I notice that when I wipe between shots that my loosely patched jag pushes smoke through the touch hole or nipple and the damp patch softens the fouling that is left.
Was Dutch right about wiping between shots?
- Thread starter Crawfish
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2019
- Messages
- 3,283
- Reaction score
- 5,991
I haven't read Dutch,s book but would like to know his exact method of shooting a M.L.! would someone be so kind as to post his method?
Siringo
32 Cal.
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2014
- Messages
- 331
- Reaction score
- 279
I use a blow tube on breechloaders. Using a blow tube might be worth a try. Only issue I might be concerned with is moisture buildup at the breech.
I thoroughly cleaned my barrel, scraped the breech too. Also the vent liner. When I got done, I stuck my tiny bore light into the vent hole. (Light from a night fishing bobber. To my surprise, it looked like the light was ahead of the patent breech cavity. I have enlarged my vent liner hole to 5/64.
I have the original lock on my TC, it sure may be contributing to the problem, as it eats flints. I will search for a 2nd generation lock. I’m going to continue to wipe between shots, but use the correct jag and patch.
I also live in Georgia, and high humidity is surely adding to the problem.
I’ll get it sorted out and report back.
Thank you all for the tips and advice.
I will also go back to spit patches for a time to see how effective it is.
I have the original lock on my TC, it sure may be contributing to the problem, as it eats flints. I will search for a 2nd generation lock. I’m going to continue to wipe between shots, but use the correct jag and patch.
I also live in Georgia, and high humidity is surely adding to the problem.
I’ll get it sorted out and report back.
Thank you all for the tips and advice.
I will also go back to spit patches for a time to see how effective it is.
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2021
- Messages
- 2,925
- Reaction score
- 6,242
Never been a problem for me, the little bit of moisture in your breath keeps the fouling soft.
longcruise
70 Cal.
You can purchase it here:
https://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/
May as well get it straight from the source.
The only thing different between your original lock and the upgraded lock is the hammer and frizzen. RMC-Ox Yoke has upgraded hammers and frizzens to replace your original parts. That's a lot cheaper than finding a replacement lock.
- Joined
- Dec 15, 2016
- Messages
- 1,616
- Reaction score
- 4,147
I believe a lot of issues with patent breeches could be avoided with a proper cleaning to remove all preservation oil before the shooting starts. I have found a thorough cleaning before any shooting session, helps my T/C flintlock and its ability to shoot multiple shots. I clean with Dawn dishwashing soap and water to remove any rust preventative oils. Then wipe down the bore thoroughly with rubbing alcohol, to help remove any moisture, the higher the alcohol content the better. Allow the barrel to dry and/or run a clean patchs down it to ensure any and all oil content is removed.
I did some experimenting on my own today, and I'm Excited at the results.
I wanted to test for myself the reports of being able to shoot all day, without swabbing between shots. I also hypothosised that it is less important what you moisten the patch material with, as long as it is appropriately moistened.
To test my hypothesis, I put up a five bull target at 50yds. I took an empty musket cap tin and placed 5 patches in it. Then without swabbing anything, shot a group in the center with spit moistened patches. Accuracy wasn't quite as good as my Dutch's dry patches, but close enough. The group was high and right, bud didn't want to change my sights yet.
Next was upper left, shot a group using patches moistened with my Moose Milk, similar results. The group was even higher, so moved the rear sight ten clicks down.
Next went to the upper right and shot a group with patches moistened with 50/50 Simple-Green and Alcohol, this was the best group of the day. The group was still high, so went another ten clicks down on the rear sight.
Next was bottom left, using patches moistened with 40% Dawn and 60% water. This group opened up. Not sure if it was me or the lube.
Finally, went bottom right, and shot a group using patches lubed with commercially prepared Thompson T-17 patch lube. This was clearly the worst group of the day, all over the place, and by the end of the group was starting to feel hard fowling in the bore. This quickly resolved once I moistened a couple more patches with Simple-Green/ Alcohol and shot a group off-hand at a steel spinner target.
So, analyzing the results, I conclude using moistened patches, instead of swabbing between shots works, as evidenced by 30+ shots without swabbing, no increase in loading effort, and no misfires.
I also concluded my hypothesis was correct within reason, the commercially made oil/wax lube was worst accuracy, and started to fowel after five shots, but returning to moistened patches eliminated the fowling issue. My Favorite cleaner Simple-Green and Alcohol gave best accuracy, does a phenomenal job keeping it clean and de-greased, and doesn't put any significant amounts of water in the barrel to cause rust. After shooting, the third cleaning patch came out as clean as it went in, followed by a patch dampened with Barricade.
Need to do some more testing, but am really excited about the results so-far.
I wanted to test for myself the reports of being able to shoot all day, without swabbing between shots. I also hypothosised that it is less important what you moisten the patch material with, as long as it is appropriately moistened.
To test my hypothesis, I put up a five bull target at 50yds. I took an empty musket cap tin and placed 5 patches in it. Then without swabbing anything, shot a group in the center with spit moistened patches. Accuracy wasn't quite as good as my Dutch's dry patches, but close enough. The group was high and right, bud didn't want to change my sights yet.
Next was upper left, shot a group using patches moistened with my Moose Milk, similar results. The group was even higher, so moved the rear sight ten clicks down.
Next went to the upper right and shot a group with patches moistened with 50/50 Simple-Green and Alcohol, this was the best group of the day. The group was still high, so went another ten clicks down on the rear sight.
Next was bottom left, using patches moistened with 40% Dawn and 60% water. This group opened up. Not sure if it was me or the lube.
Finally, went bottom right, and shot a group using patches lubed with commercially prepared Thompson T-17 patch lube. This was clearly the worst group of the day, all over the place, and by the end of the group was starting to feel hard fowling in the bore. This quickly resolved once I moistened a couple more patches with Simple-Green/ Alcohol and shot a group off-hand at a steel spinner target.
So, analyzing the results, I conclude using moistened patches, instead of swabbing between shots works, as evidenced by 30+ shots without swabbing, no increase in loading effort, and no misfires.
I also concluded my hypothesis was correct within reason, the commercially made oil/wax lube was worst accuracy, and started to fowel after five shots, but returning to moistened patches eliminated the fowling issue. My Favorite cleaner Simple-Green and Alcohol gave best accuracy, does a phenomenal job keeping it clean and de-greased, and doesn't put any significant amounts of water in the barrel to cause rust. After shooting, the third cleaning patch came out as clean as it went in, followed by a patch dampened with Barricade.
Need to do some more testing, but am really excited about the results so-far.
You really need to think about what you wrote.
Just when I thought that I had it all figgered out, this thread is gonna put me back to work tomorrow. Still kinda confused whether I need to spit or fart on the patches. LOL
rubbing alcohol on a patch and swab between shots simple and easy
I actually was replying off your first post and not the thread title. I should learn to read better in the mornings. All you need is the newer style cock to swap out. I need one as well but haven't put much effort into finding one.
I’ll leave that for you to worry about
longcruise
70 Cal.
You are definitely on the right track and there's never enough testing...... we'll, at least to a point.
I think if you try dawn/water at 05/95 or 10/90 you might see a big change compared to your first target.
Simple Green is something I've never tried. I've been put off of it due to the smell in a detail shop where they used it by the barrel. Maybe it's time to hold my nose and try it.
Another for you to consider is Hoppes lube.
https://shop.opticsplanet.com/hoppe...rud62_Nl3fUReqZbA4l2PSKTGZ_K2fAAqkwDbxLWZiXHM
I manage my shooting regiment in the same manner. Powder, spit patch, ball. Short start. Then, with a greased or damp patch on your range rod jag, seat your load. It lets you manage your barrel condition without slopping up your powder area. Your goal is to turn fouling into lubricant instead of baked on grit. Depending on weather conditions, you use whatever accomplishes this best. Usually in the summer, I use grease. Winter, moose milk. This is for target work, not field shooting. You’re trying to make barrel conditions the same for the 7th and 27th. You can wipe the crown of your barrel to see if you’re getting the job done. Should be nice and soft.
Woopse...
I kinda like the smell of Simple-Green, but then I never had to work with that quantity of it. The better shooters at our club have been using it mixed 50/50 with alcohol to clean/swab with. Works great, intended to switch to it exclusively, once I use up the moose milk I have made. Cheaper and easier to find than Ballistol, cleans/degreases better, dries quicker, and doesn't put significant water in the bore. Hope it works out just as well as a patch lube.
Have 1.5 bottles of Hoppe's black powder in the garage. Will give it a try also.
5-10% dawn/water sounds more reasonable, 40% was a bit slimy. May try it with alcohol also. In fact have had great luck with cheap Walmart windshield wiper fluid as a cleaner, may try that as well.You are definitely on the right track and there's never enough testing...... we'll, at least to a point.
I think if you try dawn/water at 05/95 or 10/90 you might see a big change compared to your first target.
Simple Green is something I've never tried. I've been put off of it due to the smell in a detail shop where they used it by the barrel. Maybe it's time to hold my nose and try it.
Another for you to consider is Hoppes lube.
I kinda like the smell of Simple-Green, but then I never had to work with that quantity of it. The better shooters at our club have been using it mixed 50/50 with alcohol to clean/swab with. Works great, intended to switch to it exclusively, once I use up the moose milk I have made. Cheaper and easier to find than Ballistol, cleans/degreases better, dries quicker, and doesn't put significant water in the bore. Hope it works out just as well as a patch lube.
Have 1.5 bottles of Hoppe's black powder in the garage. Will give it a try also.
Last edited:
We have about forty thousand members and God knows how many front stuffers that aren’t on the forum.
All have the best way to shoot, the best lube, best method of loading, best of cleaning. All the best. Arcane knowledge held by that shooter alone.
You’ll get your best way too
TexiKan
40 Cal.
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2005
- Messages
- 555
- Reaction score
- 169
Dutch advocated consistency in all aspects and he noted how variables tended to change the accuracy. I have friends who swear by his dry lube recommendations yet I have not been as successful. I appreciated his insight because I made some adjustments which proved to be good. Granted, not all of his information may not work for everybody but it has merit. Although I do not wipe each and every shot, I do wipe every two shots with little or no issues.
