The feasibility of returning to a more primitive season?

[fyrfyter43]

I've always wanted to see a flintlock-only season like PA has. But here in NJ I'd like to see it during the "extended" bow season in November. You can bowhunt here from early September through late February. I don't think allowing flintlocks for a week or 2 would be a big problem (except with the United Bowhunters of NJ).

We now have somewhere around 65 days we can hunt with ML, but it starts in early December and runs through mid-February with a patchwork of different days for different weapons. Some days are shotgun-only, others are ML-only, but most days are either weapon. And you need to buy separate permits for shotgun and ML (and for each zone you want to hunt) at almost $30 a pop...not to mention a separate buck tag if you want to shoot a buck. Yes, we have generous seasons (mainly because of the sharp decrease in hunter numbers). But it gets very confusing trying to figure out which days you can hunt with what weapon...not to mention that there are only a few days that are ML only. And to add to the confusion, there are quite a few days when you can only shoot antlerless deer, regardless of whether or not you have a buck tag.

 

[roundball]

I think many states wildlife departments have let their regulations evolve into unnecessary patchworks of tacked on modifications that have made them very difficult for the average joe to try and stay abreast of.
Here in North Carolina, our annual hunting & fishing "regulations digest" is now up to 100 pages, duplex printed on both sides...its absurd !

IMO, wildlife people need to do the math, figure the number of total days and tags for the game, then make one season / any weapon.

 

[squirrellluck]

Wow! How do ya'll keep track of all those seasons? Bow season opens oct 1, primitive weapon opens 2 weeks later and gun season 1 week after that. They all run concurantly until sometime in dec. Then gun season closes, 2 weeks later primitive closes and Bow closes end of jan.

 

[wvbuckbuster]

And I thought WV was the only one with problems. :idunno:

 

[squirejohn]

I doubt we'll ever have a primitive mzldr. season for several reasons, not the least as stated (2) by Roundball.

We might just as well have a single shot season considering all the bells & whisles of modern Mzldrs. This would also allow yhe use of single shot shotgun with slugs which is more reflective of primitive Mzldrs than the modern in#%&@#.

 

[tg]

Since the early 70's the ML manufactures have not gone in the trdaitonal direction with the style of guns and projectiles and sights most have offered and most hunters/shooters have learned with this in itself has been a block of sorts to having traditional seasons and also left the door open for more and more modern aspects to be added to ML's now trhat the door is open it is unlikely that things would change and many would not like a truely Traditional ML hunt if they had to give up the modern peep sight and modern bullets it is what it is and will remain so

 

[Bougalee]

Not likely to happen, in Louisiana, it is now legal to hunt with a breach loading single shot cartridge rifle during the "muzzleloading season".

So much for primitive hunting.

 

[luieb45]

Those are more traditional than the inlines though. I think hunting with a sharps would be fun for hunting buffalo or elk because that represents a whole new time period just like how some of us hunt with 1830s weapons.

 

[Snow on the Roof]

Want a primitive weapons season? Easy to do, just get 10,000 voting flintlock shooters together and storm the legislature during an election year until your representatives bend to your will! Um... can't find 10,000 voting flintlock shooters in your state? Now you understand the problem. We traditional muzzleloading hunters don't have the numbers nor political clout to have much of an impact on the state legislatures. We don't have the consumer numbers to justify a manufactuer to sink 7 figures into lobbying for a primative season in which they will not see a financial return. For the most part our's is a cottage industry made up of small independent business people who simply don't have the free capitalization to influence state representatives and DNR management.
It is not a totally lost cause. Here in Illinois the UBI, United Bowhunters of Illinois, a small but very loud group of traditional archery fans has been a very strong voice in Springfield. The UBI has never had more than 250 members but they have been a very dedicated volunteer group and have not failed to wield influance in the state house. It can be done but it will require a grass roots movement with a VERY dedicated core group to get the ball rolling. Any volunteers?

Snow

 

[Bougalee]

True enough. I'd much rather hunt with a Sharps or Winchester Highwall, Trapdoor, or something simular than a modern inline.

Also, what Snow on the Roof said!

 

[Sharps1863]

Roundball you are right. North Carolina has way to many rules and regulations on the books now and it Veriee's from county to county. It seems the only thing they do is take something simple and make it hard to work with. Primitive weapon use to mean a single shot muzzle-loading rifle with a side lock hammer that fired a percussion cap or sparked a flint. Open sights only. Now with the modern in-line with a scope you might as well do away with the muzzle-loading and add that week to Rifle season. Because I don't see much difference in using either. An In-Line muzzle-loader is not a Primitive weapon! And most gun shops center around selling supply's for them, not the traditional muzzle-loading rifle

 

[ohio ramrod]

The laws are made by government officals who answer to the people who provide them the money to get elected/appointed. The manufacters of sporting goods like to sell new things and therefore encourage the use of new items rather than using "old" items. As long as the money is in new, the power to pass the laws will cater to the money! :hmm: That unfortunately is the American way! :surrender:

 

[PaulN/KS]

Here in Kansass our muzzleloading association tried to get the season back to the primative muzzleloaders but it was to no avail. It's all about selling tags and making money... :shake:

Me, I just hunt with my muzzleloader or my stickbow anyway...

 

[Darkgael]

PA - as noted has a late flintlock only season. There is also an early ML season
For 2010, the dates are:
DEER, ANTLERLESS MUZZLELOADER (Statewide): Oct. 16-23. An antlerless deer with each required antlerless license.

DEER, ANTLERED OR ANTLERLESS FLINTLOCK (Statewide): Dec. 27-Jan. 15. One antlered deer per hunting license year, or one antlerless deer and an additional antlerless deer with each required antlerless licence

Pete

 

[jethro224]

I'm not sure if hunting with firearms during the rut would be a good idea. In Illinois during the rut it is bow only which I believe is a good idea. Because it doesn't put much pressure on the deer. Even in a primitive flintlock season that would still be a lot of pressure on the deer and the deer would be more worried about getting shot rather than breeding which is what they should be worried about.

What??? I beg to differ.

The first firearm season is the 3-day weekend before Thanksgiving.
The PEAK of the rut here is November 15th.
The rut lasts longer than one day.
First season IS during the rut.

My biggest buck ever was one I shot the morning of November 17th, 2006. Shot with a .50 GPR during the first firearm season, and during the rut. He was chasing a doe when I killed him.

 

[rabjr]

Same here Jethro, took my best deer during the Rut and definitely want to be able to hunt it with a gun.

Luie's problem is lack of understanding is all. Some how he believes deer won't get bred and this all will hurt the numbers in the end. But we all know it's just not so. You can put all the pressure you want on em during the day but you won't get em all and theres a lot of romancing going on at night under the light of the Moon. Luie needs to understand that deer populations can and will explode if left unchecked. Most States today are not taking out the recommended amount from their herds and the population keeps growing, causing all kinds of problems. Now I don't know much about not having a gun season during the Rut as he claims his State does not but any I ever delt with up here in New England, thats when 90% of the deer taken are taken, during rifle/gun season during the rut. :v

Just noticed your both from the same State heh. Ok I guess a crash course on when the the Rut usually hits your area is in order. :idunno:

 

[roundball]

My biggest buck ever was one I shot the morning of November 17th, 2006. Shot with a .50 GPR

That's a terrific buck Jethro...

 

[BigDogg]

That's a beautiful buck Jethro! Here in Pennsylvania, we have a primitive season for Flintlock and bow only. It runs from the day after Christmas until mid-January (in some places with dense deer populations, until the end of January). There is also a week in October for all muzzleloaders (including i**lines) to kill an antlerless deer. The muzzleloader stamp costs $6.75. In the Flintlock late season, you can kill a buck if you have an unused antlered deer tag. Our rut here is roughly around Halloween.