.

Sad to learn your loading mishap ended your day of shooting. You might consider carrying a small container of 4fg powder (a flintlock pan charger works well for this). Then all you need do is unscrew the nipple, put 5 to 10 grains of the 4f powder in the flash channel, replace the nipple, and then discharge the rifle in a safe direction. Then, if nobody is around, the redness quickly leaves your face and you can continue shooting. :grin:

 

[silverfox]

Two things. Sorry you dry balled. Instead of packing up the next time remove the nipple and put some powder in the chamber and you can probably shoot the ball out.
As for pulling the hammer to clean you rifle I've been shooting for close to 50 years and have never heard of that. You can pull the lock for cleaning but not the hammer or breachplug they should never have to be removed unless broken or massive plug in barrel. There are lots of ways to get plugs out of the barrel without pulling the plug just ask here and you will get lot of answers.
The flat head screw opposite the hammer is the lock screw (there may be 1 or 2 on that side that hold the lock) That will allow you to bemove the lock and it should the cleaned but don't take it apart just clean and oil. You can learn how to take it apart later.
Fox :thumbsup:

 

[roundball]

Sounds like really good shooting, congratulations!
The patches held together pretty well...just a note looking at the firesides it seems like the lands are just starting to cut through...top right patch is most obvious...like it might be a very tight fitting combination...(note the very tight compression squeezed all the lube out of the patch areas (white) where pinched against the lands...

 

[huntswnm]

thanks guys. I will remember those suggestions about the dry load :redface: As far as the patches, there are no cuts, but like you mentioned there is a couple where they are jagged, almost cut. Not all are that way. Should I be doing something different, smaller patch maybe? I was swabbing between shots so most loads went down easy. Couple did seem to stick a little, so maybe those were them?
jeff

 

[ldykeman]

removing that screw will enable you to remove the lock (**** the hammer first). BUT, when you reinstall it, DO NO crank down hard on that screw... just snug is just fine. The wood can be cracked from tightening too much.
BTW, the T/C Sidelock manual is at: http://www.tcarms.com/assets/manuals/current/Shooting_TC_Side_Lock_Black_Powder_Guns.pdf

Larry

 

[paulvallandigham]

Those are Patches, NOT WADS, and they look fine. You have the right patch and ball combination for that gun barrel. Enjoy. :hatsoff:

 

[huntswnm]

Those are Patches, NOT WADS

I sit corrected :rotf: :bow:

Jeff

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Paul was trying to give you the correct terminology so that you can speak the language without embarrassing yourself. I guess he thought you were here to learn. :grin:

 

[huntswnm]

I am sorry if you thought my reply was disrespectful. It was not meant to be. When he pointed out my mistake in my terminology I thought it was a little funny, and yes I did feel silly.
Paul, I hope that you did not take offense to my reply. It was really all in good fun.
I am definately here to learn, and have been humbled many times in my quest to learn the art of traditional muzzleloading. I appreciate all of the knowledge that is offered here, and the time that it takes out your day to help a newbie out.

Sincerely,
Jeff

 

[paulvallandigham]

Jeff: I hate correcting anyone. I live in a very large glass house, so I don't like throwing stones!

I merely corrected you so that you would understand which words meant what as you continue to read the forum. Its darn hard enough to communicate ideas with words, instead of words and pictures, and having both the writer and reader understanding the same meaning of terms is essential. We have enough confusion here with people for whom English is a second language.[ like our friends in England and Germany, and Australia, etc.] ( I am kidding, guys!)

These are what we mean when talking about "wads". http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(3...s/tableList.aspx?catID=2&subID=37&styleID=118

I hope I didn't offend you, and I certainly didn't take offense to your reply. We are okay.

Now, if you really want to be confused, read what we have to say about " fillers"...... :rotf: :surrender: :thumbsup:

I was very pleased with the condition of your patches, and am very glad you took the time to find and pick them up. If you really want to learn everything there is to know about " reading " patches, buy Dutch Schoultz's System for $15.00. Its well spent. It took me almost 20 years of trial and error, and consulting other shooters, to learn what I read in Dutch's material and learned in about 20 minutes!
http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

I keep his materials in my book case as a primary reference source I consult whenever I am working up a new load for a gun, or helping others do so. One shooter laughed at me consulting the reference, and claimed at my age I should "Know it All! " I told him, " I DO!( a gross exaggeration) This is just to check on everything I have forgotten!, you young whippersnapper!" :rotf: ( No I don't know what a " whippersnapper " is, but I have heard the name being used for years! and someone is always called a " Young " Whippersnapper!, not an old whippersnapper. ) :hmm: :surrender: :thumbsup:

Okay, I just looked up " whippersnapper" in the dictionary, and it means:

" One who snaps whips; an insignificant, especially young, person who appears impertinent, or presumptuous."

 

[bajabuc]

What I did: Dry Balling a flinter is a trifle tougher to fix than a percussion rifle but...I used a ventpick to worm a few grains of 4f in the chamber of my Dixie Poorboy...primed the pan..and fired it off. Then I waited until I was pretty sure the powder was OUT. Doing this moved the ball far enough so I could get about 10 grains (weight not powder specks) in behind the ball...one speck at a time...then I ramrodded the ball again an shot that puppy down range. I got to watch the ball leave the barrel and fall on the ground about 10 feet in front of me. This was a unique chance for me to check the ball for patch marks...sure enough...the ball had the patch thread pattern sunk into it...a little to deep for my taste. Pretty neat...I lightened up my patch thickness by going to wallmart with my micrometer and getting .013 thick pillow ticking instead of .015. I'll admit I got strange looks measuring fabric thickness...but I'm weird anyway. I don't know if it helped...my accracy improved...but my spelling went to hell.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Welcome to the Honorable Society of DRYBALLERS. I am sure you will be able to repeat your initiation many more times in years ahead, and can join us all in laughing as we bet ourselves as to when we are going to do this stupid stunt again! :shocked2: :redface: :surrender: :thumbsup:

You also have joined the MACHO GANG OF FABRIC STORE RAIDERS, who have incurred the curiosity and irritation of all the women who feel their private domaine has been invaded by the " enemy", and confused them NO END by having a micrometer or caliper to measure the thickness of the fabric, rather than buying it on the basis of "COLOR".

Frankly, I LOVE going into JoAnn Fabrics with my micrometer-- just to see all the queer looks on the faces of the women there! I have seen everything from real ANGER to one lady who smiled and who waited on me, only to tell me that her husband was a MLer, and she knew exactly what I wanted, and why! Boy, was that a refreshing change.

I started out using the .495 diameter alls in my .50 cal. rifle, but after one box, I switched to the .490s for easier loading, and fewer problems with my patching.

I have seen the fabric weave on balls shot out as you had to do( with light charges), and on balls pulled out with a ball jag. But, the later are not a good representative of what happens to a ball that is fired, as the ball jag forces the lead into the grooves, pressing the lead into the fabric weave far more than would happen when the gun is fired.

I have recovered fired balls from water, shot to recover them, so I could look for changes in the shape, marks of the lands, and to my surprise, faint markings of the fabric on the lead balls. The lands are imprinted on the fired balls, too,as the result of " obturation" of the ball on firing.

 

[catman]

All of us have dry balled, and we will again.
Your patches look fine, stay with it..

 

[longcruise]

Ok, I'll go ahead and play devils desciple (as usual :haha: ) and venture to say that while your patches look pretty good, they don't look all that good.

With careful study I can see some destruction of the weave at several points on about half of the patches. Look at the patch on the left in the second row down between 9 and 10 o'clock. See the cut through? Study all of them and you will see others with points of failure. You will get fair accuracy with this patch but it can be improved on.

Any time your patch fails to any degree between the barrel wall and the ball your accuracy will degrade. Your ball is no longer traveling in the centerline of the bore and will leave the muzzle off center.

There are several possible singular solutions, but most likely the overall solution is a combination of solving several problems, such as:

1. Interior barrel condition such as roughness or sharpness of the rifling (not too likely since your barrel is a TC and is button rifled).

2. Crown condition (too sharp or too abrupt causing patch damage when starting the ball)

3. Patch material that is not tough enough

Lube is often considered suspect but I don't think there is any deficiency in the lube based on the appearance of the patches.

 

[rafterob]

Is a "Whippersnapper" anything like a "Tallywhacker"?

 

[chapmans]

I have always said "There are two kinds of muzzloader shooters, those that have dry balled and those that will" I'm definitely in the have catagory.
Longball 58