Where to lube C&B

[ian45662]

Does it matter if I put my bullet lube between the filler and the round ball or should it go on top of the round ball?

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Ian,

This one I have no experience with, so I'll encourage others who do use fillers to answer. I know that R.M. uses fillers, as well as some others, but he's the first person that came to mind.

Dave

 

[R.M.]

Because I shoot mostly at an indoor range with benches, informally, what I do is powder, card wad, filler, lubed wad, and ball. I probably don't need the card wad to separate the powder and filler, but what the hey.

 

[ozark57]

On top of the ball. Fill in the top of the chambers smooth. Crisco will work fine in all but the hotest weather.

 

[arcticap]

Lube "pills" or "cookies" are placed under the ball but they only have a semi-soft consistency verses traditional bullet lube like Crisco or Bore Butter which are truely soft.
Lube pills have various combinations of ingredients to make their consistency harder that often include beeswax and/or one of the paraffin waxes, olive oil, mutton tallow or Crisco in various percentages. They can be molded into a shape to fit inside the chamber and for ease of handling. Sometimes they flame as they exit the barrel but they usually do melt and effectively coat the bore, arbor and cylinder so fouling doesn't stick as much.
The harder lube pills usually are placed over wool wads but the mix can also be melted onto wool wads to coat them with it too. This can make the wads into much more effective bore scrubbers.
Lube pills aren't intended to be placed over the ball. Their purpose is primarily for lubricating and keeping the fouling soft and not for sealing the chambers against chain fires.
But lube pills are considerably less messy than many bullet lubes, and they can used with the more economical card & fiber wads too.

 

[ian45662]

So by putting lube under the round ball instead of on top of the ball will not cause leading?

 

[napolean]

My take is, leading will probably not be a problem at BP velocities in a revolver. If you load "hot" maybe the rifling will strip some lead from the pure lead ball, but accuracy will suffer.
I feel the function of any lube used is mainly to help keep the fouling soft. Secondly, to seal the chamber from chain fires and moisture. The lube being above or below the ball will still lube the bore in front of a bullet.
Jon

 

[pargent]

I shoot alot of cap & ball, sometimes 40 shots in a match,I do not clean my revolver during a match but I do wipe it over externaly. I load powder ,filler(if Iam using it ),wonder wad , ball & then a light smear of TC bore butter or crisco.I have never had gun bind up & cleaning is a brease with hot soapy water. :thumbsup:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Thanks Bob-I knew you'd come through!

 

[token tory]

I use the ball/lubed wad/powder (no filler). I think that there is always a small amount of the pre-soaked wad's lube left behind. I'm guessing this is what lubes the next round, which in turn, leaves a residue of lube for the next & so on.

I've found that by using a lubed wad directly over the powder makes it much easier to load if you don't have a loading stand as it serves as a temporary stopper when you lay the pistol down to work on the next step of loading. It doesn't seem to have any negative effects that I've found yet at least.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

So by putting lube under the round ball instead of on top of the ball will not cause leading?

As others have said, leading shouldn't be much of an issue at MOST Cap & Ball revolver velocities. Here's an example from last Sunday: Using my son's Uberti 1860 Army with 27 grains of 3Fg Goex, a custom-lubed wonder-wad, and a .454 Hornady ball. The revolver was extremely tight out-of-the-box, and has proven to be a real tack-driver out to 50 yards!

By "custom-lubed", I'm referring to taking some wonder-wads that I store in a 35mm film can, and getting-out the tube of wonder lube and using one of them I rub additional lube on each one to fully coat one side of the wad with additional lube. These "custom-lubed" wonder-wads are specifically treated so that additional lube winds up in the revolver upon every ignition. The wads are placed into the chambers with the "wet-side" facing up to the balls, so as to not contaminate the powder charge! No leading at all occurs since additional lube is deposited with every ignition. During almost 35 shots fired, not a single problem with the revolver turning, and it cleaned-up really well too! Just hot water & Butch's Black Powder Bore Shine and a few patches and the bore was clean, without any leading visible! No need to use a bore brush!

In case you're asking, I've been adding additional lube to the wads for years--but only in the colder months when we have lower humidity.

Dave

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

I use the ball/lubed wad/powder (no filler). I think that there is always a small amount of the pre-soaked wad's lube left behind. I'm guessing this is what lubes the next round, which in turn, leaves a residue of lube for the next & so on.

I've found that by using a lubed wad directly over the powder makes it much easier to load if you don't have a loading stand as it serves as a temporary stopper when you lay the pistol down to work on the next step of loading. It doesn't seem to have any negative effects that I've found yet at least.

Exactly! You've hit the nail on the head!!

In addition, when it gets a little windy, those wonder-wads act like wind shields, even if using a pistol loading stand! Wind is one of the key factors to overcome. In the loading sequence that my son and I use, we've been able to win competitions in a gusting & pouring rain storm while underneath a pop-up tent: Powder, Wad, Ball, then turn & ram into the chamber. Then leave the rammer in the same chamber I just loaded (to avoid cylinder turning), and then repeat! We never put just one part of the equation into the chambers, (such as the loose powder) then turn the cylinder and come back to the first chamber and add the next component. Consistency breeds accuracy, and I like to do as much as I can to eliminate variables!

Dave

 

[token tory]

Another trick learned, Thanks. :bow:
(I'd never thought of using the ramrod as a cylinder lock.) :redface:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

You're welcome :thumbsup: .

It's just so much easier that way! And none of the powder spills or gets blown out of the chambers that way. With a good loading stand (that holds the entire assembled revolver), you can load pretty quick, and watch how far the rammer seats each ball in every chamber, using both sight and the "feel" of the loading lever.

If you want a look at the stands our League Chairman makes, give me a PT with your email. I'll email photos so you can see what I'm talking about.

Dave

 

[token tory]

I wasn't planning on getting a reloading stand. That's why its SO handy to not have the mouths of the chambers open any longer than needed. :haha:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

:thumbsup: That works for me!

 

[CaptainKirk]

Just curious....why would you want to use filler? Reduced load?
I've fired as few as 20 grains Pyrodex P out of my .44's with Crisco on top of the ball; nothing under it, with no ill effect other than making a bit more of a mess from more Crisco in the cylinder bores (Topped off to end).

 

[zimmerstutzen]

The idea of the lube on top the ball, vs a lube wad under the ball, is more a matter of personal preference for most folks. I prefer the lube on top. Grease the bore before the lead or powder fouling touches the bore. Helps the ball slide out (Slightly) helps keep the fouling soft so it clears out easier when the next shot is fired. From an accuracy standpoint. If dealing with a good shooter and a well tuned gun, the lube on top is probably ever so slightly better.

 

[mykeal]

Just curious....why would you want to use filler? Reduced load?
I've fired as few as 20 grains Pyrodex P out of my .44's with Crisco on top of the ball; nothing under it, with no ill effect other than making a bit more of a mess from more Crisco in the cylinder bores (Topped off to end).

Some people (and I'll say right at the front that I don't personally agree or disagree with this) feel that having the ball closer to the forcing cone increases accuracy. So, when shooting reduced loads they use filler to accomplish that. The theory does have merit, as many people who compete seriously with bp revolvers do it religiously. Me, I can't see a difference, but there's other reasons for that.

As for shooting reduced loads - I AM sure that the most accurate load in any bp revolver is NOT a full chamber, so any time you want to have some confidence that you are in charge of where the ball is going you're going to be shooting with less than a full chamber.

 

[Curt LaManna]

I shoot the C&B pistol matches every month I can make it to the local range. I don't use any lube over the ball anymore. I have found that with the Colt Dragoons and Navy models that the guns shot much more accurately without the lube on top of the ball. I can run a brush down the bore after each 6 shots and still keep the bore clean.
I use Pyrodex P or 3F GoEx for powder. Lubed OxYoke felt wad and the oversize ball. I don't use filler.
The other drawback to adding the grease was that the pistols got much more dirty faster than without.
This is at lease my experience.
JMHO...