Who only uses OS Cards?

[CoyoteJoe]

Iron Jim, you don't actually have to weigh wads, just employ a bit of common sense. You surely know that even the smallest shotgun pellets will fly well over 100 yards before dropping to earth.
Have you ever seen a wad fly that far? Of course not. Even the smallest shotgun pellet, poor aerodynamic form that it is, is still much more aerodynamic than even a heavily soaked fiber filler wad. The wads drop behind the pellets as soon as they exit the muzzle and meet air resistance. My point was that even your overshot cards weigh more than a single pellet of #7 1/2 or #8 shot. But that still works fine doesn't it? That's because it ain't about weight. :wink:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Based on my more limited experience trying modern plastic shotcups in my 12 ga. shotgun I think the problem with them is that they are actually 13 gauge wads, and not 12 gauge. Being smaller, they allow the petals to open, and slump backwards, exposing some of the shot to the barrel. Since they don't hold the shot tighter, you get no real benefit using them. They do tighten patterns in modern guns, however.

If they made 11 ga. plastic cups or 19 gauge plastic cups, we might see improvement in patterns in our ML shotguns. Because they are not made, I can only speculate and wish.

You might see a bit of improvement in the Shape of the pattern, because the plastic cup protects the shot from rubbing against the bore and getting flats on the outside pellets. That should, at least in theory, make for rounder, more uniform patterns, with maybe a few more pellets in the pattern. Whether a particular gun actually shows any regular improvement would depend on the gun, how its cleaned and loaded, etc.

 

[Iron Jim Rackham]

It's interesting Coyote, but I don't shoot anything smaller than #6. I had some 7 1/2 that worked ok at short range, but I use 6 for most hunting. Paul suggested #5's and that works even better beyond 35 yards.

 

[AkDan]

Are you getting patterns out to 35yds with a cyl bore smoothbore? If so where in sam heck can I get one shoot. I thought my 25 yard patterns were good, till 2 seperate birds didnt die, one didnt even move when my mod barrel actually DID fire. The second didnt wait around, either way I was shocked not to see a dead bird.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I have killed pheasants out to 35 yards using #5 shot in a 12 gauge DB shotgun. It is cylinder bore. I load 2 3/4 drams of FFg powder, a 1/8" over powder wad, a 1/2" cushion wad, soaked in Moosemilk, and squeezed out before loading, 1 1/4 oz of #5 shot, and a OS card on top.

I think the light powder charge with this load of shot helps make the tighter patterns out there. The shot was witnessed by an experience hunter, who was way over on my left, but down in front of me as I was coming around to cover his right flank when he got the bird up, missed it, and it headed over toward me. I called it at about 30 yards. He said it was every inch of 35 yards. I am not sure he was measuring where the bird landed, or where I hit it. I knew the shot would kill at that distance, but I was not sure how much of a pattern I would have at that distance. I think we pulled 7 pellets out of the breast, back, and neck of that bird.I have not yet tried Jim Rackham's recommended use of OS cards only in this gun with that load. That is on the agenda for this Fall.

 

[Dave K]

It is not uncommon at all, to get doves at that range for me. It is a fairly regular occurance. 1oz. 7 1/2's, 2 3/4 dr. 2F. Usual gun is the 14ga, but I use the same load in the 12ga.The 20ga. is 7/8oz. of 7 1/2's and 2 1/2 dr. of 2f. All guns get the same pattern of OP card,1/4" thick fiber cushion-soaked and drained of virgin olive oil, OS card on top.Many people seem to think the more powder the merrier. Well, there is a little truth in that, because you have more velocity which eguals more energy. But it also gives poorer patterns. I would rather hit my targets with multiple pellets, then miss them with all those faster pellets.

 

[Iron Jim Rackham]

I was using a full jug choked gun with a load of 3 drams of FFG and 1 1/4 ounces of shot. As incredible as it sounds, I took a crow on the wing at 50 yards. It didn't kill him outright, but did bring him down. I have taken many pheasants at 40 yards with the same load.

I will concede that the reasons I assign to the performance of just overshot cards may be mistaken, but the performance itself is outstanding. All I can say is try it and see if it works as well in your gun. Several years ago I used the same load in a Ravenshear Long Land musket which was cylinder bore, and it performed very effectively on clays beyond 35 yards.

 

[AJFedak]

My turn, as I spend many hours each week at the skeet range I can tell you for certain that I have found OS cards out as far as 15 yards from the station I am shooting. Also have found "pieces" of cushion wad (lubed 3/8 Alcan) laying there. I keep reminding the guys that this "paper junk" is bio-degradable unlike thier "plastic" shot cups.

Skeet load:
2 7/8 drams 3fff
1- 0.70" over-powder card
1- 3/8 lubed cushion wad
1- 11 gauge OS card
1- oz. #9's
1- 11 gauge OS cards bottom barrel
2- 11 gauge OS cards top barrel
Gun: Beretta O/U
Results: smoke'm

A few years back I read an article where shot pellets were painted different colors and stacked in a shot gun shell in layers. Using a high speed camera, the shot cloud was filmed. It was determined that the shot column would turn inside-out and their reasoning was the friction of the extreme outside pellets rubbing against the sides of the barrel.

Patterns from smooth bores will suffer the same condition. The lead pellets rubbing against the barrel will deform more rapidly therefore causing "fliers". This is great for skeet because of the close range shooting, a potential problem with longer ranges.

Just for a visual try[url] http://www.rit.edu/~andpph/exhibit-shotgun-blast.html[/url]
Granted this isn't exactly what we are discussing be still is informative.

 

]A few years back I read an article where shot pellets were painted different colors and stacked in a shot gun shell in layers. Using a high speed camera, the shot cloud was filmed. It was determined that the shot column would turn inside-out and their reasoning was the friction of the extreme outside pellets rubbing against the sides of the barrel.
.

How would they rub against the barrel inside a plastic shot cup?

 

[AJFedak]

As the shot column width expands on initial firing the pellet tend to become pressed into the soft shotcup. The center portion is free to do its thing. Ever pickup a used shotcup. No, they don't actually rub the barrel but they are held more securely by the sides.

 

[Leatherbark]

Some of the tightest patterning loads I ever shot was Winchester Super X 3-3/4 dram, 1-1/4 oz loads.......The factory was still using fiber wads in that load along with shot wrapper into the nineties and maybe still yet.......I wonder if their fiber wads shoot through the shot?.................Bob

 

[Tinker2]

I shoot two OS cards over my powder and one over my shot
in my 20 and 28 gage trap guns. Works great for me.


Tinker2

 

[stan]

First of all, let me say that I am new at this. I just bought my first muzzle loading shotgun and it sould be here this weekend. I've been reading all I can about the different loads y'all use, and I appreciate all the info. I want to try and keep my shooting as simple as possible. So my question is when you talk about putting 2-4 OS cards over powder and 1 or 2 over shot are you talking about the .070 card or the .025 card? I plan on ordering some from Circle Fly this week.

 

[Rebel]

The Thin overshot wads.

 

[paulvallandigham]

The thin overshot cards. I thought they measure .010, but if they are thicker than that, okay. They look like they are cut from shirt backs, because they have a hard white polished surface on both sides of the thin cardboard. Circle flys sells them in bags of 500 and 1000. Make sure you measure the bore diameter of your barrel BEFORE you order the cards. My 20 ga. gun is overbored, about .623" instead of the standard .615". I had to order 19 gauge cards to get a good snug fit in the barrel. Its not a problem, as Circle Fly has them in lots of odd gauges. But don't get your cart before the horse. Wait until the gun arrives, or, if the gun is being made by someone, then call and ask him to measure your bore with calipers and tell you the EXACT diameter of that bore, so you can order the card wads before you get the gun.