TC 56

[XXX]

Thanks Sam,

I will go back and look again.

 

[sffar]

Hello Roundball,
Wil do. I did find 9/16" which would be exact, as i measured the bore at .562/.563. I wonder if the cards or felt disks were soaked in lube they'd expand enough to fit nice and snug. Anyway, there must be punches sized to, say, 19/32" or 37/64" someplace. I'm going to keep looking.
Sam

 

[roundball]

Hello Roundball,
Wil do. I did find 9/16" which would be exact, as i measured the bore at .562/.563. I wonder if the cards or felt disks were soaked in lube they'd expand enough to fit nice and snug. Anyway, there must be punches sized to, say, 19/32" or 37/64" someplace. I'm going to keep looking.
Sam

Be careful about wads and lubes in smoothbores...soaking an OP wad for example can make it too heavy and they'll follow into the back end of the shot column disrupting it.

You want an OP wad light enough so it starts slowing down as soon as possible after muzzle exit while the mass of the heavier shot charge starts to distance itself from the OP wad...if you make the OP wad too heavy it'll follow along with and can interfere with the back end of the shot column.

Oxyoke wads for OP are lubed internally and very light.
Circle Fly Cushion Wads are lubed around the edges and are light;

OS cards are not lubed at all...just a hard dry pressed wafer

 

[paulvallandigham]

That is one of the reasons for using 2 OS card on top of both ball and shot loads in these guns. Your jag- if its not flat faced-- may alter the edges so it doesn't seal will, but it won't affect the second OS card in front of the one you are pushing on.

Also, put an off center hole to let the air out, so you don't turn an edge, letting air escape that way.

 

[sffar]

Thanks for the tip.
So if using the rod I've got, then use two cards with holes in them. Seems like a good way to deal with keeping shot securely in place. But why over a roundball load? The .550 ball and patch seemed to sit very tightly in the bore.
Sam

 

[roundball]

Thanks for the tip.
So if using the rod I've got, then use two cards with holes in them. Seems like a good way to deal with keeping shot securely in place. But why over a roundball load? The .550 ball and patch seemed to sit very tightly in the bore.
Sam

OS cards are not needed over a proper fitting PRB in a muzzleloader;

Using multiple OS cards in "hopes" of not bending one of the two of them with a round ball jag, with absolutely no knowledge of how much pressure each and every different shooter might apply when seating, is simply wrong.

A flat faced shotgun jag should be used with shot loads...thats what they're designed for...don't start out your new endeavor by taking shorcuts or you will be building in degrees of unsatisfactory results before you even get to the range.

The facts are, you don't want ANYTHING in front of a shot charge that is not absolutely necessary.
And if anything IS necessary to hold the shot in, then you want the very smallest, lightest possible amount of material it takes to do it...a single proper fitting OS card made for that purpose.

You definitely don't want to be stacking up multiple OS cards in front of the shot charge...that just makes a larger object with more weight/mass for the windblast to hit and force back into the shot column before it can get out of the way.

Always think as thin and light weight as possible when putting anything in front of a shot charge...some even use an OS card made from an extremely thin lightweight piece of styrofoam.

:thumbsup:

 

[sffar]

Thanks, roundball. What you're saying makes sense to me. I guess there's a lot of experimentation that goes on! I was sitting here earlier trying to think of what materials might serve to hold shot, that would be light and perhaps frangible or meltable or might incinerate or whatever. Styrofoam did not occur to me! I was thinking along the lines of flammable cardboard, cardboard scored to blow apart, maybe a thin paraffin disk with thread or cigarette paper backing. It's all pretty interesting to ponder, and I read how people use some tricks which seem counterintuitive, but which apparently work for them. Then there's how to make due with what's readily available . . etc. This'll be fun to experiment with. One of the things I find appealing about a smoothbore black powder gun is the idea you can kind of stuff anything down there you want and shoot it out!
Sam

 

[paulvallandigham]

Roundball is correct. But the CATCH is that the ball be properly fitted to the bore. The only reason to use the OS cards on top of a ball is if the ball is undersized, and is a loose fit to the bore. Like using a .509 diameter cast ball with a denim patch, because that is what you have! :thumbsup:

 

[sffar]

"Like using a .509 diameter cast ball with a denim patch, because that is what you have!"
Got it”“knowing what's needed to make due.
Thanks, Paul
Sam

 

[jethro224]

I've had good luck using 4 over-shot cards directly over the powder instead of a fiber wad or thick over-powder card.

I've also had good luck using a cleaning jag with a lubed patch on it instead of a shotgun ramrod tip. Keeps the bore lubed without adding weight. Doesn't bend the cards. :thumbsup:

 

[sffar]

Thanks jethro224,
And I already have a cleaning jag! Looks like it should work nicely.
I wonder if a perforated cardboard disk would work over powder. That seems like it might give some good cushioning and it's dirt cheap. It would be fairly light. The volume of air might not be good if it was too thick, or if too many pieces were used I suppose.
Sam

 

[paulvallandigham]

Iron Jim Rackham's system called for using 4 OS cards, each with an off-center hole in the card, and lining the cards so that no hole aligns with the hole in the card next to it. A 12-3-6-9 o'clock orientation of the cards at the muzzle insures that the holes will not let gas escape THROUGH the OS cards via the hole, yet the holes allow air to escape out of the barrel as the cards are loaded, so you don't get dieseling with the cards, and turned edges. Its the preserving of those critical edges that is the real important reason for using any wad or card as an OP wad. Its the only reason an off-center hole in those 4 cards contributes anything to the load- most of the air in the barrel will pass through the powder charge and exit the vent or nipple.

I use my cleaning jag to load both OS cards, and PRB in my smoothbores. The jag has a flat end, but a rounded "edge". That works okay, PROVIDED I use more than one card for each function( OP WAD and OS CARD).

 

[sffar]

Interesting, Paul. I guess I'd better get to the range and try this out to better understand what goes on when loading shot, cards, cushion wads etc.
I may pick up some shot today, but it's real cold and I think I'll wait a few days until that passes before giving this a try.
Sam