Which Cap And Ball Platform, Is the Most Imherently Accurate?

[BullRunBear]

You folks almost got me going on a hunt for an R&S. But I already have plenty of repro Colt and Remington cap and ball revolvers that are more accurate than I am. Still, the conversation is enjoyable.

I wonder if the original Rogers and Spencer revolvers were better made than the Colts and Rems of the time or if it's just the repros (Euroarms?) that were better.

Jeff

 

[nkbj]

Yall have me wanting to sit on the front porch and bounce cans.

 

[Kansas Jake]

One of the local venders who has been to a couple of the local guns shows I attended recently had an original R&S that looked to have been used very little if at all. I got to handle and drool on it, but unfortunately didn't have funds for the asking price. I think he was asking north of $2000 for it.

 

[Zonie]

You should have bought it at $2000.

Flayderman's Guide (©2007) says an original Spiller and Burr Revolver in "Fair" condition was worth $17,500 and in "Very Good" condition it was worth $40,000.

In 2019 dollars that would be $22,093 and $50,500, not taking collectors value changes into account.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Zonie, it was a Rogers & Spencer. I really don't know what it was worth. One thing interesting was the "blueing" was sort of a flat blue rather than a polished bright blue.

 

[Zonie]

Sorry about that. My screw up.

Flayderman's Guide says a military marked Rodgers & Spencer in 2007 was worth $1750 in Very Good condition and $4250 in Excellent condition.
The civilian or unmarked R&S was worth $1500 in very good condition and $3500 in Excellent condition.

I don't know why the high price I saw listed didn't trigger something in my mind that said, "That can't be right." Dah.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

By “cap and ball” platform, that could also mean the single shots as they take both a cap and yet also too, a ball. Probably the most accurate would be the LePage:

 

[dave951]

Of the revolvers, R&S then 1858 Remington, then the rest far behind. Avoid anything brass framed like it had leprosy. Brass frames look cool but are bottom of the pile for accuracy and durability.

 

[ppg1949]

I am fortunate enough to own a replica R&S. My brother bought it because he read it was the best black powder pistol design ever. My brother never liked BP so I guess he must have thought it would be like shooting a cartridge gun. He was mistaken and now I have it. Nearly mint and a nice shooter. Better than my Rems and Colts but I like the Colts.

 

[saaman]

To me the advantage of the Rogers & Spencer is the collar on the cylinder that helps prevent fouling on the base pin. I have had great accuracy out of my Euroarms version out to 100 meters knocking down iron pigs at the NRA Whittington Center. That being said I have had the same results with the second generation Colt 1860 Army as well as Ubertis.

 

[Grenadier1758]

As we are looking at the inherent accuracy of cap and ball revolvers, I realized that I will have to do some tests on my recently acquired 1858 New Army Remington by Euroarms. I recently bought it at a gun show. Its interesting in that it appears to be unfired and it has what appear to be factory fitted target sights. There is no evidence of ever having caps fired on the nipples. More on the nipples later.

When I investigated further, I saw it was proofed in 1974. I had seen that the cylinders and barrel were clean. But when I got out my calipers to measure the cylinder diameter, I noticed that the chamber mouth was rebated.

The mouth measures 0.457" and the chamber measures 0.440". The bore is 0.447".

I am getting excited to see how this revolver shoots.

I may have gotten more gun than I thought I did.

 

[arcticap]

One of the reasons why the Ruger Old Army is considered to be one of the most accurate revolvers out of the box
is due to it having a groove diameter is .451, a chamber diameter of .453 with a recommended ball diameter of .457.
Its bore diameter [at the lands] has been reported to be ..443.

 

[nkbj]

I received a notification concerning this topic that a previous post was deleted.
The offensive post was one where I stated that I had received a new .36 Remington and that I was tempted to have it rebored to use .44 Special type molds and also round ball.
I have done this in the past with a .36 Remington to convert it into a .41 percussion revolver with success. And I have discussed it on this forum without censorship. I regret that the idea of making one a ".44" would provide the censor de jour such angst.

 

[hawkeye2]

I cannot understand why a post on reboring to a larger caliber would be deleted. The conversion is perfectly safe as the frame and cylinder are identical in size to the .44 Remingtons in reproductions (not the originals). Also the idea of using modern bullets in C&B revolvers has been discussed here before. As an aside I'm seriously thinking of converting a '51 Navy to .41.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I suspect the post was misread as converting it to cartridge. I saw the post before it was remove and had to re read it to realize it was to us a bullet as a cap and ball and not a cartridge conversion.

 

[arcticap]

Here's an interesting MLF thread about ROA .cap & ball revolvers that have been converted from .45 to .36 for competition and which have
won at least one national championship at Friendship.--->>> https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/roa-36-cal.93053/

It's as accurate of a platform as a competition revolver can be.

 

[nkbj]

I suspect you're right Kansas Jake.
I probably should have been clearer with my prose.

 

[Grenadier1758]

My 36 caliber Remington revolvers are based on a smaller frame than the 44 caliber Remington.

I'm not sure I would want to enlarge my Navy revolver to take a 0.430" diameter bullet even if it were cast on soft lead.

 

[Zonie]

I suspect you're right Kansas Jake.
I probably should have been clearer with my prose.

Yes, it was deleted by mistake by me.
When I read it you didn't say you were modifying it for a .44 Special bullet and I read it as saying you were modifying it for a .44 Special cartridge.
My apologies to you.

 

[hawkeye2]

My 36 caliber Remington revolvers are based on a smaller frame than the 44 caliber Remington.

You must have a Euroarms as they were built on the correct size frame. I understand Uberti built a correct sized .36 years ago and now builds them using the .44 platform as does Pietta. My wife shot a .36 Pietta back in the early 90's but moved over to the .44 Uberti I got her. It was actually lighter than the pietta.