Turkey Distance

[Blue Smoke]

What is the max distance on Turkey with 12ga. Modified Choke barrel,Muzzleloader?

I'm thinking 25 yards.I feel I should stick with that but there is always that thought that you can stretch it out.I know my Bad!!!

Blue Smoke

 

[jdixon]

I don't think there is anything more perplexing in black powder shooting than patterning a muzzleloading shotgun or smoothbore shooting shot. So many variables between powder load, shot load, wads, cards, you name it. Best advice is to spend a lot of time at the pattern board before the season and figure out what your gun shoots the best. Mine- so far with a 10 ga., full choke - it shoots an acceptable pattern out to 33 yards (#6 shot).

 

[roundball]

What is the max distance on Turkey with 12ga. Modified Choke barrel,Muzzleloader?

I'm thinking 25 yards.I feel I should stick with that but there is always that thought that you can stretch it out.I know my Bad!!!

Blue Smoke

My turkey load for my .62cal Flint smoothbore is:

70grns Goex 3F
Two OxYoke wonderwads
Home made paper shot cup
1+5/8oz #6's
.030" OS card

Produces even, dense patterns:
29 #6's through a heavy 4" tuna can @ 30yds;
8 #6's in a coke can @ 40yds (a 2.5" x 5" target)

 

[Stumpkiller]

I've never had the luxury of a choke on my muzzleloading smoothbores. It's partially dependent on shot size, but I'd say the 25 yard limit could be stretched a hair. 30 would be max range in ideal conditions with No. 4 shot, IMHO. Closer with No. 6. And I'm usually pretty conservative in such things. With turkey you get to patiently line up the shot and choose your moment.

Like Roundball's tests: pattern your shotgun. Some have "blown" patterns with holes and gaps right where you don't want them. The soda can is a good "standard" measure.

 

[Runner]

Depending on the gun. I killed my bird at a little over 40 yards this spring. That was 90 grains of powder under 120 of number sixes. It patterns a lot like what Roundball describes. Depends on the load development and components used also. I am using a very thick over powder card and no cushion wad at all. Several folks say they glue the cushion wad to the over powder wad and use both that way with good success. Others use paper cups around the shot to get the pattern a little farther out there. Some folks are stacking the thin over powder cards to get a little more. My present gun is an easy 40 yard turkey gun. My previous gun would have been too if it had not flown apart everytime you fired it! The one before that was useless past about 25 yards, but I was still using the book methods and book loads. I wish I had it back to test now that I know a little more.

 

[Blue Smoke]

Well I'm using CVA,by the Book it says not to shoot over 1 1/4 oz. of Shot,and same by volume of Powder.

I was using 1 5/8 oz. #6 shot,80gr.Pyrodex RS,using a heavy Over Powder Card,and Thin Over Shot Card.Pattern great but according to the Book this is an Unsafe Load.

Blue Smoke

 

[roundball]

Well I'm using CVA,by the Book it says not to shoot over 1 1/4 oz. of Shot,and same by volume of Powder.

I was using 1 5/8 oz. #6 shot,80gr.Pyrodex RS,using a heavy Over Powder Card,and Thin Over Shot Card.Pattern great but according to the Book this is an Unsafe Load.

Blue Smoke

I approach it from the standpoint of payload weight...if the weight of the shot charge is around or below the max projectile weight (ie: a conical) for a given caliber, it should be OK...and when shooting my shot loads, there's no indication of anything excessive or unusal...recoil is moderate, etc.

For example, in my .54cal Flint smoothbore, I use a 1+1/8oz shot charge...should weigh about 500grns, whereas the TC's heaviest .54cal maxi is around 540grns.

In my .62cal bore my 1+5/8oz shot charge would weigh around 700grns...and the much larger .62cal bore diameter has a lot of bore volume which helps keep the pressure fairly moderate

 

[Runner]

I think you will find that if you back off on both that you will still get pretty much the same results. Stay around the 3-4 ratio of powder to shot and you can move from the 50-70 loads for rabbits and doves all the way to the 90-120 loads for turkeys with pretty much the same results as far as pattern size and penetration. The heavier loads just have more pellets in the pattern or let you use the same number in a larger size. The heavier powder charges are needed to keep the heavier shot payload speeds up. I think I remember that your gun is a 12 double? Maybe someone shooting a double will chime in.

 

[Blue Smoke]

I think you will find that if you back off on both that you will still get pretty much the same results. Stay around the 3-4 ratio of powder to shot and you can move from the 50-70 loads for rabbits and doves all the way to the 90-120 loads for turkeys with pretty much the same results as far as pattern size and penetration. The heavier loads just have more pellets in the pattern or let you use the same number in a larger size. The heavier powder charges are needed to keep the heavier shot payload speeds up. I think I remember that your gun is a 12 double? Maybe someone shooting a double will chime in.

Thats what I'm saying Runner if you use your regular Powder Measurer set it at 120gr. that will put you over on Shot at 1 5/8 oz.,but you are ok with the 90gr.Powder.

I'm using 60-80 on Squirrels doing just fine.

Blue Smoke

 

[gmww]

They way I was taught with modern shotgun was 40 yrds. so long as it will pattern 16-18 pellets in the neck/head. You can get turkey head/neck targets online to download or purchase one from the store. (I can't recall where I got the download to please don't ask.)

I just got a 12 ga. side by side and will pattern it that way.

 

[Runner]

Well, you made me think a bit. Yes, the shot payload I am using is over the book limit that came with the gun. No, I do not think it is an over load. After thinking about this for a while, I decided to see how much a CVA shot cup holds. I am using the shot cups Guru told me he had so much luck with that are the CVA brand when I am shooting steel. They are designed for lead, but they protect the barrel from the steel. Anyway, the CVA plastic shotcups hold somewhere between 100 and 110 on the measure. I forget what the factory powder limit is, but I think it is either 90 or 100 grains. That means I am less than 15 grains on the powder measure over on shot with the load I use on turkeys compared to using the CVA cups and a max book load. I guess that means the CVA cup holds more shot than their book allows too! I don't worry about that small difference because I only use that load for turkeys or Geese. The usual load is a lot lighter like yours. I do know that with my light Trapper shotgun, you don't want to shoot the heavy load a lot anyway. It tries to kill on both ends.
If you want to check, use max powder under 100 of shot but try the paper shot cup idea to get you out there a little farther. The thick over powder wads seem the best so far in my gun. If I could get the steel load worked out I would be happy with the gun.
On the other hand, I am ordering a 38 inch 12 guage barrel tomorrow to start building my flintlock shotgun with. I will have about 400 in the gun when I get done. Building it myself is the only way I will ever be able to get one it seems. Maybe this spring I will be using a different gun!

 

[GobblerKnob]

There's more to consider than pattern density. Turkeys can be tough. You can put 30 pellets in the head and neck and still have the turkey get away. The reason is claimed by penetration.
Under no circumstances should you stretch the limit! :nono:
You must have density with penetration sufficient to break the bones in the turkey's head and neck in order for the load to be considered efficient. Anything less than that leads to wounded turkeys.
This isn't an answer you can find any place other than the patterning range. Start out with some suggested loads and experiment until you find the load that your gun likes best. This is the only way you can do it.
Rick

 

[pennsyltucky]

a cheap chronograph comes in very handy for when ur testing new loads. they are well worth the money.

if u cant get 1100fps about 3' from the muzzle, u cant figger on killin a bird much past 35 yards no matter what ur pattern looks like.

a bag of hevi-shot 6's is another option. it patterns much better and it hold its energy quite a bit farther than lead. i use it in my 20 (with a mod choke) and get great patterns and killing energy clear out to 50 yards with 1 1/8oz and 90g 2f

 

[No Deer]

You can download some turkey targets here:
[url] http://www.alseaintegration.com/ptc/images/turkey_target.jpg[/url]

To check penetration, set up a tin can (soup can, not aluminum soda can) at the range you want to test. If you get full penetration of both sides, you have enough power behind your shot for a turkey.

 

[Runner]

Both of us have been squirrel hunting with the guns, so we know pretty much what the penetration range is. If it will go thru a squirrel and stop at the hide on the other side, it will handle turkeys. My lead number 6 turkey load is an easy 40 yard turkey load. At 30 yards my steel load will put bb's level in a piece of plywood, so the steel does not have nearly the energy of the lead pellets. Same load with lead bb's and some would exit the plywood. I just priced hevi-shot and Bismuth earlier today. Over 10$ a pound plus shipping is rediculous.

 

[GobblerKnob]

Runner ~ When you consider that Hevi-shot is $20 a box of ten, I think $10 a pound for a bag of shot is a steel (pun intended!) :grin:

 

[Slamfire]

I don't trust 6s to penetrate well enough beyond 35 yards. Unfortunately my turkey gun won't tolerate 4s or 5s. :nono:

 

[pennsyltucky]

6's will penetrate and kill at 60 yards or more if they have the necessary speed to begin with.....

i know 3 old turkey hunters who use high brass 7 1/2's or heavy handloaded #9's!!! and ive read that 10's or even 12's do well (The Tenth Legion) so i wouldnt worry about 6's doin the job as long as u are taking a head shot...... ur not body shootin em, right? if so u need 2's at least!

 

[gmww]

Anyone know of tests done using ballistics gell at different distances for shot? Would at least give you an idea of penetration.

 

[roundball]

Anyone know of tests done using ballistics gell at different distances for shot? Would at least give you an idea of penetration.

Don't know about that, but I use a tip suggested by others on forums...and while not scientific it gives a pretty fair idea...heavy metal cans.

Not the flimsy aluminum coca cola can material, but thick strong metal cans like a tuna can, cans that a few canned vegatables or soups come in...ie: campbells clam chowder cans are extremely heavy, thick, strong...I've been washing / saving tuna cans for a couple years now for just this purpose.

Plus, the bottom of a tuna can is only 4"...gives a good small target...once I pushed a 1" x 12" piece of a dry pine limb into the ground, hung the can on the stick with the bottom facing me...at 30yds my turkey load put 29 #6's through the can and snapped the stick off, driving the can & stick back a foot onto the ground...should do fine for a turkey head & neck