"Tweaking" a fowler

[Canerod]

A question for you fowler experts, if I may. I bought a .62 smoothbore this winter at a local show and it shoots great groups, however, it also shoots low. 3"@25yds, 6-7"@50yds. I've heard about "springing or otherwise tweaking the barrel to bring up the point of impact more in line with the point of aim, but I've never seen it done, so I'm a bit leery of just pulling the barrel out of the stock and looking for a good set of trees growing close together. :surrender:

What's y'all's take on it? Should I give it a go or just aim high? Are there any other options I'm not aware of? With a .600RB and .010 lubed patch over 90gr 2F, I get one ragged hole @ 25yds and still keeps 5 inside of 4" at 50, so I don't want to do anything that would cause any group change, if possible.

TIA

Canerod

 

[Gemoke]

remember with a smoothbore your rear sight is your eye to raise or lower you point of impact raise or lower your rear sight

 

[Canerod]

I did. Raised my head to the point I could see the whole top of the barrel and was still low, plus I had lost my good, repeatable cheek weld, so I started to get some R-L variance. Figured I was better to hit low and be sure of right and left, than be all over the place.

 

[Mike Brooks]

I'm a bit leery of just pulling the barrel out of the stock and looking for a good set of trees growing close together.

It sounds far more scary than it really is. It's not hard to do at all.

 

[paulab]

Don't mess with a good thing. Aim high! Paul

 

[Roy]

I'm a bit leery of just pulling the barrel out of the stock and looking for a good set of trees growing close together.

It sounds far more scary than it really is. It's not hard to do at all.

:thumbsup:
Be brave... :haha: It is a bit scary at first, but its no big deal.
I have a gun now that I have to use a 9 o'clock hold. Still haven't decided if I am going to bend it or not, guess I should put it on paper at 50yds rather than hitting clangers :haha: but if It was shooting low like yours I would bend it. :v

 

[nkmprdstr]

The guys are right, learn your point of impact and correct with a little Tennessee windage.
Bending barrels around trees, is an olde story that just shows you there was less than smart people back then too. Don't ruin a good smoothbore, they're fun.

Dick

 

[Canerod]

Roy,
Come up for rendezvous and bring the missus, that way I can have you watch and make sure I don't mess it up. I'll even through in a little barley pop to make sure you don't get too dry talking me through it.

I wouldn't mind if it was high, but hitting low makes it darn hard to see the target.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Have you measured the actual BORE Diameter of your gun? My "20 Gauge" turned out to measure .626-27" instead of the nominal .615"! Yipes, did it shoot low at 25 yds using .600 balls, and a .015" patch.

You want to be able to thumb start a PRB in any fowler, with a well lubed patch, but you don't want to see a WIDE band of crud on the patch, either. Are you reading your spent patches?? What do they tell you.

I went to a much thicker, denim patch, and bought some 19 gauge Vegetable Fiber OP wads. The velocity of my 75 grain 2Fg powder charge immediately went up almost 250 fps, and the POI rose about 8 inches at 25 yds. The Vegetable fiber Over Powder wad provided a very good SEAL to the powder charge, and proved a good addition for consistent ball placement.

I now have some .610" diameter balls to try in the gun to see if I can get better groups with the larger ball. And, I am still working with various thicknesses of patching material. My front sight can be filed down some, so that is the first thing I will do when I get the kinds of groups I like, IF they are still striking low.

Only if I can't get the groups up to the POA at 50 yds. will I consider bending the barrel. But, its a possibility. My main concern with bending a fowler barrel is the fact that it is half-octagon and half-round: I don't want the barrel to " kind" in the bending at the wedding band.

Since this is a new gun to you, check to make sure that the stock is Not warped, or the pins binding in the hangers, that hold the stock to the barrel. Years ago, I had a rifle that was shooting WAY low, then all over the place. It had a full length stock, and I found that the wood had warped almost 1/2 inch away from the muzzle, when a barrel and was removed.

I suspect, however, this is not the problem in your gun. You indicate it groups well. However, I don't know how fast you are loading and firing those rounds. Speed affects how hot the barrel can get, and how quickly it will be affected by any binding with the stock.


Do check the diameter of your bore. That is the number one source of these problems.

 

[matt denison]

If you don't want to bend your barrel then you could try this:

My very first trade gun shot great but was low just like yours. Good Ol' Bob taught me to elevate the muzzle so that I could "see" about two inches of the barrel between the breech and the sight. With practice you will memorize the sight picture and it becomes second nature. Worked for me and I didn't have to do any thing to the barrel. It's worth a try.

L. Dog

 

[Canerod]

Paul,
Bore mics .616, the .600 and .010 patch will thumb start, but it's a good, snug fit. I;d like to find a .590 or .595 mold to try, so I could use the same .015 and .018 patches I use for my rifles, but I can't complain about the groups, just where they are in relation to POA.

I'll try some OP wads and see what happens. I need to order a bunch of wads anyway, since half the reason I picked it up is to hunt limb bacon. I did try a .014 patch with the .600 ball and it was a real tight start. It didn't group any better with the tighter ball/patch combo, so I think that's headed in the wrong direction, but I may be wrong. My only smoothbore experience is my Pedersoli 12ga. double, using shot, so I'll admit I have a lot of learning to do. I'll definitely try the wad behind the ball before I take it out and try to tweak it.

Thanks :hatsoff:

 

[paulvallandigham]

TOTW sells various sized RBs, in lots of 50, so that you can try different sizes without buying a mold. Hold off on a mold until you know which diameter works best for you. I know Track sells .595 balls.

You can also contact Eddie May, who sells lead balls at a very nice price, and seems to have a lot of molds of " odd sizes". Tanner makes brass molds without sprue cutters, but they cast good balls, too, and he will make them any diameter you want. Use wire cutters to cut the sprues.

 

[Canerod]

Thanks Paul! I'll give TOTW a look.

 

[Mike Brooks]

The guys are right, learn your point of impact and correct with a little Tennessee windage.
Bending barrels around trees, is an olde story that just shows you there was less than smart people back then too. Don't ruin a good smoothbore, they're fun.

Dick

Well thanks for your opinion. I've only been building these things for 30 years....I guess I am less than smart! :rotf:
Have you ever personally seen any old fowlers? Their barrels wobble ever which way.
If you want to hit anything you need to bend your barrel, the old timers did it and so can you.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

I've bent several fowler barrels to bring the POI up to POA. I know it seems like a radical procedure but it is in fact standard procedure and most importantly, it works. For ball shooting you could raise POI by adding a tall rear sight but that does get in the way of shooting flying.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Geese Mike, in 30 years one should think you'd have caught on by now! :haha:

 

[Canerod]

Thanks Mike and CJ. I'm going to try Paul's suggestion with the OP wad first, since I need those for shooting shot anyway. If that doesn't do it, I'll take the barrel out and give it a go.

How much force will one of these take? I top two bills and don't want to screw it up laying my gut into it too much. This barrel has a pretty thick wall, it's on a TVM fowler if that helps.

I'd love one of Mike's Carolina fowlers or one of Roy's guns, but the guiding and rodmaking business is off this year. It took me three different horse trades to get into this one, so I'll focus on it this year and hope for better days ahead.

 

[Mike Brooks]

How much force will one of these take?

You'll feel it "give". That's when you want to take a look at it and decide if it's time to put it back in the stock and see where it shoots. I don't know who makes TVM's barrels.
Lots of guys make all kinds of complicated jigs and inventions to bend barrels. I have always used the crotch of a tree that is close to where ever I'm sighting in the gun at.
I find a long straight edge handy to calculate how much bending the barrel needs or how much you've adjusted it. I bend somewhere between 1/3rd and 1/2 back from the muzzle.....not rocket science. You can bend these things a loooong way before they'll kink.

 

[KHickam]

I had one that I bent. It looks a bit funny at first but I have won a few shoots with it, and taken a deer and a couple feral hogs. So, bending does work. :thumbsup:

 

[dhobbs]

Canerod,
I have shifted the POA on several smooth bore barrels and this is my method. Get a couple of 2 X 4 blocks and put on the floor. Take the barrel and place the blocks at opposite ends( the octagonal breach helps in the proper position of the barrel).....there is only 1 1/2 inches between the barrel and the floor.( so there is less chance to damage the barrel) In the "MIDDLE" of the barrel flex the barrel with the palm of both hands. By flexing in the middle of the barrel you do not end up with a strange crook in the barrel and it doesn't take much bending to shift the POI. It is not a hard process and it sure beats having to use Kentucky windage everytime you shoot......especially when shooting at a deer or in a match!

Good Luck,
David